Council Rulings About Dog Breeding

[Ringo]

What about this idea - your local council (NSW) decides that no registered breeders (ANKC & Dogs NSW) are able to carry out a 'commercial purpose' in any land use zoning other than rural.

The commercial purpose they are referring to relates to the sale of puppies as money is exchanged/taken.

As all councils now use the same Local Environment Plan template presumably the same will eventually apply across the state.

So the breeders that have 1/2 litters a year are suddenly to be in breach of their councils LEP with the possible consequences of this an order under the LGA with the resultant possibly penalties.

And by association any person that breeds/makes things as a hobby and takes money for them will be in the same boat unless they are doing something that is not prohibited under their council's LEP.

Opens up a big can of worms for the Department of Local Government.

Wonder what all those people that breed birds and sell them and the greyhound owner/trainers will think when their council comes knocking about their commercial purpose activities.

[german_shep_fan]

Its all a bit much isn't it!

Councils really need to just mind their own bees when it comes to things like this i feel.

[Salukifan]

What about this idea - your local council (NSW) decides that no registered breeders (ANKC & Dogs NSW) are able to carry out a 'commercial purpose' in any land use zoning other than rural.

The commercial purpose they are referring to relates to the sale of puppies as money is exchanged/taken.

As all councils now use the same Local Environment Plan template presumably the same will eventually apply across the state.

So the breeders that have 1/2 litters a year are suddenly to be in breach of their councils LEP with the possible consequences of this an order under the LGA with the resultant possibly penalties.

And by association any person that breeds/makes things as a hobby and takes money for them will be in the same boat unless they are doing something that is not prohibited under their council's LEP.

Opens up a big can of worms for the Department of Local Government.

Wonder what all those people that breed birds and sell them and the greyhound owner/trainers will think when their council comes knocking about their commercial purpose activities.

It would outlaw garage sales too.

[TheCheekyMonster]

I have decided the role of council is just to a) be the go between for nosey neighbours, and b) to make stupid regulations that solve nothing in the world make but themselves money

[Sandra777]

And what about the SAHM who sews up dog coats for a bit of cash?

or Granny who knits sweaters for people?

[~Anne~]

Is this hypothetical or is there a document that exist in relation to this?

[Ringo]

Not a hypothetical

[LizT]

Here's a snippet from the Herald Sun Thursday February 9, 2012

Councils are losing the plot.

Local councils, it seems, have been hijacked by the fun police and the politically correct.

How else can you explain the recent outbreak of ridiculous by-laws and council decisions right across Melbourne?

It took the insistent common sense of a 10 year old girl this week to overturn the zealots at Yarra Ranges Council who wanted to limit her guinea pig pet numbers to two.

Georgia McAleer did what we should all do and refused to buckle, ending her complaint with a line that ought to become teh mantra for all ratepayers.

She wrote "I will not support any local law that is so trivial like that."

Georgia may be headed for a career in politics, and more power to her because Yarra Ranges buckled.

But this is just the latest in a long line of local government lunacy.

Remember last year when Yarra Council, covering inner city Richmond, wanted to replace outdoor gas heaters with blankets? That was a Green initiative dropped when they realised.........(OH tore article out :rolleyes: )

[Steve]

Not a hypothetical

Well if its not its time dog owners marched with placards in the street and yelled and screamed blue bloody murder- problem is it only affects breeders and these days breeders are too frightened to put their head up in case some animal rights loonie comes in and makes their lives hell because they want to breed a litter or two.

Having said that you are not supposed to breed dogs from your property anyway now without council approvals and possible Development application.

Its a world gone mad.

[Souff]

Whoaaaa!!!

Ringo is talking about NSW.

Liz T. is quoting from a Victorian newspaper.

There is one whole lot of difference between the NSW laws and the Victorian laws, and you can thank a whole lot of sensible people for that.

God help us all if they follow the Victorian lead though.

Ringo, documents or links are needed if this is not hypothetical and if this is being cooked up in NSW.

Souff

[Souff]

..... and these days breeders are too frightened to put their head up in case some animal rights loonie comes in and makes their lives hell because they want to breed a litter or two.

Hmmm, so breeders will just have to march in balaclavas I spose. No names, no addresses, no phone numbers.

I wonder if anyone in the animal rights movement has ever stopped to consider that good breeders are an integral part of the dog's future as a species.

No, probably not.

Better start knitting balaclavas for dog breeders.

Souff

[Sandra777]

I wonder if anyone in the animal rights movement has ever stopped to consider that good breeders are an integral part of the dog's future as a species.

Bet they have since they don't want the dog to have a future as a "domestic" species

Better start knitting balaclavas for dog breeders.

Just don't sell them from your house without council approval :D

[Tralee]

What about this idea - your local council (NSW) decides that no registered breeders (ANKC & Dogs NSW) are able to carry out a 'commercial purpose' in any land use zoning other than rural.

The commercial purpose they are referring to relates to the sale of puppies as money in exchanged/taken.

I doubt the definition of 'commercial purpose' can exclude profit.

Therein the majority of breeders are excluded.

Non-profit organisations and charities are not commercial and can never be considered commercial.

Simple fact, simple conclusion.

Px

[LizT]

Whoaaaa!!!

Ringo is talking about NSW.

Liz T. is quoting from a Victorian newspaper.

