Cavamum Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 I have to say that every 10 years or so there seems to be a new fad with how to train dogs, feed dogs etc. Many of these make me uncomfortable and then some guru says "actually that is not the right thing to do, we should all do this." Number one: Choker chains, when I was growing up I was made to put a choker chain on my dog because that is what my parents said because the 'guru's' said "This will train your dog to not pull on a lead!" Yet it didn't matter how many times you walked your dog it wheezed and coughed from pulling on the lead. Now finally they say "Choker chains aren't good" Number 2: Royal Canin - The premium pet food. My cats and pup are eating this stuff and have the worst flaky dandruffy skin! I am switching them to raw! Number 3: Raw - Provide 50 million supplements for your dog and then tell you it is cheaper. I am going to give my dog raw and some fish oil and evening primrose oil and that's it. We will see how I go. Number 4: Crate training - I think that in 10 years the guru's will say that this is cruel and not the way to train your pup. Confining a pup in a high traffic area where it can see you but not get to you? After 2 weeks of hell and no sleep with Bella, she had begun taking herself off to our Bathroom to sleep during the day. I thought "okay well that is her 'safe place' then. Just like toddlers when we put them to sleep we don't do it in the lounge room! I put her in the bathroom that night with some puppy pads, toys and water and haven't heard a peep since we have been using that as 'her place'. As for potty training, I only made head way with Bella when I stopped using the crate. I took her out after eating and sleeping and at various other times and she is doing great! The only time she has an accident now is when she is "too busy to go potty" like when she is playing with the cats. She holds it during the night too. Experts also say that you should stop giving food and water an hour before they are crated do they do not need to go during the night. I WILL NEVER DEPRIVE MY PUP OF HYDRATION! I put the puppy pads down just in case she needs them. So yeah, I am sick of the fads but interested to see what the next person who wants to bring out a book to make a buck has to say, as for following it - nah. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldenGirl85 Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 I don't see the point in this...if you don't like what the 'experts' say...then don't do it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pie Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 (edited) 1: Well it depends on how each method is used really - some people still do like choker chains and they can work if used properly - you can't just put a choker on and expect your dog not to pull like magic. 2: Different foods work for different dogs, my dog doesn't do well with Eagle Pack Holistic, yet does okay on other similar brands. 3: I do feed some raw, there are quite a few ways to do it and you don't necessarily have to give your dogs supplements. I'm not sure it works out cheaper in all cases 4: I don't think crate training is cruel personally, and my dog actually prefers his crate to sleep in even when given the option to sleep on the bed. Also if you show or do dog sports your dog needs to be crate trained ideally, for it's own safety more than anything. Not sure what the issue about withholding water is... I don't know about your dogs but mine don't drink while they sleep! ETA I think you need to do more research on these things before you launch into a rant about them... one person's way isn't necessarily the best for your dog, keep an open mind and be open to adapt things to suit your dog. Edited January 13, 2012 by amypie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wuffles Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 I agree with previous posters, I never do things "because they are a fad", I do things because I think they will be good for my dog. If they are not, I stop. The things you mention are popular because they work for many people (but not all). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nekhbet Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 none of those are fads. As for correction chains your dog wheezed and coughed because it was being used in the totally wrong manner. And foods? You use what your dog does well on. There is not one thing that works for everyone. If you're going to complain about things at least use them properly before making a decision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kavik Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 (edited) What amypie said. 1) check chains are effective if used properly but using them is a skill you need to develop 2)It is a good idea to experiment with different brands of food if you don't like the one you are using - research into ingredients can help 3) raw isn't suited to everyone - I don't have enough freezer space and found it expensive and I stressed about the balance 4)you don't have to crate train but it can come in very handy in many circumstances - if you do a search there are MANY topics on this. It only took mine a few nights to get used to sleeping there, and it is very useful at training and competitions EFS Edited January 13, 2012 by Kavik Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
**Super_Dogs** Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 I agree there are fads - but this is the case with everything! In the business world they just make a new catchy name :D . However I think in dog training these are not just fads - there have been have real improvements to training methods. IMO crate training is only good when the puppy/dog if trained properly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 You call them 'fads' ..and come across as being angry that you have been duped ... Your choice to try them - they are not compulsory. Chain collars are a very useful tool .. and are successfully used by owners trained in their correct application :) Dog food manufacturers try and develop new products to catch a market, sure - so do chocolate manufacturers, and coffee producers! Dogs are all individual, and may do better on one sort of protein/combination ,than another. It is the owners who are reading labels, and making decisions ..like the supplements.Lots of dogs are fed a comprehensive mix of foods which are complete in themselves ..no need to add bottled/packet supplements :) I have never used a crate, but have used short tethers , many years ago .. a similar principle . I can see many benefits of crate training with today's lifestyles .. but have no need of it for my dogs . yes, there are all sorts of methods/products on offer - however, it is the dog owner who knows their dog ,and makes the final decision as to what to use/buy. Just because something is *new and improved* doesn't mean someone should rush out and get it to solve their problems . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
huski Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 I took her out after eating and sleeping and at various other times and she is doing great! Weren't you doing this when crate training her? I agree with everyone else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Fox Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 1. Check chains used properly work well. Always have, always will. They are not and never have been a 'fad'. 2. Some dogs do well on RC, some dogs don't. No different to any other food really? 3. You do not need to use "50 million supplements" if you feed raw. Like vitamins for humans, they are an optional extra... 4. Crate training may have gained more popularity in recent years (in Australia) but it is not new, nor is it a fad. If you want to talk fads, how about puppy pre-schools, head collars and "purely positive" training? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minimiss Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 I agree with all of the above! These certainly aren't 'fads' and there is extensive research behind all that you've accused of being a fad, and useless. Crate training especially is very useful when done correctly. I had never crate trained before and I decided to with my Pomeranian. I put the crate beside my bed at night time and let him out every couple of hours to toilet so he got the idea. Now he will let me know throughout the night when he wants to go toilet. He doesn't cry, or bark throughout the night and he also puts himself to bed when he knows it's bedtime. All I need to do is close the crate 'door'. He does the rest. :) I would crate train any future puppies and I would recommend it to others too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maddy Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Number 3: Raw - Provide 50 million supplements for your dog and then tell you it is cheaper. I am going to give my dog raw and some fish oil and evening primrose oil and that's it. We will see how I go. I'm feeding five large dogs and the average cost per day is about $2 per dog. They get a great diet- fresh lamb, roo, chicken, a bit of beef and a small amount of fish (as well as extras like untreated hides and homemade liver treats). They get Livermol for their coats, Feramo to make sure they're getting any extras they need and vitamin E to keep their skin decent. I buy everything in bulk and it works out very cheaply. The dogs love their food, it's not much work and the fosters (who are ex racers and so not always in the best condition when they arrive) pick up within two to four weeks. If you don't want to spend the money on BARF patties or VAN.. don't. As for crate training.. some dogs like them, some don't. I have one boy here who stands in front of the crate and paws at it to nag me into opening the door for him. I have another dog who wouldn't get into a crate for all the ham in the free world. Do whatever works for you but understand that other people have a lot of success with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brennan's Mum Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Hmm agree with other posters. As for Crate training- I never deprive my dog of water whilst she is in the crate. She always has a bowl of fresh water as well as her bedding. If she goes toilet whilst crated I simply wash the bedding/ mat and air out the crate/room. Royal Canin- Just because it may be well publicised/ well regarded does not mean it is the best food for each and every dog. There are many threads on DOL where DOLers share what they feed their dogs and their opinion on certain foods. Thankfully nowadays we do have such a wide range of dog food available to feed our dogs. There is no rule that says you have to follow any of these 'fads'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SupaDupa Mini Cooper Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 I totally agree with the above posters. I am totally new to all things "dog", but having recently read Cesar Millan's "Be the pack leader" I learnt about methods of controlling dogs - including choke chains, and after reading his advice I think it would be useful in controlling particular large breed dogs once the handler is trained in how to use it (same as pinch collars). When we decided on a food, I compared the one I am currently using to a "premium" food and found very little difference except the price was double. Just because it calls itself premium doesn't mean much to me, and after learning that dogs can't digest grains/vegetables easily there is no way I would buy a puppy food that has the main ingredient as corn (RC)instead of meat. I am looking into holistic options though, because I don't think what I am using is the best, but that doesn't mean I will ever find the best either... you're the owner, you decide what food you should feed. As a first time dog (puppy) owner, I would worry about feeding raw or BARF only because I don't have the understanding of what needs to be fed and quantities - the same as I wouldn't just become vegetarian because I don't understand the balances I would need to consume to get a well rounded diet. It's all personal choice. As for crate training, it wasn't until about 1 week before we got our puppy that I knew what that even was! It made sense to me, and we have implemented it from his first day home and we have had no issues. We use it for overnight and when we are out, not for when we are home and he is locked up while we are doing things - but it is a personal choice, if it works for you, great. If not, then try something else. I don't consider myself cruel for putting my puppy in a safe place where he cannot cause harm to either the house or himself while I am not around to supervise. I also don't consider myself cruel for not giving access to food or water