Exercising Reactive Dogs Thread

[Dxenion]

Thanks for the feedback on the Fight book Snook. I had that in my Ahimsa cart and have now deleted it.

[Guest Panzer Attack!]

I saw a pap but didn't know if it was you!

Edit; scooter is sooooooo cute

LOL darn I knew I should have come say hello! He's pretty beautiful in my totally unbiased opinion. I'm pretty sure he's the only Papillon at the club cos we get stopped everywhere we go when we are there! Next time I'll be sure to talk to you :) x

[sheena]

Snook....I tried out the thundershirt last night. I put it on her before we left home for training. For the hour trip into town, it did seem to curb her spinning a bit, but she still stood the whole way watching the cars, but I think it was an improvement. At training she seemed quite a bit more settled & responded really well to my LAT...she couldn't get enough of me. When I took her jacket off for her turn to run the course (we were playing Gamblers), she took off like a rocket & was very responsive to my commands, so I will definately try it again.

Edited August 28, 2012 by sheena

[sheena]

I'll put it on her a bit earlier next week. How snug/tight do you make yours. Mine seems to have a flap that hangs down under her as if the shirt is too big for her, Maybe I could add an extra row of velcro.

[sheena]

Thanks...I think I will add an extra row of velcro. :) I brought it to fit her length, but she is really quite skinny under all the fur, even though I have been rudely told she is fat

[Staff'n'Toller]

I'll put it on her a bit earlier next week. How snug/tight do you make yours. Mine seems to have a flap that hangs down under her as if the shirt is too big for her, Maybe I could add an extra row of velcro.

What size did you buy?

I just brought home a large tonight to experiment with the Toller.

[Miz J]

I wrote on here some time ago about Oliver my deaf boxer who has some "issues". Hes a pretty scared dog essentially and we have been working with Advanced Behavioural Training for a couple of months now. We have him to the point where he knows a warning sign from a dog and he walks away or if realy frightened will come to one of us. He knows how to give another dog a warning sign so that it gives him space. Thanks to the two huskies he has been working with he has come such a long way. Before this Ol did not know what warning signs were so had no idea about the appropriate thing to do in those circumstances so just went in for an attack. He now has options, to walk away, submit, go behind us when hes on lead or come and find us if off lead. He is a dog that will always need his space respected and now he is getting the hang of how to tell other dogs that without aggression. He is still a work in progress. He will be ready for classes soon and it will be with ABT in a really controlled environment to keep his anxiety checked. Looking forward to it, hes come such a long way. Oh BTW they huskies he works with are amazing dogs, they are therapy dogs and its been a real experience to watch them working with him. Never thought we would be able to have him off lead with them. Well done Big O!!

Edited August 28, 2012 by Miz J

[megan_]

Bit of drama for us this morning, but both Lucy and I handled it relatively well.

I have a regular morning walking route that is relatively safe but still provides us with SAFE opportunities to practice LAT and push Miss Lucy (eg we walk past a petrol station that has lots of people coming and going).

I know the dogs on our route and all are contained - until today.

We were happily walking along when I noticed a woman on her porch with an off leash, uncontained dog. Sigh.

Of course out it came running. I managed to handle myself well and call in a firm but calm voice "Get your dog now!". At the same time - and this is hard for me because I'm so unco-ordinated and bad under pressure - but I grabbed a hand full of food from my pocket, threw it on the ground and did a U-turn. By this time the dog was 2m away from us, and decided to eat the food instead of coming to say hello (very lucky it wasn't territorial).

Lucy was alert, but not overreacting. Her tail was a wee bit up, but still in a relatively relaxed wag. Both Fergus and Lucy looked up and me and I remembered to actually praise them as we were doing the u-turn and walking in the other direction. I decided not to play LAT at that point because I needed to keep moving and I didn't want he dog to follow us. Both of mine love praise anyway.

By this time the owner - who had been yelling at her dog to come all this time - caught up to her dog and took it inside. I managed to keep my cool and avoid the urge to tell her that her dog wasn't allowed to be off leash and uncontained, even on her property. Instead, I just kept on focusing on my dogs and we completed our walk without incident.

