Cosmolo Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 What a good girl Lucy was- all of your hard work is paying off. I thought it would be a given that repeat offenders would need to work on lead? I have also used the Troy Behave with sucess in some dogs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BC Crazy Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 Way to go Lucy. You did very well girl. Don't be too hard on yourself Megan. I think you did well. It is all very well for people to say 'don't panic' etc but Lucy is your dog, not their's & in the heat of the moment it is very hard to keep calm at times. Although I do understand it benefits all concerned to remain in control, I believe that too is a learn't behaviour. One which I'm working on as well. You should be a proud mum today :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bianca.a Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 Thank you all very much for your responses. Molly has had a history of freaking out. She has had more than one complete blood count and urinalysis. My vet even thought perhaps lead poisoning. We have recently ruled out thyroid issues. I am on anti-dep myself but I just really wanted to exhaust almost every other option for her first. Don't ask my why, I'm not sure, it just didn't sit right with me for some reason. I have tried body-wrapping before and also DAP, rescue remedy and Animals Apawthecary tranqulity blend (which did help my cat). I am still waiting for the Cholodin (from the US) but I think she will go onto Prozac anyway. Yesterday the poor girl was shaking for no reason that I could see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BC Crazy Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 Biannca.a, I can so relate to the way you feel about putting Molly on anti-dep & I was struggling with it myself for a long time. Now though I can see how much it benefits Stella & I am so happy I did. Don't know why I struggle with it? Maybe because I used to think god I can't even take care of Stella or control her outbursts, this is a dog for heavens sake. How hard could this be??? When you really look at the whole picture it is out of your control because they are 'in balanced' in their mind, poor things. I too was on Endep for many years, so you'd think I could come to terms with it more easily than what I have. As we speak my girl is relaxing on our back deck after her long walk & swim this morning. This would of never happened without meds. She was like Molly pretty much a nervous/anxious cot case most of the day. She'd jump out of her skin at the slightest sound & then run frantically, whining for hours on end To witness this behaviour on a daily basis & not do what ever it takes to help her would be cruel & heartless IMHO. I couldn't do it any more.I did, like you, try everything just about & meds were my last resort. The only regret I have is I wish I had started Stella on them earlier. Poor Molly, I hope she is having a better day today & you find her the help she needs. Good luck & keep us posted :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BC Crazy Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 (edited) Snook, so pleased Justice is going so well. You sure are racking up some very memorable wins & you should be beaming with pride cause I sure would be. You have put lots of work/time into Justice which has certainly paid off. Well done :) Thanks for your kind words regarding my girl. Stella is much calmer on most days at home which I am very happy about. We still have bad days but she recovers quicker & doesn't quite get to those extreme levels she once did :) Edited October 21, 2012 by BC Crazy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smartypaws Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 Thank you all very much for your responses. Molly has had a history of freaking out. She has had more than one complete blood count and urinalysis. My vet even thought perhaps lead poisoning. We have recently ruled out thyroid issues. I am on anti-dep myself but I just really wanted to exhaust almost every other option for her first. Don't ask my why, I'm not sure, it just didn't sit right with me for some reason. I have tried body-wrapping before and also DAP, rescue remedy and Animals Apawthecary tranqulity blend (which did help my cat). I am still waiting for the Cholodin (from the US) but I think she will go onto Prozac anyway. Yesterday the poor girl was shaking for no reason that I could see. Hi Bianca. Just wanted to say that my boy has been on Prozac for 10 weeks now. He is also on Trazadone. We are about to increase his Prozac as the combination of drugs seems to be helping but we need to see if the Prozac can do the job alone (and hopefully better). You are absolutely doing the right thing for Molly, just keep in mind that Prozac takes 6-8 weeks to reach therapeutic levels, and getting the dosage right can also be a matter of trial and error. Hope Cooper is doing well too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BC Crazy Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Yes Smartypaws you don't get instant results with meds. It took good month to five weeks before I noticed a significant change in Stella but I will say after about 2 weeks in there were very subtle differences in her behaviour. Just simple signals like she would react to something but then stop & just stand still for a moment. That wouldn't of happened before, there would be no stopping if she was aroused. She also started to lay down & her little eye lids would blink just slightly slower,she'd give a big exhale & lower her head down to lay flat out. Another first. Glad to hear your boy is also benefiting from some carefully monitored meds SM. It is so nice to see them at peace with themselves, isn't it. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smartypaws Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Yes Smartypaws you don't get instant results with meds. It took good month to five weeks before I noticed a significant change in Stella but I will say after about 2 weeks in there were very subtle differences in her behaviour. Just simple signals like she would react to something but then stop & just stand still for a moment. That wouldn't of happened before, there would be no stopping if she was aroused. She also started to lay down & her little eye lids would blink just slightly slower,she'd give a big exhale & lower her head down to lay flat out. Another first. Glad to hear your boy is also benefiting from some carefully monitored meds SM. It is so nice to see them at peace with themselves, isn't it. :) Wow! That's great for Stella......and you! You are fortunate to note such a significant shift in such a short space of time......as I recall, Stella started on meds after my fellow did? There are improvements with my boy, but our recent trip to Sydney for a follow-up with the VB showed just how anxious he still is. He has improved at home in regards to a decreased startle response, quicker recovery and less ceaseless restlessness, but he is still very much an anxious dog underneath. Stress is cumulative for him, so by the time we arrived home from a three day trip to Sydney he was out of his mind and took 24 hours to recover. I knew the trip would take it's toll on him, and in hindsight I probably should have just skyped the appt, but I thought it was important for the VB to see him under the same circumstances as the inital consult to assess what kind of result we were getting with the meds.........live and learn hey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bianca.a Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Thank you very much Smartypaws. I appreciate your story and I am happy that your boy is starting to see good results :) Well the cholodin I ordered arrived today so I am going to give it 2 weeks tops and then I will either put her on Prozac or see if I could try endep. Thank you so much for asking after Cooper too *hugs*. One of the specialists had to postpone so now we have both appointments on Nov 12. