Roova Posted January 18, 2012 Share Posted January 18, 2012 I have a nearly 13 month old French Bulldog, Maggie, who I need a bit of help with. Maggie joined my partner and I as an 8 month old, mainly outside, ex show dog so I was aware she wasn't toilet trained. She is fantastic and I love her so much, but I'm a bit lost with toilet training her. After 5 months she poos and wees inside all the time. I've only had puppies before and toilet training was a piece of cake! She is outside during the day when we're at work but inside with us every other moment. The door to outside is always open so she can come and go as she pleases. Our bedrooms are carpeted so are off limits as she poo's and wee's in them when given the opportunity. She especially likes going in our bedroom if I forget to close the door. This morning it was open a crack and I just found a lovely soft poo (in two different areas) along with a wee. Lovely..sigh. If I'm in there she stands in the doorway looking in as she knows she can't come in so the poos and wees happen when we're busy doing something and she realises she can get in there. I've never managed to catch her so she's pretty quick about it, the little bugger! We also often find a wee under our dining table (right near the door leading outside) or in our hallway. I'm obviously doing something wrong, or not putting in enough effort somewhere but I don't know where to start with an adult dog. So far every morning (from day one) the first thing I do is let her out of our laundry where she sleeps in her (open) crate and we both go outside and run down our verandah to a grass area and I wait for her to go to the toilet. I generally say 'do wees, do wees' until she goes and lots of praise etc. I do the same at night before we go to bed and beside that she can go outside anytime she wants. That particular routine is down pat and she's quite quick at going. I think one of the problems might be that she is quite a submissive dog and she sticks to me like glue. Where ever I am, she wants to be so maybe she's going inside because she doesn't want to go outside, by herself?? I hardly see her voluntarily go outside unless we're out there and then she'll happily sniff, play, run and go to the toilet etc. I would really love some advice on what I need to do/change/manage to help her learn to go outside. We have to get the carpet's cleaned soon because of all the messes I've cleaned up but it's not much use if she keeps going on them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted January 18, 2012 Share Posted January 18, 2012 Oh dear... sounds like Maggie needs to be handled like a puppy ... possibly even on leash when inside so she can not sneak off ..and you need to take her out every 1/2 hr or hour ..saying whatever it is you say..and praising her like crazy when she toilets . Don't let her make mistakes ..leash her and keep her with you in whatever room you're in ..and make sure she has plenty of (forced) toilet times outside... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LizT Posted January 18, 2012 Share Posted January 18, 2012 Start from scratch and "crate train" if need be i.e. crate her when you can't watch her 100% or if she hasn't just gone outside and you can't risk letting her loose, crate her until after she has been outside, then she can have 'free time' in the house. We toilet trained an 8 year old ex puppy farm rescue Cavalier who only wanted to cock his leg EVERYWHERE in a month using this method. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
huga Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 (edited) Roova - it runs in the family, Sid has been an absolute pain. I feel your frustration. Frenchies (and pugs) are notoriously difficult to toilet train. I have been nothing but consistant, he has been crate trained from day dot and I still can't trust him. I can't remember the last time he went inside, but I watch him like a hawk and if I can't, he goes into the crate. So I couldn't tell you if he is toilet trained or not - he is just never left alone long enough to make a mistake ETA I always make him wee before I bring him inside. He understands the command. Edited January 19, 2012 by huga Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sas Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 Sounds like you're assuming she should know to go outside? When you're home, take her to the yard every hour and give her the toileting command and then calmly praise when she's going and then big praise when she's done. Ignore her in the yard until she toilets, no interacting with her. Then, watch her like a hawk - she should never leave your sight until the next time you let her out. Some dogs can just take longer but the more accidents 'you' allow her to have the longer it's going to take. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roova Posted January 19, 2012 Author Share Posted January 19, 2012 (edited) Thanks for replying and for your ideas :) Im a bit relieved to hear it's a Frenchie thing Huga, I've been thinking what can I have done so wrong that she still won't go outside of her own accord. Whenever I see her go to the toilet outside (if its not our morning and nightly ritual) I always say 'do wees' and give lots of praise. Its obviously not specific enough for her to realise inside is not a toilet though. Im not sure of the best way to approach full crate training in this regard without stressing her. Because of her timidish nature Im sure she would see it like a punishment if she was put in her crate when it wasn't bed time. As it is, when I say 'bed' she heads in there with head down and a slow walk....like I'm making her walk the plank! If I closed the door on the crate she'd probably be crushed! I can't give her things to keep her amused in there because she only plays with toys and chews things when she's with us. I leave stuffed kongs and toys out for her during the day and they haven't moved when I get home! When we're home she happily runs around with toys and plays by herself. Poor little poppet, I feel sorry for her that she must be so bored during