Using Frontline And It Doesnt Appear To Be Working ?hi Eveyone

[daccydog]

Hi everyone

My male long hair daccy is 7.1/2 yrs old and for the first time in his life , HAS FLEAS although not many at this stage, from ppl in the area ive spoken too say its a bad area for fleas

I have been using frontline plus for the last 2,1/2 months with another to be given shortly ,does this take a while to kill the cycle of fleas Or does this sound ok , poor bub is scratching like crazy

I have been washing his bedding and vacumming every 2nd day to eliminate any fleas in the house

any suggestions if i can do anything else for him

thanks

Daccydog :)

[Guest Ams]

Change to something else. Frontline hasn't been very effective for fleas for a while now.

eta this is IMHO

Edited February 21, 2012 by Ams

[TeamSnag]

Garlic tablets

[Tilly]

We haven't used frontline for a while as it seemed to stop working on our boys. We changed to Advantix (for the ticks) but have now changed to Permoxin.

For fleas - we use Comfortis ...

[jrm88]

Here are a few things to think about..

1. Are you treating every pet in the house? (dog, cat, rabbit, rat, mice)

2. Do you get feral cats/possums in your backyard???

3. Are you consistantly applying frontline every month? (not letting it go 5-6 weeks)

4. Does your dog swim/get bathed often?

5. Do you visit any places with your dog where he may pick up fleas (thus your seeing live fleas before they die)

6. Do you get any visiting animals (friends dogs/cats/whatever) to your house/yard who could also be bringing fleas over!)

So! Reason being, alot of people feel some brands are ineffective, and while it may be possible, the more likely scenario is owner compliance.

1. Every animal must be treated otherwise the fleas will continue to reproduce and drop flea eggs throughout the house.

2. Roughly 90-95% of feral cats have a flea burden, this means, if a cat walks through your backyard, they are dropping fleas into your yard! Dog walks over area, adult flea will jump on dog!

3. Fleas love shadey, humid, protected areas. Block off these areas if possible.

4. If you let it lapse, it will stop killing the fleas.

5. Even though the topicals say they are waterfast, they are not 100% waterproof. If your dog swims alot or is bathed alot, there is no guarantee that it breakdown the active ingredient quicker than it should. Its basically impossible to do studies on how waterfast these topicals are, as no study can replicate every situation an owner may be in.

6.If you dog goes out of the house, they can pick up a flea. You may see this flea/fleas on your dog and think you have a flea problem, when in fact, all that has happened has your dog has picked up a flea. If the frontline has been applied, it will kill the flea within 24hrs and will not allow it to reproduce due to containing an insect growth regulator.

Alot of flea problems are owner expectations, if you are taking your dog to any area where they regularly pick up fleas (e.g. feral cats/possums/rabbits frequent the area, they can pick up emerging fleas), it may not be realistic to have your dog completely flea free 100% of the time. The important thing is to keep your dog on prevention to prevent a flea infestation from occuring.

Flea lifecycle also takes 1-2 months to be completely broken due to the biomass within the environment. NOTHING kills flea pupae, so you basically have to wait it out until they hatch out into emerging fleas, which will then be killed when they jump on the dog.

Other things to think about...

Where does your dog spend the majority of their time? a fav bed? fav area? flea infestations are usually localised, would be a great idea to use a directed flea pump product to spray the area (even floorboards can harbor flea larvae/eggs/pupae!)

I'm really sorry to have gone on about this so much, I went to a flea seminar yesterday that was FASCINATING and made me think about so many things I had never thought about before. If you have any questions, feel free to pm me! :)

p.s - not saying that there isnt the possibility of the product being ineffective, but I think we need to look at everything about the owner/dog situation first before writing off the product.

Edited February 21, 2012 by jrm88

[Jade~Harley~Bella]

I've been using comfortis on my dogs and haven't seen a flea since. It's a but pricey depending on the weight of your dog. But results don't lie :)

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[**Super_Dogs**]

I stopped using frontline years ago. I use sentinel spectrum and capstar.

