Salukifan Posted March 2, 2012 Share Posted March 2, 2012 (edited) Sorry, I disagree. I can only imagine most of you haven't had much to do with Bull breeds. The brindle dog in the video was all about play in my opinion. They are DOGS aren't they? Are you suggesting that bull breeds somehow display unique body language? If you are seeing taut, not relaxed muscle and a high degree of focus, then chances are you are seeing prey, not play behaviour. Edited March 2, 2012 by Telida Whippets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackdogs Posted March 2, 2012 Author Share Posted March 2, 2012 Sorry, I disagree. I can only imagine most of you haven't had much to do with Bull breeds. The brindle dog in the video was all about play in my opinion. They are DOGS aren't they? Are you suggesting that bull breeds somehow display unique body language? I'm suggesting that different breeds have different display tendencies and some are more difficult to read than others, yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackdogs Posted March 2, 2012 Author Share Posted March 2, 2012 Sorry, I disagree. I can only imagine most of you haven't had much to do with Bull breeds. The brindle dog in the video was all about play in my opinion. They are DOGS aren't they? Are you suggesting that bull breeds somehow display unique body language? If you are seeing taut, not relaxed muscle and a high degree of focus, then chances are you are seeing prey, not play behaviour. You are backing up my position. There wasn't near enough focus to conclude that was prey behaviour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alyosha Posted March 2, 2012 Share Posted March 2, 2012 Ah I see. Just trying to get my head around special rules here. So bull breeds need to be treated the same as all other dog breeds, and not subject to special rules or suspicion based upon their appearance. Judge the breed and not the deed perhaps? EXCEPT... when that doesn't suit, and then their behaviour is suddenly different to all ther types of dog and should be treated differently. Hmmm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greytmate Posted March 2, 2012 Share Posted March 2, 2012 It is not hard at all to read the behaviour of most short coated dogs including bull breeds. Especially when it is captured on video. That is my opinion. All dog breeds use pretty much the same body language as is shown on the chart. All domestic canines and some non-domestic ones as well. That isn't my opinion, it is science. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salukifan Posted March 2, 2012 Share Posted March 2, 2012 (edited) Hope this works. Bugger, it didn't. Edited March 2, 2012 by Telida Whippets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jade~Harley~Bella Posted March 2, 2012 Share Posted March 2, 2012 Using this chart I have one very angry little girl on my hands :) She regularly barks in an "angry" manner while looking "alert" when she is playing or being cheeky. ;) Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salukifan Posted March 2, 2012 Share Posted March 2, 2012 (edited) Has anyone actually LISTENED to what the cop is told as he walks into that back yard? DO that and then play the 2:20 to 2:24 minute part of the clip again. Given that he's been told that the dog has attacked the home owner, do you think its even a teeny bit possible that a dog running towards you and barking loudly might not be interpreted as "playing"? I was trying to freeze minute 2.23 without success The dog is coming on pretty fast. Edited March 2, 2012 by Telida Whippets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alyosha Posted March 2, 2012 Share Posted March 2, 2012 I would be interested to get people's opinions on whether this officer's actions were appropriate. You asked at the beginning Blackdogs, for people's opinions. You have been given opinions from knowledgable law enforcement perspectives, and from knowledgable dog behaviour perspectives saying yes, the actions were justified. You have also been given opinions based on emotion and even possible breed bias. That's all well and good, but it seems after all that you are not interested in discussing the issue, only complaining about the cop's actions, defending the dog's actions, and seeking others to join you in that. it a thread for discussion or for cop bashing and ratbag dog sympathising? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymatejack Posted March 2, 2012 Share Posted March 2, 2012 (edited) Using this chart I have one very angry little girl on my hands :) She regularly barks in an "angry" manner while looking "alert" when she is playing or being cheeky. ;) Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk hahahaha yep, my dog gets stressed everytime i scratch him behind the ear. What a load of nonsense! Edit : oh and he relieves stress everytime he gets up from a sleep Edited March 2, 2012 by mymatejack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erny Posted March 2, 2012 Share Posted March 2, 2012 Has anyone actually LISTENED to what the cop is told as he walks into that back yard? DO that and then play the 2:20 to 2:24 minute part of the clip again. Given that he's been told that the dog has attacked the home owner, do you think its even a teeny bit possible that a dog running towards you and barking loudly might not be interpreted as "playing"? I was trying to freeze minute 2.23 without success The dog is coming on pretty fast. What I saw (correction : what I remember seeing) is a dog who was standing there. It did bark at the officer a couple of times, paused and looked away. It was then the officer shot the dog. Maybe I got distracted from the footage (I didn't think so.). Maybe there is different footage (as there are other things people have talked about that I've gone "huh??" at. But I'm not going back to check. I don't want to see it again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salukifan Posted March 2, 2012 Share Posted March 2, 2012 Using this chart I have one very angry little girl on my hands :) She regularly barks in an "angry" manner while looking "alert" when she is playing or being cheeky. ;) Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk hahahaha yep, my dog gets stressed everytime i scratch him behind the ear. What a load of nonsense! Edit : oh and he relieves stress everytime he gets up from a sleep Clearly the subtleties of canine body language are lost