the day. I think I'll try the advice to keep her on a lead and take her out every half an hour and see how she goes... Goodness, I think I've given her life story now Edited to say sorry Meh I missed your reply while typing this. Thank you for the advice I'll take that on board too. :) Edited January 19, 2012 by Roova Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greytmate Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 If you don't want to use a crate you need to do whatever else you can to restrict the dogs movement through the house while going through toilet training. Toilet training works because of a dog's natural instinct not to soil its eating or sleeping area. That is why crates are good. But if you don't want to crate, use things like doors or baby gates to stop the dog accessing the whole house, and furniture to block the dog's access to parts of the space. The smaller the floor space the better your chances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vacuna Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 I know how you feel too - one girl here (son's) dog still isn't completely house trained but that is also due to him not putting in the time and effort. She used to sleep on his bed but he never responded when she need to go out. As a result she would get off his bed and toilet on siblings bed and then jump back on the bed with him. After throwing out one mattress I cracked it and decided to take over her training using crate method. I use her crate only if I am going out for a short period and for sleeping overnight but it isn't viewed as a punishment by her as it has a nice comfy bed in it and on occassions I found her in it of her own accord. The rest of the time she is in the kitchen dining area (vinyl floor) and quite happy to be there - of course she may prefer other areas of the house but she has to prove herself first. She has been really good - will toilet on command but even though she can get in and out the backdoor I still have to physically take her outside, give the command and watch until she goes and then praise. She is restricted to the family area by a baby gate and only gets access to the rest of the house if I have just seen her toilet outside. At the moment we seem to have the urine side under control but she will still leave deposits especially in bedrooms if she gets the chance i.e. someone leaves the baby gate open or doesn't close it properly when she has the need to go. The other thing that works against training is if others in the household don't assist or follow the same method when you are not at home. It is like two steps forward and one step backwards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
german_shep_fan Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 I agree with the crate training and/or leash :) Just don't do what my stupid neighbour does with their 8mnth old rescue dog and rub her nose in it day after day and get pissed that "the stupid dog still doesn't get it". I am sure you have never done that Roova :) He is so mean to that poor dog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staffyluv Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 I agree with forced toilet breaks.. I just had a 2 year old foster and also have a 9 month old staffy cross here and both were not house trained. Here is what I did: Note my boys slept in the laundry with no outside access... First thing of a morning, we all go to the back yard so they can toilet - I say wees and they would sniff around and as each one did a wee I would say 'good boy, wees.' After every hour or so, you need to do this again and again. Make sure you do it right before bed to, after they drink or eat or have a play/training session. It took about a week before they both got it and the staffy still has the odd accident. His accidents are my fault - he is inside with me all the time (however has access to outside of a day), and if we do some playing or training and I forget, he might wee in the same spot he did when he arrived (has only happened a couple of times)... The key is consistency - you have to keep taking them out and keep telling them good job, good dog.. Make a fuss and use treats to if you want to... Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest lavendergirl Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 I agree with the crate training and/or leash :) Just don't do what my stupid neighbour does with their 8mnth old rescue dog and rub her nose in it day after day and get pissed that "the stupid dog still doesn't get it". I am sure you have never done that Roova :) He is so mean to that poor dog Sounds like she needs to be rescued a second time - have you told him that method went out with the dark ages? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LizT Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 I agree with the crate training and/or leash :) Just don't do what my stupid neighbour does with their 8mnth old rescue dog and rub her nose in it day after day and get pissed that "the stupid dog still doesn't get it". I am sure you have never done that Roova :) He is so mean to that poor dog OM doG, are there still people who do that!!!!????? Roova if she is an ex show dog she should cope with being in a crate for short periods, when you can't watch her? Try the lead toileting but the less accidents inside and the more toileting outside the better things will become. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
