ness Posted May 24, 2012 Author Share Posted May 24, 2012 Kenz isn't to bad with the confinement - she has been through 4 weeks for her shoulder of crate rest already. She did start tail chasing last time. I know we will cope although I do feel bad for her none the less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coogie Posted May 25, 2012 Share Posted May 25, 2012 Ness, only just saw this - really hope she is feeling better. Issy had about 7 weeks of confinement after her patella surgery, but we had to give up on the crate as she destroyed it in the third week and was hurting herself. Issy is having cartophen shots once a month - they do seem to help her. Good luck - will be thinking of you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ness Posted May 26, 2012 Author Share Posted May 26, 2012 (edited) Kenz is bored out of her brain and I could use a full night sleep I am a little worried she is really stiff and seems to be limping more as time goes in. I am presuming it's just her stiffening up with crate rest though. She hasn't done anything that would have upset the surgery. Edited May 26, 2012 by ness Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ness Posted May 26, 2012 Author Share Posted May 26, 2012 (edited) Hmmm took her out for her before bed toilet stop. Carried her out from the crate to the lawn. Put her down and she has no weight on the surgery leg at all. Confused as she has been crated and supervised virtually all day. By the end of her short toilet stop she is putting a little weight back on it. Argh I don't know whether to worry and email the specialist or not. Did other people find the longer the crate rest went on the stiffer the leg became. Edited May 26, 2012 by ness Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted May 26, 2012 Share Posted May 26, 2012 Mitch didn't ever have crate rest ..he just was watched,happy to have his servants, and made himself comfortable .. he was heavily bandaged , and did touch foot to ground. I didn't notice any stiffness . Is teh crate big enough for her to stretch/curl, turn over without that foot hitting wire? is there plenty of deep padding to accomodate her hip comfortably? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ness Posted May 26, 2012 Author Share Posted May 26, 2012 She is a small border and in a 36" soft crate or a 36" vari depending if she is loosley supervised or not. Mostly she is in the soft crate though. I have only just started crating her more as she is feeling better so would rather be outside barking at things given half a chance so crating removes the risk. Would have thought the crates are big enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ness Posted May 26, 2012 Author Share Posted May 26, 2012 Oops and yep plenty of soft bedding in all of them :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted May 26, 2012 Share Posted May 26, 2012 Would have thought the crates are big enough. :0 I have no idea of measurements , sorry ...I just peep at the dog when it's lying down ..and see what's touching where ...or if there are odd angles in joints because of bandaging/straight legs ..... You will all be glad when it's over :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ness Posted May 26, 2012 Author Share Posted May 26, 2012 Lol no the soft crate seems roomy enough she certainly has room to stretch out fully if she wanted. Mostly she sleeps tucked in a little ball though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ncarter Posted May 27, 2012 Share Posted May 27, 2012 (edited) hey ness, im looking at doing the patella surgery on my boy sometime this year. I will have to ask the vet but have you researched the pro's and cons of doing both patella's at the same time? I dont think we could stand 12 weeks strict rest. With toileting i think no 1 might be manageable but no 2's might be a too hard as they like to crouch down and bend. Edited May 27, 2012 by ncarter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ness Posted May 27, 2012 Author Share Posted May 27, 2012 Kenz seems to only have the problem on the one side so I don't need to worry about doing them both at the same time. I have read information re that though and if you have a small dog I can think it might be much more manageable to do them both. I have come across information with people having them both done at the same time without to many issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gillbear Posted May 28, 2012 Share Posted May 28, 2012 hey ness, im looking at doing the patella surgery on my boy sometime this year. I will have to ask the vet but have you researched the pro's and cons of doing both patella's at the same time? I dont think we could stand 12 weeks strict rest. With toileting i think no 1 might be manageable but no 2's might be a too hard as they like to crouch down and bend. I am currently going through this journey with a foster chihuahua. Diagnosed with bilateral grade 3 patellas at 6 months then the owner was going to euthanase. After desexing and her first knee done on Thursday she is not a very happy chappy. Vet wouldnt do 2 together even though she is very small, after seeing her limited use of the leg in this early stage it was the right decision. Thankfully as a littley I have set up a large crate which also fits in a petloo, so toileting isnt a problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mason_Gibbs Posted May 28, 2012 Share Posted May 28, 2012 hey ness, im looking at doing the patella surgery on my boy sometime this year. I will have to ask the vet but have you researched the pro's and cons of doing both patella's at the same time? I dont think we could stand 12 weeks strict rest. With toileting i think no 1 might be manageable but no 2's might be a too hard as they like to crouch down and bend. Nic did u go and see a specialist? I remember you thinking about it awhile back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ncarter Posted May 28, 2012 Share Posted May 28, 2012 (edited) no i havent yet mason. I cant really afford it at the moment. Am worried the specialist would charge more really, what were they like price wise compared to a normal vet?. Do you definitely need a referral letter from your local vet to see one of the vets at rivergum? I got quoted a $1800 per knee doing them separately and i think that is pretty good value. I would have to board my other dog as well as im sure she would drive him nuts and try to play with him all the time. Its a bit hard as i have recently given him a full course of zydax and stopped all hard running and he is gaiting normally and not showing any symptoms Edited May 28, 2012 by ncarter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ness Posted May 28, 2012 Author Share Posted May 28, 2012 (edited) Nic I was quoted between $2500 and $2800 for Kenz and she was done at the specialist. I know people who have had little dogs done at normal vet clinics for less. RosieFT posted the consult price for Rivergum which was $145 (or thereabouts) . That price is similar to what I paid for a first consult at the specialists here. I have 2 dogs its a matter of managing it and crating or otherwise separating them. I have been told to at least count on 4 months back to normal activity but I have read it can take as much as 6 months. Not sure you would really want to be boarding a