Things didn't go exactly according to script as I would have liked to have remained more calm and praised Lucy much earlier on, but we both reacted relatively well in the situation - her more so than me. Very proud of my little girl.

I also caught up with an ex-wrok colleague who is doing the delta course that is a fantastic trainer. She is someone who is interested in the psychology of dogs and people. She has been doing a fair bit of BAT with dogs so I'm interested in pursuing that with her further.

ETA: Welcome Miz J. It sounds like you're seeing the same trainer as Snook?

Edited August 28, 2012 by megan_

[Tassie]

Sounds like you handled the situation just fine megan. Well done!

[megan_]

I've been rudely told Justice had "gotten quite solid" but unfortunately they were right. Trying to get weight off him while training him with food isn't easy, that's for sure.

I use their normal food for training. Small kibble is good high frequency rewards. I feed a combo of raw and good quality dry. I also like the idea of them working for their food, rather than it being laid out in a bowl for them.

[sheena]

I'll put it on her a bit earlier next week. How snug/tight do you make yours. Mine seems to have a flap that hangs down under her as if the shirt is too big for her, Maybe I could add an extra row of velcro.

What size did you buy?

I just brought home a large tonight to experiment with the Toller.

It's Large size. I have just bought some velcro today to add to it.

[BC Crazy]

I brought a medium size Thunder Shirt online for Stella. She is a medium size BC. & weighs 16 kg. I ended up giving it to my mum for her dog as it was too small & brought the large size which fits her perfectly. So yes the sizing is a bit on the small side I found as well. Had to buy boring grey this time not the nice pink she had first time around not that she is any the wiser lol. I only have one concern & that is when summer rocks arounds Im worried she will get too hot with it on?

Edited August 29, 2012 by BC Crazy

[BC Crazy]

Thanks snook. I am very careful about exercising them in the heat & probably a little paranoid as I lost my last BC to heat stroke His larricks had collapsed. So you can understand my worries there.

[BC Crazy]

Fingers crossed for a better morning out with Stella than yesterday. She bailed up 2 BC's on separate occassions. One an older girl & the other around her own age, both submissive She seems to be a bully at times & charges up to a shy dog. Likes to stand over them, until they lie down. She growls & sometimes bares her teeth. I don't know how to handle this apart from call her & put her back on lead. Yesterday I called her & she came back but I am finding she bolts back to her victim as soon as they try to get up for one last growl & then returns to me if I'm not quick enough to clip her lead on. This behaviour is very hard for me to predict as she only does this to "certain" dogs, others are fine. She is a very vocal girl & it all sounds worse than it probably is but I just don't know how to correct this type of behaviour. Yesterday she lost her freedom after the second incident & remained on her leash. She doesn't actually fight these poor dogs, always seems to be bitches btw, just likes to bully them into submission. Any suggestions or folks who have similar issues ? I find this type of behaviour very upsetting as Stella is a very sweet, effectionate girl usually.

[megan_]

Are you able to get some professional help?

Personally, if she was my dog, she wouldn't be offleash until this issue is worked through. Luckily the other dogs backed down - not all will though.

[sheena]

Thanks snook. I am very careful about exercising them in the heat & probably a little paranoid as I lost my last BC to heat stroke His larricks had collapsed. So you can understand my worries there.

This is what worries me about using it for thunder, as it is usually hot & humid when we get the thunderstorms in the middle of summer & I am worried she will overheat, especially since some of the storms go for hours

[BC Crazy]

Are you able to get some professional help?

Personally, if she was my dog, she wouldn't be offleash until this issue is worked through. Luckily the other dogs backed down - not all will though.

I have had her to a behavourist & she said it was because of her reactivity that she charges at other dogs. I did voice my concern that she is going to pick the "wrong' dog

to do this to one day & Stella will come off second best. The trainer said she is very smart girl & she knows what dogs to avoid & what dogs to boss.And she does roll straight over on

her back most times & is as nice as pie when approached by some dogs.I find she ignores 70% of dogs usually. She used to get quite angry on lead as well on occassion if certain dogs approached, again

hard to predict which ones would make her react & which ones wouldn't.