[puglvr]

I have to agree with jrm88 wholeheartedly. We have lived on our farm for 22years. When we moved here it had a heavy flea burden. We have used Frontline now for probably 18 years or so. We have 14 dogs and cat and don't have a flea problem. Never had to flea our baby puppies and we only use the Frontline over summer or when we need it.

[Inevitablue]

Relating back to parasite control in other species, some populations develop resistance to chemicals. It's a natural population survival mechanism. Just ask farmers in WA about ivermectin.

Some areas might have not been heavily exposed to Fipronil, so the chemical still works, in others, due to the popularity of a single product, resistance is bound to develop.

This is just a general observation about parasiticide resistance.

[sas]

So! Reason being, alot of people feel some brands are ineffective, and while it may be possible, the more likely scenario is owner compliance.

OR....that this product has been known for a long time by many users to be ineffective.

[jrm88]

I said it was possible there is resistance, but I can tell you most problems are owner compliance :)

As inevitablue said, maybe some populations have developed resistance while others haven't.

Working in the vet industry, it is amazing how the general public cannot follow simple treatment instructions.

I had someone swear up and down frontline didn't work... Asked a few questions, turned out everytime before they applied frontline, they had given the dog a bath!!! Of course the product will not work if the dog is wet. One month later, owner hasn't seen any fleas.

As I said a few times, I'm not saying there isn't problems, but a few questions should be asked first to make sure the owner is doing everything and considering everything.

[oakway]

Frontline does work and works most effectively. :)

The problem being that some area's are just so flea ridden that as the frontline kills the fleas, the dog is continually going to the flea area and more just keep jumping on and as we can't tell the difference between one flea and another we think they are the same fleas.

Frontline was advised of this problem (of not working and has been tested) I read an article on it on the net and it describes exactly what you have said, it appears not to be working.

I have not kept the article as I had an idea that it is was already on this list.

Check what jr88 had to say above as it is so very correct.

There is also a product called Coopex that is usually available from produce stores that can be sprayed directly onto the ground that will help control the fleas that are on the ground.

Most people change their brand of flea control in desperation as they are just getting on top of the flea problem and think that the new product is working better when it is usually the old product that has cleaned up the problem.

Yes, I use Fipronil for fleas here and it still working for me.

[Kavik]

I use advantix :)

[HazyWal]

I've been using comfortis on my dogs and haven't seen a flea since. It's a but pricey depending on the weight of your dog. But results don't lie :)

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Agree with this.Is expensive for my large dogs but well worth it.

[Inevitablue]

Frontline does work and works most effectively. :)

The problem being that some area's are just so flea ridden that as the frontline kills the fleas, the dog is continually going to the flea area and more just keep jumping on and as we can't tell the difference between one flea and another we think they are the same fleas.

Frontline was advised of this problem (of not working and has been tested) I read an article on it on the net and it describes exactly what you have said, it appears not to be working.

I have not kept the article as I had an idea that it is was already on this list.

Check what jr88 had to say above as it is so very correct.

There is also a product called Coopex that is usually available from produce stores that can be sprayed directly onto the ground that will help control the fleas that are on the ground.

Most people change their brand of flea control in desperation as they are just getting on top of the flea problem and think that the new product is working better when it is usually the old product that has cleaned up the problem.

Yes, I use Fipronil for fleas here and it still working for me.

But if you only ever stick with one chemical you are helping to build resistance. Why do you think farmers rotate actives? One season it's a mectin, next it's a white drench etc.

Expose a population to a chemical long enough and they will adapt. If someone uses Fipronil, then changes and suddenly the problem goes, then the new active killed the resistant fleas. If fleas killed like internal parasites then maybe dog owners would be as aware of this as livestock owners.

Edited February 21, 2012 by Inevitablue

[daccydog]

thanks Guys what a great read , always the best place to come and learn a little bit more :D

Regards

Daccydog

[oakway]

Frontline does work and works most effectively. :)

The problem being that some area's are just so flea ridden that as the frontline kills the fleas, the dog is continually going to the flea area and more just keep jumping on and as we can't tell the difference between one flea and another we think they are the same fleas.

