bordacollies4me Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 (edited) Ok so looks like we are expecting a singleton litter in 2 weeks, was an AI with Frozen Semen... Specialist vet is adamant that a cesarean will need to be done and wants to do this at a set date if my girl is in actual labour or not, his reasons being that nearly all single litters never come into labour properly and then the pup could/would die, he of course also wants to do the procedure as he was the one to do the AI- this i fully understand, but it is a 2 1/2 hr drive away, and i am always careful about keeping my girls as stress free in the last week of the pregnancy, especially around the due date...Just so you know, this girl has had 3 litters in the past(11,9,10) and has whelped the litters with no problems, Just wondering what others have done when they know they are expecting just one... Edited March 19, 2012 by bordacollies4me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dragonwoman Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 Ok so looks like we are expecting a singleton litter in 2 weeks, was an AI with Frozen Semen... Specialist vet is adamant that a cesarean will need to be done and wants to do this at a set date if my girl is in actual labour or not, his reasons being that nearly all single litters never come into labour properly and then the pup could/would die, he of course also wants to do the procedure as he was the one to do the AI- this i fully understand, but it is a 2 1/2 hr drive away, and i am always careful about keeping my girls as stress free in the last week of the pregnancy, especially around the due date...Just so you know, this girl has had 3 litters in the past(11,9,10) and has whelped the litters with no problems, Just wondering what others have done when they know they are expecting just one... Take the advice!!! Pups trigger hormone which starts and sustains labour, one pup may not do it, as you have been advised It may be a large whelp as well and it may not come through delivery all that safely. Better a planned, safe conclusion than a midnight dash with awful outcome, I know which would stress my girls more. Might be different if you were only 15 minutes from vet. Vet knows due date and there will be more stress on you than the bitch. Although frozen semen can produce good sized litters, I think it is a calculated risk we take when using it. Been there, done that, elective caesar for one pup, but she is gorgeous!!! Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ashaflynn Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 Are you 2 1/2 hours away from a vet? or just 2 1/2 hours away from the vet that did the AI? If you have a vet near you I would be opting for giving her the chance to go into labour but also having a closer vet on standby in case required. I would also be getting an Xray done the week she is due to try and guage a rough idea on the size of the pup - if it looks normal size then no reason why she shouldn't be given the opportunity to try and have a natural whelp - especially as she is an experienced bitch. I have a girl that has had three litters and each one was a singleton litter. She has managed to have normal problem free whelps with each of them but I did always have a vet on standby and made sure an Xray was done to check the size. I understand the reasoning behind your vet wanting her to have the elective but I think there is a tendency to step in and intervene too early and sometimes unecessarily in these things. Mother nature is a wonderful and amazing thing but yes, there is always a risk - there is also always a risk with surgery too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bordacollies4me Posted March 5, 2012 Author Share Posted March 5, 2012 i have my normal vet 15min away, yep i know there is a risk in not electing to do a Cesar, but also i do not like to put my dogs through unnecessary surgery as yep there is risk in that too... Yes its been a long road in getting just one pup and that too is why the specialist thought i should not risk anything... Just needed to hear others experiences and thoughts, but i do know every dog is different and she may or may not need some help delivering... Thanks... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leema Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 (edited) Talk to breeders in your breed. Have they had singletons? Were they delivered naturally? Some breeds are known to do okay with little litters, some breed are known to need help. Talk to breeders about your breed's experience with c-sections, too. Do they recover well or are they likely to disown puppies? Have an x-ray done at 45 days or later. This will confirm that there is only one fetus (as ultrasounds are inaccurate). If there's more than one fetus, problem solved. If there is one puppy on the x-ray, how big it is? Does it look like your bitch could pass it naturally? (Singletons are known to grow big.) If it's too big, problem solved, you'll have a c-section. If there's only one puppy, that looks like a normal size, then that gets tricky. It's a decision best made with consultation with others in your breed, and working out what you think would work best for your bitch. Edited March 5, 2012 by Leema Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aziah Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 Ok so looks like we are expecting a singleton litter in 2 weeks, was an AI with Frozen Semen... Specialist vet is adamant that a cesarean will need to be done and wants to do this at a set date if my girl is in actual labour or not, his reasons being that nearly all single litters never come into labour properly and then the pup could/would die, he of course also wants to do the procedure as he was the one to do the AI- this i fully understand, but it is a 2 1/2 hr drive away, and i am always careful about keeping my girls as stress free in the last week of the pregnancy, especially around the due date...Just so you know, this girl has had 3 litters in the past(11,9,10) and has whelped the litters with no problems, Just wondering what others have done when they know they are expecting just one... No question - you've just spent all that time and effort on doing a frozen insemination and you have one baby... I'd do the c-section. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nedsur Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 We had a singleton and elected to do a c-section as soon as her temp dropped. Don't regret it at all. The sire of this pup was a singleton also and he did have trouble coming out the birth canal and had to be rushed to the vet to get him out. We are lucky though and our local vet is only 5 minutes away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenties Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 I have a Singleton Puppy here he is almost 3 mths now, he was a natural delivery and to be honest the thought of problems never even crossed my mind :D you have to take into account that sometimes C-sections can kill the whelps as well, i would rather go natural if you have done your homework with this breeding you will have an idea if there is any possibility of any problems popping up... but in the end its up to you, your money and all that.... ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bordacollies4me Posted March 6, 2012 Author Share Posted March 6, 2012 thanks to all who have replied... in my breed there are some who have required C-Sections, but some/most who will whelp just fine... i will be taking every precaution possible to ensure a safe happy healthy pup, the specialist vet says not to worry about x-rays, but i feel that i will as we could still only see 1 pup on the ultrasound, and it will give me an idea of the size(would be great for an extra surprise but i am doubtful) will also talk to my local vet when i get the xray, they will need to be on standby anyway as the specialist says she is due on a Monday, x ray will be done on the Friday :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OSoSwift Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 My Dobe had a singleton pup by herself after I was told there were no babies and she was sent home from the breeder. She whelped herself and puppy was very healthy - me not so much when I got up in the morning to a puppy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebanne Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 when I used frozen semen my vet gave me a date that the bitch must have had the pups by or else we had to do a c-section. Fern only had 2 and never went into labour. From talking to others some repo vets are quite strong in wanting C-sections if bitch does not deliver by due date. They do not want the pups to go over 63 days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dancinbcs Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 In 29 years I have only ever known of two Border bitches to whelp a live singleton without a caesar. The chances of her going into labour are very slim so I would be prog testing her and doing the caesar as soon as the level drops if she isn't in labour. Frozen semen is implanted after ovulation so the pregancy will be shorter than 63 days. I am pretty sure it is 61 days and I would not let her go over that. Better a caesar for a live puppy than a dead one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bordacollies4me Posted March 6, 2012 Author Share Posted March 6, 2012 Thanks all for sharing... my concern is also that in her previous litters she has whelped on the 60/61 day mark, the vet gave me the date at the 59 days, but said sometimes singles need an extra day... so wants me to come on the Monday(Day 60) have an ultrasound, see how things are going and make a decision go home and come back tomorrow or deliver the pup if she is in labour... if he was 15min away i could cope with that but 2 1/2 hrs... I will have a chat with my local vet, they need to be on Standby anyway... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebanne Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 In 29 years I have only ever known of two Border bitches to whelp a live singleton without a caesar. The chances of her going into labour are very slim so I would be prog testing her and doing the caesar as soon as the level drops if she isn't in labour. Frozen semen is implanted after ovulation so the pregancy will be shorter than 63 days. I am pretty sure it is 61 days and I would not let her go over that. Better a caesar for a live puppy than a dead one. yes expected due date is 61 days after the surgical AI. My repo vets were happy to wait an extra 48 hrs but day 63 was it, absolutely no later. Fern had her c-section about 30 hrs after the due date/time. agree better a live pup then a dead one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leema Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 My reproductive vet waited for Clover's progesterone levels to drop before doing an elective c-section. Her levels dropped at day 64 (from ovulation). We were doing progesterone testing at a local vet, and went for the 1.5 hour drive to my reproductive vet for the c-section. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dancinbcs Posted March 7, 2012 Share Posted March 7, 2012 Thanks all for sharing... my concern is also that in her previous litters she has whelped on the 60/61 day mark, the vet gave me the date at the 59 days, but said sometimes singles need an extra day... so wants me to come on the Monday(Day 60) have an ultrasound, see how things are going and make a decision go home and come back tomorrow or deliver the pup if she is in labour... if he was 15min away i could cope with that but 2 1/2 hrs... I will have a chat with my local vet, they need to be on Standby anyway... Can your local vet do the ultrasound and prog test at 59/60 days? Then make a decision about if you need to do a caesar and who will do it. Does the local vet do many? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bordacollies4me Posted March 8, 2012 Author Share Posted March 8, 2012 We are booked in to my local vet next Friday for XRay, i normally use my local vet for Ultrasounds, they are quite good, but Repo vet wanted to do them and was convincing enough for me to make the trip, my local vet has done plenty of Ceasars as well... We will discuss things with him next week, possibly make an appointment for the Monday for the Ultrasound and make a decision weather to make the trip to the Repo Vet or not... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dancinbcs Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 We are booked in to my local vet next Friday for XRay, i normally use my local vet for Ultrasounds, they are quite good, but Repo vet wanted to do them and was convincing enough for me to make the trip, my local vet has done plenty of Ceasars as well... We will discuss things with him next week, possibly make an appointment for the Monday for the Ultrasound and make a decision weather to make the trip to the Repo Vet or not... If your vet is good with the ultrasound, why bother with an x-ray? With even 3 or 4 puppies you should be able to see the size and position with a decent ultrasound in the last few days. An x-ray is really only useful to work out numbers with very big litters where you may not pick them all up with the ultrasound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bordacollies4me Posted March 19, 2012 Author Share Posted March 19, 2012 Well Our Puppy was delivered Safely yesterday by C-Section... a Happy Healthy Black & White Boy with a strong set of lungs on him :) With teh Proud Mama :) His Sire (from the UK) Our new little man Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShesaLikeableBiBear Posted March 19, 2012 Share Posted March 19, 2012 Congratulations At least he will be a full sized b/c, not like our current litter of mini b/c's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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