2 X 2 Weaves

[Pretty Miss Emma]

Ok, I'm asking everywhere about this as I feel a bit like we've hit a brick wall! :laugh:

So our 2 x 2 training started really well. We have quite a bit of value for the 2nd set of poles. A few issues with Kenz looking back to me rather than driving forward, but if I move with her we seem to be able to get past this so I know it is something we will be able to work at. Struggling with angled entries - but that is because of space limitations in my yard so we can't really practice that a great deal and I won't take her to train in the parks around here because of the number of people that let their dogs run up to her and that ride their dirt bikes (illegally) through the park! SO I am a bit limitted with my training environment.

Anyway the thing that is getting me at the moment though... getting her to 4 poles. She can do them in the 1-7 position with about 1.5m between the 2 sets. But I'm really struggling to get her to the next bit. I've tried doing miniscule moves but it all seems to fall apart. Do I just persevere? Do I need a different approach? Do I just need to have more faith in my little dog that she can do it??!!

I don't know. We've just been practicing and I've stepped her backwards a little bit in the hopes that doing that might help me move her forwards!!! I guess if you have advice or even just words of hope I'd love to hear it!!!!

[ness]

Best advice - give them a break for a few weeks, go away and work on something else then back up and start again from scratch. You can work a little quicker through the stuff you have already done but I find if I get stuck with anything and then start to hit a brick wall thats a better way to reset the slate.

Sometimes its all the dog needs. I also find it works better then just backing up a step immediately because I have done that with things only to find when I up the criteria again I am faced with the same brick wall and a lot of frustration on the part of the dog.

[J...]

You've got holes in your dog's understanding of 2x2 that you are already band-aiding 1) that you need to move with her to avoid the head turn and 2) that you're struggling with angled entries. Go back to one step before them and fix them, they won't resolve themselves. ;)

Go back and watch the DVD again - I find that even now I miss or forget something despite having trained 2x2s with both my dogs, my first several times. Print out the notes that go with it and keep them handy for every training session.

You are going to need to find at least one or two different environments that you can use safely to work on those angled entries and help build understanding through proofing. I know it's not that easy, trust me I know, but you're going to have to.

[Aussienot]

Stay on 2 poles until your dog can do it every time, from any position, with you in any position. What you are teaching with the first set of two is the reliable entry and the concept of finding the pole, pass it with your left shoulder and bend around the next one. If you get that foundation down well, adding poles comes quickly. So take some time just using one set of two.

I taught the first set of two in my living room, and when I could be in another room and send her knowing my dog would weave two poles then we added a second set of two.

At first the sets were far apart, and once she had the concept of doing two sets I gradually moved them closer together until they were normally spaced. I had to give the command twice at first (because up till that point she thought one set was the whole job.) I dropped giving a second command after she had sucessfully done two sets a few times.

Edited February 18, 2012 by Aussienot

[kelpiechick]

Would it not be a good idea to actually ask one of your instructors for help, rather than try a public forum where people do not have first hand evidence of what your dog is doing without you adding video ? :) I believe there is also a club Yahoo list for asking this sort of question. It's good that you are asking in 'a lot of places' but you seem to have left out the 'obvious' ones for some reason.

I would recommend going back to the handouts you were given when you first started on this method (last year's class) and make sure that you haven't moved on from each stage before reaching appropriate level of accuracy. These should explain what you need to do at each stage - especially in regard to the difficulty of entries that you need to achieve with 2 poles before moving on. For some reason, most people don't seem to take too much notice of this and move on way too soon, thinking they won't ever need those type of entries. Then they get 'stuck' because any holes in the dog's understanding will certainly begin to show up before too long, in fact it is the more difficult entries that are usually the starting point for working 2 sets of poles, where you have to stand between the 2 sets and send back to the entry first. If you are trying to run down the entire set of 2 poles with such a gap between them you will most likely cue your dog in to your movement of accelerating forward only, which you want to avoid.

And unfortunately Jess is right - you absolutely will have to get out into another environment to test understanding and should have already done so before with just 2 poles. Are you still a member of an obedience club ? Maybe you could take your poles there and set up. What about booking the grassed area at Kepala (around $5 from memory) and setting up there ? Or maybe organising a private lesson with someone ? There are other alternatives besides a public park, you just have to think outside the square a little bit. Don't be afraid to take a step back if you need to either.

Edited February 18, 2012 by kelpiechick

[Agility Dogs]

I agree with what the others have said - especialy Keplie-chick. Instructors are more than willing to help, you just have to ask.

The holes the others have mentioned aside, the other thing that would be worth checking in on is that you have a very toy driven dog. I've seen some really good dogs try this method, but without sufficient toy drive I think there are better ways to go about it. (3 pole for example).

[kelpiechick]

The other thing I would also recommend is going back to your record keeping. Often you can find a 'pattern' here of when things start to slide, not just by looking at your recorded success percentage, but also from the comments that you made regarding each session. This is why we encourage you guys to do it in the first place as it can be very useful.

[Agility Dogs]

The other thing I would also recommend is going back to your record keeping. Often you can find a 'pattern' here of when things start to slide, not just by looking at your recorded success percentage, but also from the comments that you made regarding each session. This is why we encourage you guys to do it in the first place as it can be very useful.

Hmmmmmmm...........OT, sorry, but I think you've just identified a hole in my training.

I really wish I was better at record keeping for exactly this reason.

[Pretty Miss Emma]

Would it not be a good idea to actually ask one of your instructors for help, rather than try a public forum where people do not have first hand evidence of what your dog is doing without you adding video ? :) I believe there is also a club Yahoo list for asking this sort of question. It's good that you are asking in 'a lot of places' but you seem to have left out the 'obvious' ones for some reason.

It was a result of frustration yesterday and not seeing the forest for the trees I think! The Yahoo group was next on my list of places but just didn't get there last night.

My record keeping hasn't been so good of late, it was excellent and then I let the records slip. But will be more strict with myself over that one. I think we will need to go back a step so that we can move forward and maybe after obedience will have to be the time to practise - I need to have a good hunt around to see if there is somewhere else close to here I can get to where I won't also have to contend with the issues in the park across the road.

I think part of the issue is I also need to reset my expectations and try not to get frustrated over it!!! It just got to really bugging me yesterday!!!

[kelpiechick]

The other thing I would also recommend is going back to your record keeping. Often you can find a 'pattern' here of when things start to slide, not just by looking at your recorded success percentage, but also from the comments that you made regarding each session. This is why we encourage you guys to do it in the first place as it can be very useful.

Hmmmmmmm...........OT, sorry, but I think you've just identified a hole in my training.

Love it !

I'm just an anal freak about it - must be the school teacher in me. Would probably be better if I actually spent more time actually training to fix my holes,rather than writing about them .... but if anyone wants a 'plan of action' written or some goals set then I'm your gal !

PME - when you get frustrated......... step away from the BC ! She is very tuned into you and will pick up on any little nuance, believe me. There are some evenings when I just don't train as I know I am not in the state of mind that I need to be in. And record keeping will also help you identify any patterns there might be in this area too, it can be surprising. Even though I'm not instructing your class at the moment, I am happy for you to come and talk to me either before or after class any time if you want to, and we can come up with some ideas to help. I know your current instructor won't mind. :) And we all need help seeing the forest through the trees at times.