dog for that length of time. The strict rest phase seems to be 6-8 weeks (and Kenz had no bone cut so we don't have any bone healing to occur). Do you know what grade his knees were? Kenz's started out a grade 2 and borderline for surgery but deteriorated over the course of 2 months to a high grade 2. Given all I wanted to do with her there was no real question that surgery was inevitable and I was just delaying things by holding off. Grade 2 doesn't always need surgery and lots of little dogs live with the occasional skip. The specialist said the decision was in my hands and it was more the impact it was having on Kenz and given all I wanted to do with her. If she was a couch potato then I probably wouldn't have and we would just have continued on as we were. Edited May 28, 2012 by ness Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mason_Gibbs Posted May 28, 2012 Share Posted May 28, 2012 no i havent yet mason. I cant really afford it at the moment. Am worried the specialist would charge more really, what were they like price wise compared to a normal vet?. Do you definitely need a referral letter from your local vet to see one of the vets at rivergum? I got quoted a $1800 per knee doing them separately and i think that is pretty good value. I would have to board my other dog as well as im sure she would drive him nuts and try to play with him all the time. Its a bit hard as i have recently given him a full course of zydax and stopped all hard running and he is gaiting normally and not showing any symptoms I paid $2800 for Gibbs surgery but it was a big op, they removed a section of his ulna( to shorten it) and then cleaned up inside his elbow joint. Their prices regarding X-rays, medications etc have been the same price as my vet so far, sometimes less. RosieFT was quoted $1000 at her vet for X-rays , Rivergum wanted around $400 so IMO I think they are actually reasonable. Not sure about the consult, we were referred because it was a complex surgery but to be honest I wouldn't let a normal vet perform ortho surgery on my dog even if it was simple as the surgeons are just so much more talented in that department. I know money is always an issue, I stressed about how to pay for Gibbs and ended up increasing my credit card limit as it was maxed out as it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ness Posted May 28, 2012 Author Share Posted May 28, 2012 MG its my understanding that luxating patella surgery is a little different - I gather its a somewhat more routine surgery then something like Gibbs had. Nic I'd probably have a consult but go in with the view that your not in a rush for surgery. Kenz's specialist said to me its one of those surgery decisions that you can take time over. I was still wanting to see where her shoulder was going before rushing into surgery on the patella anyway so I sat on it a couple of months. I was also told it could be something she could live with for a number of years and for it to remain stable and as long as it wasn't impacting on her on her life then I could very well leave it indefinitely. Kenz had 2 consults specifically to discuss the patella surgery (one when it was originally diagnosed and another one the week before the surgery) plus a number of emails with the specialist over the intervening time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ncarter Posted May 28, 2012 Share Posted May 28, 2012 (edited) I have 2 dogs its a matter of managing it and crating or otherwise separating them. I have been told to at least count on 4 months back to normal activity but I have read it can take as much as 6 months. Not sure you would really want to be boarding a dog for that length of time. The strict rest phase seems to be 6-8 weeks (and Kenz had no bone cut so we don't have any bone healing to occur). Do you know what grade his knees were? Kenz's started out a grade 2 and borderline for surgery but deteriorated over the course of 2 months to a high grade 2. Given all I wanted to do with her there was no real question that surgery was inevitable and I was just delaying things by holding off. Grade 2 doesn't always need surgery and lots of little dogs live with the occasional skip. The specialist said the decision was in my hands and it was more the impact it was having on Kenz and given all I wanted to do with her. If she was a couch potato then I probably wouldn't have and we would just have continued on as we were. Thanks for that ness. I would just prefer the bitch to be staying with someone else so he could get 4-6 weeks of peace. Dont think she would like being outside by herself while he is crated inside. The vet said he has grade 3 PL, but am a little unsure as she seemed to have to use a lot of pressure to luxate the patella. She also put pressure on me to have the surgery ASAP, without asking me about how it is effecting his quality of life, how his gait was etc so was a bit put off. This all started as a result of an injury where he slipped on wet grass and hurt his right knee. And he has favoured the right leg when he has had too much running in the past and am no expert at reading x-rays but the right knee looks worse on the x-rays. Anyway i will have to get another set of x-rays done at the specialist and ask them to compare them to the ones i had done previously. Edited May 28, 2012 by ncarter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ness Posted May 28, 2012 Author Share Posted May 28, 2012 (edited) Grade 3 is the patella is more out then it is in and requires surgery (well its strongly recommended) - well so much as my unexpert reading on the subject is. I am not sure why you would need x-rays to diagnose a luxating patella. Kenz's was picked up by the chiro vet and it was relatively subtle. She was back to the specialist within 3 days and the specialist was able to cause the patella to luxate when he applied pressure. When I took her back 2 months later he was able to luxate it much more easily. He seemed to have a reasonable understanding by feel of how deep the groove was and didn't feel he would need to deepen it (although said he couldn't confirm exactly what he needed to do until she was under and he could see). I guess an x-ray may pick up arthritic changes already present in the knee but I wouldn't have thought they were required for making a decision as to whether you would opt for surgery. I know if they have to end up cutting bone an xray might be of value but I would guess thats at the yep we are going ahead with surgery decision not at the "diagnostic" step version. I certainly wouldn't be rushing to another set of xrays - maybe a consult with a specialist to discuss and then see what there view is based on what they can feel. Edited May 28, 2012 by ness Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ness Posted May 28, 2012 Author Share Posted May 28, 2012 Oh and the other thing is ask as many questions as you need in order to feel comfortable with your decision. I was very scared about the post surgery time because Kenz is normally on the go all day and is very energetic. So far we are just over 2 and a bit weeks post surgery and she isn't doing badly. She is somewhat else to her routine and so long as she gets out for a little bit each day we are coping ok. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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