while in the crate, because I know he can go a few hours during the day without both, and he sleeps peacefully at night so has no need for either. It's your dog, living with you, so you need to decide what's best for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacqui835 Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Super Cooper, I think what you're expressing is what everyone goes through to some extent. We all want to do what's best for our dogs and I at least feel angry when I find out I've been 'lied' to (as in the case of particular dog foods and vets). My poor dog has been through so many different training styles, dog foods etc I couldn't even list them all (luckily he has a good attitude about it all and hey, I can easily switch his diet instantly now and not have to worry about him needing a gradual transition or anything). But at the end of the day, my approach today is yeah I'll try anything if it doesn't 'seem' completely wrong (for example I refused to try some of the harsher training methods and because I can't physically control him I have focused on other strategies) and if it works for Sammy we keep it. Sammy could have been crate trained but we didn't and I don't see the need to now, he gets into cages just fine when I need him to. I think the most important thing to remember is that everyone's dog is different and then your individual dogs are different too, so as long as you're interacting with your dog and paying attention to what they have to 'say' I'm sure everyone here will work out what works for them :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crisovar Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 I have to say that every 10 years or so there seems to be a new fad with how to train dogs, feed dogs etc. Many of these make me uncomfortable and then some guru says "actually that is not the right thing to do, we should all do this." Number one: Choker chains, when I was growing up I was made to put a choker chain on my dog because that is what my parents said because the 'guru's' said "This will train your dog to not pull on a lead!" Yet it didn't matter how many times you walked your dog it wheezed and coughed from pulling on the lead. Now finally they say "Choker chains aren't good" Number 2: Royal Canin - The premium pet food. My cats and pup are eating this stuff and have the worst flaky dandruffy skin! I am switching them to raw! Number 3: Raw - Provide 50 million supplements for your dog and then tell you it is cheaper. I am going to give my dog raw and some fish oil and evening primrose oil and that's it. We will see how I go. Number 4: Crate training - I think that in 10 years the guru's will say that this is cruel and not the way to train your pup. Confining a pup in a high traffic area where it can see you but not get to you? After 2 weeks of hell and no sleep with Bella, she had begun taking herself off to our Bathroom to sleep during the day. I thought "okay well that is her 'safe place' then. Just like toddlers when we put them to sleep we don't do it in the lounge room! I put her in the bathroom that night with some puppy pads, toys and water and haven't heard a peep since we have been using that as 'her place'. As for potty training, I only made head way with Bella when I stopped using the crate. I took her out after eating and sleeping and at various other times and she is doing great! The only time she has an accident now is when she is "too busy to go potty" like when she is playing with the cats. She holds it during the night too. Experts also say that you should stop giving food and water an hour before they are crated do they do not need to go during the night. I WILL NEVER DEPRIVE MY PUP OF HYDRATION! I put the puppy pads down just in case she needs them. So yeah, I am sick of the fads but interested to see what the next person who wants to bring out a book to make a buck has to say, as for following it - nah. Sounds like you are having a bad day. What you need to do is breathe and then realise that different tools, methods, foods etc work for different situations, something is not bad or evil if it is simply the wrong choice at the time. There is no one size fits all for anything in life and that includes how we feed and raise our dogs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cavamum Posted January 13, 2012 Author Share Posted January 13, 2012 I have done a lot of research on training methods and food etc, I did this before I bought my puppy in order to prepare myself for her arrival. When people write articles about various types of training they are so set on it that they convince you it is the only way to get results. There is no need to 'gang up' on people for writing about the issues and findings they have come across when trailing things. With regards to the water thing, don't you ever wake up thirsty on a hot summer night? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 (edited) don't you ever wake up thirsty on a hot summer night? Actually, No...and we don't have aircon in bedrooms either ... (and yes it gets hot here ) ;) I will have a drink if I need painkillers in the middle of the night, though ! Sorry if you feel that we are 'ganging up' on you .... Edited January 13, 2012 by persephone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dame Aussie Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 1) I don't use chokers and agree that they don't work a lot of the time but this is only when they are being used incorrectly. They aren't a fad, just one tool of many that can be utilised. 2) & 3) I agree that the best food is the food your dog does best on. I feed a mixture of raw and kibble and our dogs look fantastic, are healthy, and love their meals. 4) I don't crate train, I have found it more than easy to toilet train without one and I don't really like them, but have no problem with people who do choose to use them. I would also leave water in a crate if I were using one but that's just me :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 (edited) different tools, methods, foods etc work for different situations, something is not bad or evil if it is simply the wrong choice at the timeThere is no one size fits all for anything in life and that includes how we feed and raise our dogs. Good explanation . Edited January 13, 2012 by persephone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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