She has improved a lot using LAT but it is because with this particular issue of her charging at other dogs it is very random & she gives no warning as to when it will occur. So I can't predict it

Took her out this morning & she was an angel. Didn't bully anyone's dogs. She even walked right past one of the very same BC's that she went at yesterday & completely ignored it Just like it wasn't there.

This is what makes this issue so frustrating for me.

Edited August 30, 2012 by BC Crazy

[megan_]

Yip - I agree with Snook. I'd see someone else. Even if other dogs don't fight back, she is reinforcing the behaviour every time she does it (I bail up other dogs, they submit, bailing up other dogs is the way to go).

[Guest Panzer Attack!]

BC Crazy, my dog is a milder version of Stella. He's been rushed at dog club, by off lead dogs when he's on lead and bitten through the OH's fence. I'm doing a lot remedial work with him at the moment, he's meeting dogs in 'safe' areas and we work at club away from the other dogs, on lead. He'll always be nervous around other dogs now, thanks to the irresponsible people that think their dog is friendly as it runs at mine with bared teeth, and it is SO hard to work around the behaviour, so I feel your pain.

We do a lot of clicker work, and if he is in a situation that I think he will be uncomfortable in, I immediately remove him. I walk him at times where the odds of meeting other dogs are low (the middle of the day during weekdays if I'm not working, very early in the morning or late at night) and am currently doing a lot of focus work. We also have reliable tricks that he can perform for me to check his arousal levels (sit, touch, down) and if he's not coping, we leave the situation. I can't even work him in OH's yard at the moment for longer than one minute before he completely loses his shit!

The number one thing you can do is make it impossible for her to charge dogs. Put her on a long lead (5m) and walk her in parks like that, so if you see another dog in the distance you can gather her straight away and remove her. If she's off lead and you call her, you're giving her a choice - and it sounds like she chooses to defend herself right now. You need to remove that choice until she knows she can trust you.

:)

edited cos I've been thinking after I hit 'send' - and I think it's really f-ing annoying when you have a 'cute' dog like a BC or Pap (or Mini Schnauzer!) because people automatically assume they're going to be cuddly and sweet and wonderful, and no matter how much you scream at someone, the Awww Factor is hardwired right in there and makes it nearly impossible to get them to piss off! My dog is head shy, especially around people he doesn't know, and he won't bite due to the work I've put into him (I completely trust him) BUT god I hate it when people crowd him and try to pat him as he and I are both trying to get away! So I think this 'logic' translates to them being auto-dog friendly too. "It's so cute, how could it be mean?!" I've had a club instructor insist that Scooter would just LOVE her dog as I was backing away from them and of course he snapped at it... she was never nice to him after that lol. Until you know she can handle it, avoid this situations at all costs.

Edited August 30, 2012 by Panzer Attack!

[BC Crazy]

Thanks guys for all your input.

Snook & Megan. I am thinking of going to see a trainer again to get some more help with Stella. I can only go to private sessions with her as I think she wouldn't cope with anything in a group

& there is just no clubs or facilities in my area. So I have to travel out of the area.

Panzer Attack. Sounds like your dog & Stella were made out of the same mould. What you have said makes perfect sense. And yes at times she is extremely difficult to handle.Perfect example was yesterday.

I do use a long lead & had it on yesterday when we were walking through the bush where there usually is NO other dogs, only people. But yesterday we came across a young guy walking his aged BC, so I immediately tried to take up

the slack in the lead to get her under control by the time we were walking past him but Stella had other ideas & took off & dragged me down the hill to "meet" the BC, all the while barking & carrying on. More rope burnt hands

for me. As soon as she was done standing over this old girl, which was like 5 seconds, she is as calm as & looks at me like, "what", lets go then I roused on her verbally, then ignored her for a long while. I was too cranky

& upset with myself to do anything else.

Your edit is so true also & it ticks me off too. I avoid all other dogs whenever possible. I walk when I know it isn't as busy & get as far as I can away from everyone but people see my 2 & it's like, "Oh hello" & head over with

their dog for a "play" ERRRRR, go away please !!!!

Today my girl was perfect. It is so very frustrating isn't it when you know how good they can be? I will attempt to battle on regardless as I won't let little miss Stella get the better of me. She is really such a sweet natured

girl.