german_shep_fan Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 I agree with the crate training and/or leash :) Just don't do what my stupid neighbour does with their 8mnth old rescue dog and rub her nose in it day after day and get pissed that "the stupid dog still doesn't get it". I am sure you have never done that Roova :) He is so mean to that poor dog Sounds like she needs to be rescued a second time - have you told him that method went out with the dark ages? He is such an arrogant so and so, he doesn't listen, he has even asked me for advice before and then doesn't take any notice of what i say anyway. This is their first dog and they just have no idea at all. The foster home they got her from told them to take her obedience training and they haven't. Pretty sure they have no intention of it either He asked how to clip her nails so i explained it to him. He came and saw me over the fence later that day and he was like oh oops i should of stopped clipping where you told me, blood everywhere They then didnt connect why she didnt want to go for a walk the following morning either. I could go on and on abt this bloke but just ugh, shouldn't own a dog... Sorry to take your post off track Roova, hope you find a method that works for you :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Her Majesty Dogmad Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 I have an ex show dog here, she lived in a kennel situation for 8 yrs. She's also a breed that is very difficult to housetrain. I took her and another dog, slightly younger, and used my method of housetraining and it worked. The only additional thing I had to do was give all my dogs raw pineapple in their dinners for 3 days because the new dogs were eating it ... I put all new foster dogs in crates at night and rush them outside first thing. This also proved a small challenge with the older dog who would just poo in the crate and eat it or leave it ..... gawd. She did get it eventually, just kindness, patience and practice - I'd say it took a couple of weeks. I've also housetarined a 15 yr old dog I rescued last Easter using the same method. Make no mistake - with many dogs it is hard work, I'm experiencing difficulties with a current older dog who has never been inside a house before. He's very reluctant to use the dog door when I'm at work and he's the second dog in a row I've had like that. Have had many dogs over the years and have always been quite lucky! HOUSETRAINING TIPS Ok - first thing to do is decide on the command (I call it “do wees”) you will repeat over and over. You have to really focus on the dog for about 2-3 days to be successful. You have a pocketful of special treats on hand all the time for the first 2-3 days. Walk the dog several times a day and every time the dog wees, you get very excited and keep saying “Good boy/girl, do wees, do wees” – give the dog treats every time. First thing in the morning, last thing at night and every time you see the dog eat or drink (both precursors to weeing) whisk the dog into the garden and repeat the command “do wees”. Get very excited and present treats every time dog goes. The dog’s aim in life is to please you. If the dog should have an accident inside the house – say NOTHING at all. The dog soon gets the idea that when he/she goes outside you are really, really pleased and he/she gets rewarded. NB: Please note that the smell of urine must be properly removed for any housetraining to be successful. There are products on the market such as “Urine Off” but they are very expensive. A mix of white vinegar and water is a much cheaper alternative and should work for tiles and other surfaces although you should always take care with wood etc. For carpet/rugs, I use either a mixture of Napisan/water or bicarb of soda and water. I completely soak the stain using a dab on technique with a cloth. When it is very wet, I use an old towel to soak up the excess moisture. Again, be careful on any expensive carpet/rug, I have never had any problems but I cannot guarantee any method here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Her Majesty Dogmad Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 (edited) I should say that I always close the doors to other rooms when in training mode and take up all rugs etc. Most ex showdogs are trained to pee on pads, maybe you could check with the breeder and you can do something similar initially such as get a pee pad and keep it close to the door. As the door is open, gradually start moving it over a few days, until the pee pad is outside. You can leave the old pee pads on the lawn and she can sniff them, I've used this old trick before. It encourages the dog to go outside. Edited January 19, 2012 by dogmad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
percyk Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 older dogs can be trained get an eyelet into the skirting boards around ur house or tie a leash round heavy furniture and provide baskets then take out regularly u can take her around on a leash ...never ever let her roam free the fewer accidents she starts having..the sooner she will get into good habits crating is an option too for when ur around or out for short periods ...upto four hours good luck shell be fine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roova Posted January 21, 2012 Author Share Posted January 21, 2012 I thought I'd add a quick update. I've been taking Maggie out at night around every hour and so far, 3 days in, no accidents in the house When I take her out I end up standing there for ten minutes waiting for action while she pounces on moths and has a great old time. Im hoping this will get a bit quicker over time. One question I have is when I take her out I've been saing 'do wees' until she eventually does and then lots of praise. Im worried I'll desensitise her to the words if I just keep saying them all the time so should I be waiting for the moment she wees and then say 'do wees' and praise? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Her Majesty Dogmad Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 "do wees" is the command so you say that in the normal voice, when she goes you praise her and say "good girl, do wees" in the high pitched tone. Eventually you should just be able to take her out, tell her to do wees and she should respond, you can simply praise her then without saying "do wees" as she has obviously learned what it is. My dogs take themselves out now but occasionally I have need to tell them to go and they still will and I still praise them as they've done what I asked. Sounds like she's doing well - good news! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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