There is one whole lot of difference between the NSW laws and the Victorian laws, and you can thank a whole lot of sensible people for that.

God help us all if they follow the Victorian lead though.

Ringo, documents or links are needed if this is not hypothetical and if this is being cooked up in NSW.

Souff

Yes, I was highlighting the madness of local councils in general. However it looks like it isn't restricted to Victoria anymore!

[~Anne~]

Not a hypothetical

Can you provide links to legislation or proposals then.

[armahani]

This is pretty much the law already - at least in Victoria - and I assume most other States. Councils have a lot of power under town planning legislation which is quite seperate to domestic animal legislation under any state. If you look up your local town planning scheme, generally, except where land is zoned rural or farming, there is a limit on two dogs for "animal keeping" (which dog breeding is defined under). Any higher requires a town planning permit (which is a significantly different thing than a local laws permit for extra dogs and requires the construction of concrete kennels and runs etc etc, that's if you can get one approved).

Town planning legislation actually encourages puppy farming, because that is generally the only legitimate land use, and it strongly discourages the alternative (ie small scale breeders living in largely residential areas, with family pets and raising puppies in the house).

[Steve]

This is pretty much the law already - at least in Victoria - and I assume most other States. Councils have a lot of power under town planning legislation which is quite seperate to domestic animal legislation under any state. If you look up your local town planning scheme, generally, except where land is zoned rural or farming, there is a limit on two dogs for "animal keeping" (which dog breeding is defined under). Any higher requires a town planning permit (which is a significantly different thing than a local laws permit for extra dogs and requires the construction of concrete kennels and runs etc etc, that's if you can get one approved).

Town planning legislation actually encourages puppy farming, because that is generally the only legitimate land use, and it strongly discourages the alternative (ie small scale breeders living in largely residential areas, with family pets and raising puppies in the house).

Yep.

[Ringo]

Not in NSW - the Dept of Local Government continues to tell councils they cannot use the LGA or LEPs in relation to dog complaints, yet they continue to try and produce Local Orders Policy in relation to limiting the number of animals (not just dogs but cats, guinea pigs, rabbits etc) which they are unable to enforce.

Go read the Dept of Local Government website and start looking at the notices and circulars they publish for the information of councils about how to conduct business. Unfortunately most councils seem to think they are able to ignore these until they are forced to recognise them, then they go quiet or just ignore the things they don't want to acknowledge until they are forced to.

All depends on how hard you are prepared to stand up for your rights.

After all they are the only form of government in Australia that is not recognised in the constitution and they want a referendum at the next federal election to change the consitution to recognise them. Don't like their chances but our money will be spent by councils to run a campaign to have people say yes.

The best description I heard to describe local councils was a person very experienced in dealing with them who described them as the 'body corporate' for the rate payers and nothing more. Seemed pretty apt.

And what makes it all worse is each state runs their local councils differently.

[Souff]

Not in NSW - the Dept of Local Government continues to tell councils they cannot use the LGA or LEPs in relation to dog complaints, yet they continue to try and produce Local Orders Policy in relation to limiting the number of animals (not just dogs but cats, guinea pigs, rabbits etc) which they are unable to enforce.

Go read the Dept of Local Government website and start looking at the notices and circulars they publish for the information of councils about how to conduct business. Unfortunately most councils seem to think they are able to ignore these until they are forced to recognise them, then they go quiet or just ignore the things they don't want to acknowledge until they are forced to.

All depends on how hard you are prepared to stand up for your rights.

After all they are the only form of government in Australia that is not recognised in the constitution and they want a referendum at the next federal election to change the consitution to recognise them. Don't like their chances but our money will be spent by councils to run a campaign to have people say yes.

The best description I heard to describe local councils was a person very experienced in dealing with them who described them as the 'body corporate' for the rate payers and nothing more. Seemed pretty apt.

And what makes it all worse is each state runs their local councils differently.

Ringo, in relation to zoning, I think that councils have always determined the zonings in their area.

Personally, I think this is how it should be done, because they should know their local areas far better than the politicians in the city.

If I live in a residential zone, I dont want Woolworths or Bunnings or the local cement works moving into my area.

Neither do I want a boarding kennel, cattle yard, or chook farm in an medium density or high density residential area.

There are usually good reasons why councils zone areas the way they do.

If I want to move to a different place and have some acres and kennels and a few breeding dogs, I want them to have freedom to be able to bark without annoying close neighbours, and to be able to run in a paddock and swim in a creek, etc. I would look for a property that is zoned rural and where animal breeding is allowed.

Conversely, if I wish to live in a residential zone, then I know that I am limited in the number of dogs I can have there, and I know that I have strict rules to observe and I know those rules are usually there to keep the peace in the neighbourhood.

Across the world there are some diabolical places where there are few rules about dogs and dogs are allowed to roam and mate with anything. Nobody really cares how many dogs you own, it seems. Disease abounds in these places.

When the authorities move in for a "clean up", dogs are simply culled. Killed. Gone. Problem solved.

Given the choice between rules about zoning, and no rules, I will take the place with the rules thanks.

Yes, NSW tells its councils to make its own plans about a lot of things. If you dont like the decisions that your local council is making, then go along to the council meetings and let them know, or make an appointment to see the councillor in your ward. They're usually not bad people and you probably already know some of them anyway in their "other lives".

Souff