Frontline was advised of this problem (of not working and has been tested) I read an article on it on the net and it describes exactly what you have said, it appears not to be working.

I have not kept the article as I had an idea that it is was already on this list.

Check what jr88 had to say above as it is so very correct.

There is also a product called Coopex that is usually available from produce stores that can be sprayed directly onto the ground that will help control the fleas that are on the ground.

Most people change their brand of flea control in desperation as they are just getting on top of the flea problem and think that the new product is working better when it is usually the old product that has cleaned up the problem.

Yes, I use Fipronil for fleas here and it still working for me.

But if you only ever stick with one chemical you are helping to build resistance. Why do you think farmers rotate actives? One season it's a mectin, next it's a white drench etc.

Expose a population to a chemical long enough and they will adapt. If someone uses Fipronil, then changes and suddenly the problem goes, then the new active killed the resistant fleas. If fleas killed like internal parasites then maybe dog owners would be as aware of this as livestock owners.

What with the modern drugs we have to drench our cattle and horses, (and I do mean "our own" cattle and horses) with there is little or no need to rotate as modern drugs do the job. If the product is not working correctly it may not be being used at the correct dosage. :)

I use Ivermec for heart worm in dogs. At the correct dosage my dogs do not have resistance to the product and are clear of heart worm. I have been using this product for nearly 20 years.

I have been using fipronil on my dogs since the product became available. It is still working on them and the fleas do not have a resistance as it kills them :)

Edited February 21, 2012 by oakway

[nowstarin]

copied and pasted from another topic but relevant here.

Firstly Advantix, advocate and advantage are not "Chemicals" as such. They were derived from the human edible crop divisions that use the same active ingredient of the Advantage family range - Imidicloprid. This product is used on food crops that you and I EAT.

It is safe and has an extremely wide safety margin. It is absorbed into the Lipid layer of skin (on animals) and is absorbed into the whole edible areas on crops. it is not like your Active ingredients of other products ie Frontline sentinel, interceptor ect that use chemically derived actives.

Re worming: Advocate is used monthly and has the active Imidicloprid and an additional additive of moxidectin which separates upon application and goes to the differing organs that are affected by the myriad or worms that animals are afflicted by. The major difference and UNIQUE properties of advocate as opposed to other preps are:

Advocate kills and evacuates worms, hatchlings and larvae that have accumulated and then PROTECTS against getting ANY new worms as opposed to ALL other worming preps that just evacuate accumulated worms. ie NO PROTECTION.

This unique property of Advocate is called "steady state" whereby the plasma holds a level of protection that DOES NOT ALLOW WORMS to enter, migrate or procreate at any time. the worms are killed immediately upon coming to the treated animal AT ALL TIMES.

Compliance of use (CONTINUITY) is extremely important for complete protection against getting any new worms or new fleas or new ticks. Use monthly (or fortnighly) to maintain Steady state.

Advantix is the ONLY registered product available that not only KILLS but REPELS all biting insects ie ticks fleas flies mosquitos horse flies ect ect etc. Sarcoptic mange mites and demodex are not immuno deficient nor auto immune related issues. The are parasites and advocate treats and PROTECTS the animal from reinfestations.

Re Permoxin. This is a PERMETHRIN and as such is TOXIC to cats. It must never be applied to cats and should NEVER be sprayed on dogs that live with cats as the direct contact may lead to serious issues for the cat including death. CATS cannot metabolize Permethrins. With regard to ADVANTIX it has Imidicloprid and the additive of Permethrin. It should NEVER be applied to cats - HOWEVER at the time of APPLICATION ONLY you need to separate the dog and cat for approx 6 hours until the actives have spread throughout the lipid layer of the dogs skin. From this time forward there is ABSOLUTELY no issue of a cat and dog together. The can lick cuddle sleep ect till their little heart is content.

The Advantage range of products is unique in that Imidicloprid kills parasites on contact within 1 - 3 minutes 100% efficacy for the full 1 month. All other products including frontline, comfortis, sentinel ect ect ect require the flea, tick mossie ect to BITE TO GET A DOSE of their actives from the bloodstream of the dog/cat because their active ingredients cross through and remain in the bloodstreams. Also Parasites cannot become "immune" to Imidicloprid like they do to the other products ie fipronil (frontline) ect.