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smartypaws Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 (edited) Thank you very much Smartypaws. I appreciate your story and I am happy that your boy is starting to see good results :) Well the cholodin I ordered arrived today so I am going to give it 2 weeks tops and then I will either put her on Prozac or see if I could try endep. Thank you so much for asking after Cooper too *hugs*. One of the specialists had to postpone so now we have both appointments on Nov 12. Good luck Bianca......I hope the cholodin helps. If not, weigh up the benefits/side effects of Prozac and endep and discuss them with your vet. They work differently on the brain, and depending on the assessment of the route cause of Molly's reactivity, one may be a better first choice than the other. Good luck with Coopers appointment too. You certainly have a bit on your plate at the moment Edited October 22, 2012 by Smartypaws Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grizabella Posted October 23, 2012 Share Posted October 23, 2012 Hi everyone, thought I'd better join this thread as my Bella is reactive towards other dogs. I'm thinking about going to a behaviourist as we've not been making much progress (whenever she seems to be getting better she gets charged by an out of control off-lead dog and she just gets worse again). I am a bit worried about the price of getting a behaviourist to look at her and whether it's worth it if the problem still probably isn't fixable? Bella's reactive on walks, barking and growling at other dogs. She's always walked on-lead. I've found that in situations where there are several other dogs she is not reactive, but nervously interested in them. This is also the case in some parks (not dog parks), and she's met and got along with other dogs in these places. She's fine with other dogs (though usually a bit nervous at first) at obedience lessons and shows which she enjoys, and she loves meeting new dogs for play dates. It's just on walks that she barks and growls at dogs, even if they are far away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poppy's mum Posted October 23, 2012 Share Posted October 23, 2012 WOW Bianca the Prozac is pricey ! Endep is $22 for 6 weeks. Maybe you could inquire about it. Wouldn't hurt to ask. My vet prescribes Lovan, generic Prozac, not the more expensive dog version. 28 tablets $14 (20 mg fluoxetine) if you shop around chemists. You'd have to check with the vet before supplementing eg tryptophan etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bianca.a Posted October 23, 2012 Share Posted October 23, 2012 WOW Bianca the Prozac is pricey ! Endep is $22 for 6 weeks. Maybe you could inquire about it. Wouldn't hurt to ask. My vet prescribes Lovan, generic Prozac, not the more expensive dog version. 28 tablets $14 (20 mg fluoxetine) if you shop around chemists. You'd have to check with the vet before supplementing eg tryptophan etc Thank you :) I know they had to get it in (had never prescribed it before) and they were shocked at the cost too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
megan_ Posted October 23, 2012 Author Share Posted October 23, 2012 Mr Justice is doing so well - I feel proud of a dog I've never met! Salukibel - welcome - I with this club had no members! There are no guarantees with a behaviourist, even with the best one in the world, as it all depends on what your dogs issues are and your ability to implement a mgt plan. More and more I believe that in many cases there isn't a cure for aggression/reactivity, rather you learn how to manage it, know your dogs triggers and keep them below the threshold. For me, "cure" means 100% fixed and you don't need to implement strategies to deal with it anymore, which is a very big ask. My Lucy sounds similar in some ways in that she does actually like other dogs. She just gets overwhelmed by it all and snaps. She has made a few friends and is very happy to see them and has good manners with them. It has been a lot of work and will continue to be for the rest of her life, but she is worth it. That said, I think I've lost 10 years just from stress! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BC Crazy Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 Hi Snook, thanks for posting those utube clips. Kikipup is great. I have just started to do the 'give me eye contact before you can the treat' exercise with Stella as she is very food driven atm & I think that is why we aren't moving forward with training as she is just fully focused on the treats Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeopener Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 I find food reliant training dose not work for all breeds unfortunately do they tell you what to use in place of food at all? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeopener Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 I find food reliant training dose not work for all breeds unfortunately do they tell you what to use in place of food at all? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackJaq Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 You can use anything your dog sees as a reward as the reward. Some dogs will prefer a toy/dummy/squeaker or even just a pat or vocal praise :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
megan_ Posted October 25, 2012 Author Share Posted October 25, 2012 BlackJaq is right, however you have to look at the impact of the reward and see if it is appropriate for what you are trying to achieve. For example, if you have a reactive dog that wants to eat little fluffy who is across the road, a big game of tug might make him more aroused, not less. Food is good because it is quick and you can give rewards in quick succession ("treat, treat, treat"). This can help modify a dog's reaction to a trigger. If your dog doesn't respond to food then I'd simply stop feeding him from a bowl and make him work for all his food. My dogs don't get treats - it is all their standard food. Yesterday Lucy had to go to the vet, so I took her dinner with me, we went 20 mins early and we spent that time playing LAT and doing some training around people and dogs in a small space - that is how she was fed her meal. I can't think of the last time my dogs ate from a bowl! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackJaq Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 Yes, tug of war is not a good option if you are distracting your dog from a "target". Not all rewards are suitable for all dogs in all situations of course :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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