on some. More's the pity. The better you can read it, particularly in unknown dogs, the safer you and your dog are. Seems to me that what this thread is about is a bunch of folk who suggest that because they have a dog of a particular breed, they can tell how all dogs of that breed act. And they can tell it better than anyone else. Maybe the police officer wasn't a bull breed owner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salukifan Posted March 2, 2012 Share Posted March 2, 2012 Has anyone actually LISTENED to what the cop is told as he walks into that back yard? DO that and then play the 2:20 to 2:24 minute part of the clip again. Given that he's been told that the dog has attacked the home owner, do you think its even a teeny bit possible that a dog running towards you and barking loudly might not be interpreted as "playing"? I was trying to freeze minute 2.23 without success The dog is coming on pretty fast. What I saw (correction : what I remember seeing) is a dog who was standing there. It did bark at the officer a couple of times, paused and looked away. It was then the officer shot the dog. Maybe I got distracted from the footage (I didn't think so.). Maybe there is different footage (as there are other things people have talked about that I've gone "huh??" at. But I'm not going back to check. I don't want to see it again. I'll break it down for you Erny. The second before the shot is fired the dog is moving fast towards the officer. It is partially airborne (front legs off the ground) and its mouth is open. I watched it quite a few times. Wish I could freeze it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jade~Harley~Bella Posted March 2, 2012 Share Posted March 2, 2012 Using this chart I have one very angry little girl on my hands :) She regularly barks in an "angry" manner while looking "alert" when she is playing or being cheeky. ;) Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk hahahaha yep, my dog gets stressed everytime i scratch him behind the ear. What a load of nonsense! Edit : oh and he relieves stress everytime he gets up from a sleep Haha yeah apparently my two are very stressed as well :) Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erny Posted March 2, 2012 Share Posted March 2, 2012 (edited) I'll break it down for you Erny. The second before the shot is fired the dog is moving fast towards the officer. It is partially airborne (front legs off the ground) and its mouth is open. I watched it quite a few times. Wish I could freeze it. No. That is DEFINITELY NOT what I saw. The dog that was shot was merely standing. It was already standing there when the officer walked in and up towards it. It barked at the officer. It stopped barking for a couple of seconds, looked away (around towards where the other dog was, over to the other side of the yard). That was when it was shot. The dog recoiled at the shot, was yelping and was then hidden by the tree when the officer had to fire at least another couple of shots before the dog stopped (presumably dead). There has to be different footage otherwise I am simply losing my marbles (shut-up ..... don't anyone dare agree with that, lol). As I mentioned, there were other things in this thread that made me wonder if there was different footage. Edited March 2, 2012 by Erny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salukifan Posted March 2, 2012 Share Posted March 2, 2012 (edited) I'll break it down for you Erny. The second before the shot is fired the dog is moving fast towards the officer. It is partially airborne (front legs off the ground) and its mouth is open. I watched it quite a few times. Wish I could freeze it. No. That is DEFINITELY NOT what I saw. The dog that was shot was merely standing. It was already standing there when the officer walked in and up towards it. It barked at the officer. It stopped barking for a couple of seconds, looked away (around towards where the other dog was, over to the other side of the yard). There has to be different footage otherwise I am simply losing my marbles (shut-up ..... don't anyone dare agree with that, lol). As I mentioned, there were other things in this thread that made me wonder if there was different footage. Nope, what I saw had the dog approach.. and fast. AND it had sound... the owner telling the police officer that the two dogs were attacking his beagle and had attacked him. If you can bear it.. Minute 2.21 to 2.23 - IMO there's nothing ambivalent about the dog's behaviour. Edited March 2, 2012 by Telida Whippets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
megan_ Posted March 2, 2012 Share Posted March 2, 2012 Yip - dog is definitely running towards the officer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erny Posted March 2, 2012 Share Posted March 2, 2012 (edited) If you can bear it.. Minute 2.21 to 2.23 - IMO there's nothing ambivalent about the dog's behaviour. I'm sorry. I'm not trying to duck out of this one. I tried to re-watch. I can't. I'll take your word for it as to what you saw. It's just not as I remember it. As I said in my first post, it just seemed to me as though the drama was set up for more than was necessary. I don't know why I remember it that way if there is only the one footage. Beg my pardon if I'm wrong. I don't understand why there is such a discrepancy to my mind's eye though. Edited March 2, 2012 by Erny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salukifan Posted March 2, 2012 Share Posted March 2, 2012 If you can bear it.. Minute 2.21 to 2.23 - IMO there's nothing ambivalent about the dog's behaviour. I'm sorry. I'm not trying to duck out of this one. I tried to re-watch. I can't. Fair enough Erny. It's not pleasant. I was trying to see if what he did was justified TO HIM. Given that he's been told the dog has attacked and its coming on, I think would have been to him. 2.23 is before the shot by the way. I saw a threat display, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erny Posted March 2, 2012 Share Posted March 2, 2012 (edited) 2.23 is before the shot by the way. Yeah I getcha. And I'll just have to bow on this one. When I first started re-play my stomach turned. I didn't get more than about 15 - 30 seconds in when I had to shut it down. It doesn't matter than I don' see it. It's that I know what's coming. Edited March 2, 2012 by Erny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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