Officer Shoots Dog.

[Blackdogs]

I would be interested to get people's opinions on whether this officer's actions were appropriate.

ETA: If you have already seen and discussed this video, feel free to skip the thread. There are clearly some who have done neither and would like to. If Troy deems it inappropriate he will delete it. Edited February 28, 2012 by Blackdogs

[Nevafollo]

Wish I hadnt watched that! Obviously it was distressing watching them attack the beagle but the officer shouldnt have gone in there with just a gun there are far better ways to deal with dangerous dogs than THAT!

[Blackdogs]

Wish I hadnt watched that! Obviously it was distressing watching them attack the beagle but the officer shouldnt have gone in there with just a gun there are far better ways to deal with dangerous dogs than THAT!

To me, it looked as if the two dogs were attempting to play with the Beagle but the Beagle was vocalising out of fear.

[sumosmum]

I don't think it was appropriate.

Ot, but all 5 of my dogs went off when they heard the dog yelping. More so than I have ever seen them react to any sound coming from the computer.

[melzawelza]

I posted this video a while ago, and was quite shocked that a large amount of people defended the officer's actions.

[Salukifan]

Wish I hadnt watched that! Obviously it was distressing watching them attack the beagle but the officer shouldnt have gone in there with just a gun there are far better ways to deal with dangerous dogs than THAT!

Here we go again.

Exactly how many better ways to deal with aggressive dogs are police officers trained in or equipped with? These days they might taser or OC spray a dog but you have to have both of those pieces of equipment to be able to employ them.

No, I don't think the dog should have been shot. But in the absence of a ranger or rangers with a dart (by the way I think that may have been animal control with a catchpole that the dog fronted earlier in the clip), when called to a yard to say two strange dogs are terrifying the shit of of a dog (or more likely even more dramatic), and when rushed by a dog that he perceived as aggressive, I can understand why he did what he did.

20/20 hindsight from the comfort of a computer screen is a wonderful thing. We have no back story and we weren't faced with that dog coming on. Pitbulls aren't always owned by cop loving people and my guess from a quick glimpse at US media, some cops may have confronted their fair share of aggressive pits in their working careers.

Edited February 28, 2012 by Telida Whippets

[wantsapuppy]

No way is that appropriate. Poor doggy, but then again we don't know the full story. Either

Edited February 28, 2012 by wantsapuppy

[Erny]

Going by what was video taped that was such a set up. RIP doggy. That was horrible. Notice the owner of the Beagle was doing nothing to try to coax the beagle inside? Even when the other two dogs desisted with bothering it the first time around? And the first time around, that struck me as a short play scenario, not an attack. The dog barked at the cop and then stopped and looked around. The actions of those people were gross.

Edited February 28, 2012 by Erny

[Alyosha]

This is an old one, get over it. Oh the poor dog, tough luck. Attacking and roaming dogs are a bloody public nuisance and impact all responsible dog owners.

Does anyone here know the story? Do you know if that was a one off attack? Or is there a vast range of possibilities involved? ;)

Here's a different scenario to the "set up" theory. Police have had multpile calls from a neighbourhood about loose dogs harrassing and attacking pets, harrassing people and being a general danger to everybody. Police have attended multiple addresses and seen maimed and dead pets and spoken to frightened people. All those calls are accompanied by a description of two pitbull types, one brindle and white and one fawn.

Now watch the officers entrance and see how you react. Feel any different?

Funny how things look different with a story behind them.

If someone here posted a video of a dog chasing sheep in Australia, regardless of attacking, maybe just running about seemingly enjoying themselves, and that video then showed a farmer shooting them without hesitation would everyone criticise him? Or would we say "That's the risk you take letting your dogs roam, farmers are within their rights to protect their stock."

We need to think with our heads and not our hearts.

[Blackdogs]

This is an old one, get over it. Oh the poor dog, tough luck. Attacking and roaming dogs are a bloody public nuisance and impact all responsible dog owners.

Does anyone here know the story? Do you know if that was a one off attack? Or is there a vast range of possibilities involved? ;)

Here's a different scenario to the "set up" theory. Police have had multpile calls from a neighbourhood about loose dogs harrassing and attacking pets, harrassing people and being a general danger to everybody. Police have attended multiple addresses and seen maimed and dead pets and spoken to frightened people. All those calls are accompanied by a description of two pitbull types, one brindle and white and one fawn.

Now watch the officers entrance and see how you react. Feel any different?

Funny how things look different with a story behind them.

If someone here posted a video of a dog chasing sheep in Australia, regardless of attacking, maybe just running about seemingly enjoying themselves, and that video then showed a farmer shooting them without hesitation would everyone criticise him? Or would we say "That's the risk you take letting your dogs roam, farmers are within their rights to protect their stock."

We need to think with our heads and not our hearts.

I had no idea it had been posted previously.

But I have to say there are usually a whole ton of things you could do before shooting a dog in most situations. People are too ready to dispatch dogs.

The owner should always pay, not the dog.

In short, I don't agree with you. I think we need to incorporate more 'heart' and way more 'head' in these types of situations.