Permoxin has a low efficacy hence the requirement to apply frequently.

Imidicloprid kills on contact so where ever your pet lays or goes it is killing parasites environmentally too. Oh and one more thing, You may still see fleas or ticks on your pet (that is wearing advantage family products) at any time, HOWEVER, those fleas will be in the process of dying and will appear slow and partly paralysed. The will be dead within 1 - 5 minutes of coming into contact with a protected pet. The are immediatly paralysed so cannot bite your pet but will die off. The new fleas in the environment will jump on your pet but will be killed on contact with either a hair shaft or skin that is wearing the product.

The fleas cycle is only 5 % of the environment are live adult fleas, 50% are larvae the rest eggs and hatchlings. Advantage family kills live, and larval.

Fleas need a blood feed to be able to lay eggs. eggs do not cause animals greif, LARVAE hatches to become Adult fleas HENCE killing adult fleas and larvae will acheive a flea free environment.

It is waterfast and does not leave greasy marks. Apply to a dry dog and do not bath for at least 2-3 days after application. Safe on pregnant and lactating bitches and Advantage can be used from newborn age also suited for rabbits and ferrets Advantix from 7 weeks and Advocate from 7 weeks of age too. Advocate for Ferrets.

Re advocate not doing tapeworm - If you dont have fleas you dont get tapeworm. hence you dont need to tapeworm your dogs when using advocate.

Hope this helps

[Ron]

My vet no longer sells it!!

Frontline does work and works most effectively. :)

The problem being that some area's are just so flea ridden that as the frontline kills the fleas, the dog is continually going to the flea area and more just keep jumping on and as we can't tell the difference between one flea and another we think they are the same fleas.

Frontline was advised of this problem (of not working and has been tested) I read an article on it on the net and it describes exactly what you have said, it appears not to be working.

I have not kept the article as I had an idea that it is was already on this list.

Check what jr88 had to say above as it is so very correct.

There is also a product called Coopex that is usually available from produce stores that can be sprayed directly onto the ground that will help control the fleas that are on the ground.

Most people change their brand of flea control in desperation as they are just getting on top of the flea problem and think that the new product is working better when it is usually the old product that has cleaned up the problem.

Yes, I use Fipronil for fleas here and it still working for me.

But if you only ever stick with one chemical you are helping to build resistance. Why do you think farmers rotate actives? One season it's a mectin, next it's a white drench etc.

Expose a population to a chemical long enough and they will adapt. If someone uses Fipronil, then changes and suddenly the problem goes, then the new active killed the resistant fleas. If fleas killed like internal parasites then maybe dog owners would be as aware of this as livestock owners.

What with the modern drugs we have to drench our cattle and horses, (and I do mean "our own" cattle and horses) with there is little or no need to rotate as modern drugs do the job. If the product is not working correctly it may not be being used at the correct dosage. :)

I use Ivermec for heart worm in dogs. At the correct dosage my dogs do not have resistance to the product and are clear of heart worm. I have been using this product for nearly 20 years.

I have been using fipronil on my dogs since the product became available. It is still working on them and the fleas do not have a resistance as it kills them :)

[Inevitablue]

Oakway-

It's good to hear that you have no resistance problems. :)

But the occurrence of resistance is a problem, and one that modern drugs will still suffer from, unless used wisely. Unless a chemical has a 100% knockdown rate the survivors will breed and develop mechanisms to counteract the drugs. It's evolution.

Products like Q Drench combine chemicals to ensure a 100% knockdown.

You don't rotate your horse wormers? http://www.virbac.com.au/p-virbacaupuben/display.aspx?srv=p-virbacau&typ=pub〈=en&cmd=view&style=styles/page2.xsl&select=PAGE%5B@ID$eq$PAGE_182%5D&generic1=ARTICLE_961&affp=&

Edited February 21, 2012 by Inevitablue