ETA: If you have already seen and discussed this video, feel free to skip the thread, there are no doubt some here who haven't seen it and would like to discuss it.

Edited February 28, 2012 by Blackdogs

[Blackdogs]

Going by what was video taped that was such a set up. RIP doggy. That was horrible. Notice the owner of the Beagle was doing nothing to try to coax the beagle inside? Even when the other two dogs desisted with bothering it the first time around? And the first time around, that struck me as a short play scenario, not an attack. The dog barked at the cop and then stopped and looked around. The actions of those people were gross.

Agreed on all points.

[GeorgieB]

Going by what was video taped that was such a set up. RIP doggy. That was horrible. Notice the owner of the Beagle was doing nothing to try to coax the beagle inside? Even when the other two dogs desisted with bothering it the first time around? And the first time around, that struck me as a short play scenario, not an attack. The dog barked at the cop and then stopped and looked around. The actions of those people were gross.

No idea if it was a set up or not, but I do believe the beagle is tied up.

[Salukifan]

But I have to say there are usually a whole ton of things you could do before shooting a dog in most situations. People are too ready to dispatch dogs.

Can you give some examples?

Bear in mind that "do nothing" probably wasn't an option here.

I find the Beagle's terrified screaming really distressing. More than one dog suffered here.

If there's anger to be directed at a person here, save it for the owner of the dogs that put them in this situation. The police are those called in to act when irresponsible people don't.. and yet they are the ones being judged here. Go figure.

Edited February 28, 2012 by Telida Whippets

[Alyosha]

ETA: If you have already seen and discussed this video, feel free to skip the thread, there are no doubt some here who haven't seen it and would like to discuss it.

I actually did discuss it, in case you skimmed over my post because it wasn't agreeing with you. You chose not to comment on the prospect I raised of there being more to the story, is that the same as wanting to discuss it? Or is the discussion reserved for those who all agree it is wrong?

In short, can anyone here tell me one good reason why official people, whether police or animal control who whoever, who have duties relating to protecting the public, should be spending time and effort and risking the safety of that public as well as themselves, offering dogs like this options?

When there are so many dogs out there that no one has time for, such as well behaved former pets, whiling away their days in shelters. Time, effort and money should go where it's most deserved.

If that was a person committing a violent act on a defenceless and tied up small dog would we be crying out for vengeance?

Edited February 28, 2012 by Alyosha

[Blackdogs]

ETA: If you have already seen and discussed this video, feel free to skip the thread, there are no doubt some here who haven't seen it and would like to discuss it.

I actually did discuss it, in case you skimmed over my post because it wasn't agreeing with you. You chose not to comment on the prospect I raised of there being more to the story, is that the same as wanting to discuss it? Or is the discussion reserved for those who all agree it is wrong?

In short, can anyone here tell me one good reason why official people, whether police or animal control who whoever, who have duties relating to protecting the public, should be spending time and effort and risking the safety of that public as well as themselves, offering dogs like this options?

When there are so many dogs out there that no one has time for, such as well behaved former pets, whiling away their days in shelters. Time, effort and money should go where it's most deserved.

If that was a person committing a violent act on a defenceless and tied up small dog would we be crying out for vengeance?

I was referring to the 'old, get over it' remark which seemed to suggest that although you offered some discussion you really didn't want to be bothered. I suppose I could have interpreted that incorrectly, though.

There could always be more to any story we see on the internet, so we have to go off what we have. Reading the situation as it presents itself here, I think the officer did the wrong thing.

If the officer is not equipped to deal with dogs other than shooting them then I think someone else needs to be called to the scene.

I'm not sure what you mean by 'dogs like this' as I saw some defensive barking, (which would have been interpreted much differently coming from a Golden Retriever) and that's about it.

The dogs appeared to be attempting to play with the Beagle who was fearfully vocalising in response. I didn't see any violent acts.

These dogs could be very loved dogs whose fence had blown over, or someone might have accidentally left the gate open (mistakes happen to the best of us). Why shouldn't we try to preserve their lives?

[Salukifan]

If the officer is not equipped to deal with dogs other than shooting them then I think someone else needs to be called to the scene.

In many places, emergency response is limited to police, fire or ambulance. Who is the 'someone' else you would call?

Police do walk away from scenes and await the arrival of appropriate resources, but generally not when they perceive there is imminent danger to life or when they themselves are threatened.

What I see here is people finding excuses for the reason two large offlead dogs are in someone's yard, terrifying their dog who is screaming in fear (and for all we know could be wounded) and approaching first the resident and then the police in a highly threatening posture. I don't give a toss what breed it is but my guess is that police officers, who get to deal with large aggressive dogs on an all too regular basis, might feel differently.

What I also see is that there is a real and genuine need to educate more people about canine body language. Nothing about the brindle dog's behaviour towards people in that clip suggested defensive behaviour. The behaviour towards the Beagle, in my opinion, was predatory.

And I'l say this about the Beagle. If it had offered any kind of retaliation, my guess is that it would be dead.

[Blackdogs]

But I have to say there are usually a whole ton of things you could do before shooting a dog in most situations. People are too ready to dispatch dogs.

Can you give some examples?

Bear in mind that "do nothing" probably wasn't an option here.

I find the Beagle's terrified screaming really distressing. More than one dog suffered here.

If there's anger to be directed at a person here, save it for the owner of the dogs that put them in this situation. The police are those called in to act when irresponsible people don't.. and yet they are the ones being judged here. Go figure.

If officers are not trained to deal with loose dogs then someone else should be called to the scene. The terrified screaming of the Beagle is distressing if you believe the Beagle is being attacked. I didn't see an attack, but two rambunctious dogs trying to play with a defensively vocalising dog.

A lot of people's dogs get out and I don't believe all of those owners are bad people. Mistakes happen. A dog shouldn't have to pay with its life.

So what could a better trained person have done to diffuse the situation? A friendly approach would have been a good start. The dog that was shot was acting defensively because of the hostility it was shown. The house occupiers should have been advised to keep away from the dogs until professional help arrived.

I suggest that if these dogs had been a different breed people would see this video differently and this situation may not have escalated in the first place. I think that preconceived breed notions clouded the judgement of the house occupiers, the police officer and I believe they're also clouding the judgement of some responders here.

[Salukifan]

I suggest that if these dogs had been a different breed people would see this video differently and this situation may not have escalated in the first place. I think that preconceived breed notions clouded the judgement of the house occupiers, the police officer and I believe they're also clouding the judgement of some responders here.

Wow, so many people with such clouded judgement. But one online viewer who knows what was really going on.

What intrigues me is that you seem unwilling to consider the possibility that the breed of the dogs involved is clouding your judgement.

Of course hearing one's pet dog screaming in terror couldn't possibly influence how anyone would perceive this as playing out. Totally irrelevant.

And here's the thing. You're not standing there, having heard that dog screaming as you walked into the yard, having been called to an "emergency" and being approached by a strange dog and having only a firearm to defend yourself from what you perceive to be an aggressive dog.

Don't you think that might have a teeny bit of influence on how you consider what happens next?

All I can say is its best to judge the behaviour of the dog in front of you and make no assumptions, good OR bad about what its motives are based on its breed. Far safer either way.

Many dogs do NOT react aggressively to humans by the way.. I don't find any reason to justify that dog's aggression.. but nice to know that you saw it for what it was. An interesting demonstration of behaviour from a breed renowned for NOT showing aggression to humans. There are some very bloody dangerous pits around Blackdogs.. not as many here as in the USA but they are being taken in a direction so far removed from their original temperament by some who do not have the breeds' interests at heart and it would pay to remember it.

Edited February 28, 2012 by Telida Whippets

[Blackdogs]

If the officer is not equipped to deal with dogs other than shooting them then I think someone else needs to be called to the scene.

In many places, emergency response is limited to police, fire or ambulance. Who is the 'someone' else you would call?

Police do walk away from scenes and await the arrival of appropriate resources, but generally not when they perceive there is imminent danger to life or when they themselves are threatened.

What I see here is people finding excuses for the reason two large offlead dogs are in someone's yard, terrifying their dog who is screaming in fear (and for all we know could be wounded) and approaching first the resident and then the police in a highly threatening posture. I don't give a toss what breed it is but my guess is that police officers, who get to deal with large aggressive dogs on an all too regular basis, might feel differently.

What I also see is that there is a real and genuine need to educate more people about canine body language. Nothing about the brindle dog's behaviour towards people in that clip suggested defensive behaviour. The behaviour towards the Beagle, in my opinion, was predatory.

And I'l say this about the Beagle. If it had offered any kind of retaliation, my guess is that it would be dead.

That situation was not an emergency. It's only perceived to be such because of the look of the dogs involved. I doubt there was imminent danger to anyone and if there was it was due to poor situational handling.

I deal with large aggressive dogs on a regular basis and I still wouldn't shoot in this situation. Everything about the dog's body language suggested defensive behaviour, in my opinion.

The Beagle didn't retaliate and neither you nor I could predict what would happen in that situation.

The tan dog seems to be a little prey driven but there's no follow through and as soon as the Beagle stops the commotion it loses interest.

I think there needs to be less panic and more thinking.

Edited February 28, 2012 by Blackdogs

[Salukifan]

That situation was not an emergency. It's only perceived to be such because of the look of the dogs involved. I doubt there was imminent danger to anyone and if there was it was due to poor situational handling.

I deal with large aggressive dogs on a regular basis and I still wouldn't shoot in this situation. Everything about the dog's body language suggested defensive behaviour, in my opinion.

The Beagle didn't retaliate and neither you nor I could predict what would happen in that situation.

The tan dog seems to be a little prey driven but there's no follow through and as soon as the Beagle stops the commotion it loses interest.

I think there needs to be less panick and more thinking.

Not an emergency - so you've heard the dispatch call? How do you jump to the conclusion that breed motivates what happens next?

Hard to think straight with a large dog approaching you in a less than friendly manner. I've already said I don't think he should have shot it but I can understand why he did.

What sees you dealing with large aggressive dogs on a regular basis - are you a ranger?