hilaryo Posted November 23, 2011 Author Share Posted November 23, 2011 Sorry for the delay in replying. Thank you for all the suggestions T&W boy has now had 4 feeds with no vomiting or crying (touch wood). We are praying he has turned the corner with whatever has been upsetting his tummy. Tri boy fabulous, with no sign of anything wrong. Both feeding around every 1.5 hrs. We were prepared to start bottle feeding as suggested by Aziah if there was any more crying and vomiting but he is OK so far. Macey has been given some Inner Health Plus in her dinner as I don't have any Protexin on hand. We will start puppy on something tomorrow. We left the poor dead puppy in the whelping box for around 20 minutes after she died. It was absolutely the right thing to do, again suggested by Aziah. She went to her several times licking her all over, etc. Really amazing to see, she would nudge and then look for movement. I swear she was watching for it. Finally she seemed to give up and we removed the puppy. We have been incredibly lucky with litters in the last 9 years with no losses - I guess it was bound to happen sooner or later. First having to euthanize a perfect puppy bitch with nothing wrong with her health, then loosing the tiny baby girl that had such a feisty little spirit. Heartbreaking! Fingers crossed that our boy is on the mend and will report back in in the morning. Thanks again. Hilary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oakway Posted November 23, 2011 Share Posted November 23, 2011 Fingers crossed for you. Sounds as though things may have turned the corner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkey Trip Posted November 23, 2011 Share Posted November 23, 2011 Sorry, have only just read this and hope all is well now that the bitch has completed her course of antibiotics. - If antibiotics are given they will impact on the normal gut flora of both the lactating dam and her puppies, as each time they feed the pups will also be getting a dose of antibiotic via the dam's milk. While the bitch is under antibiotic medication it is absolutely essential to give the pups some natural yoghurt - she can have some yoghurt too however she will not be as vulnerable as the newborn puppies and will probably not show any symptoms of gut flora imbalance. The symptoms as you describe could well be caused by the pups' ingestion of their mother's antibiotics via her milk, which has completely unbalanced (or virtually wiped out) their own healthy gut flora. Intevention is easy - just half an eyedropper of natural yoghurt syringed or squeezed out onto the tongue (let the pup swallow slowly - don't squirt it) or, simply dip your little fingertip into the natural yoghurt and wipe it off onto the top palate of the pup's mouth. While this may not have been your particular problem this time, there is nothing to lose in giving natural yoghurt to the newborn pups as an "antidote" to the potential gut effects of the post CS antibiotics. We have always used this routine for newborn CS pups (especially important if you see signs of indigestion such as vomiting/salivation or liquid, bright yellow "poos" The beneficial effects or turnaround of symptoms after just one or two feeds of natural yoghurt are both rapid and amazing. Protexin would be most effective as well, but often it is not readily on hand when needed and natural yoghurt is plus, it is also an easily digested food supplement and thus gives a quick pick-up to a poorly pup. Best wishes, hope all goes well from now on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted November 23, 2011 Share Posted November 23, 2011 Hope today is a happier one for you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hilaryo Posted November 23, 2011 Author Share Posted November 23, 2011 I slept next to the box last night and the pups had a great night with regular feeding. I woke T&W boy a couple of times early on as the tri was awake and starting to feed and he was a touch lethargic until he had one teat then he went straight for a second. No vomiting only a couple of short crying period (2 mins) but that was before midnight. Will do a weighin soon Don't know what the heck has been wrong but really looking positive now Hilary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trisven13 Posted November 23, 2011 Share Posted November 23, 2011 So happy to wake up to this news Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aziah Posted November 23, 2011 Share Posted November 23, 2011 The bitch doesn't have mastitis BB she is fine it's the pups not doing well and the amtiniotics could be causing rheir gut upset or it could be somerhing more sinister, hopefully not. How are they doing Hilaryo? I didnt say that she did have mastitis. I was mentioning one way to check. And mastitis in the first instance may not show up to the untrained eye. And in many cases if the pups are not well it can be because of something that mum is passing on to them I didn't say you did my post was in reply to BB (Bilbo Baggins) Sorry, have only just read this and hope all is well now that the bitch has completed her course of antibiotics. - If antibiotics are given they will impact on the normal gut flora of both the lactating dam and her puppies, as each time they feed the pups will also be getting a dose of antibiotic via the dam's milk. While the bitch is under antibiotic medication it is absolutely essential to give the pups some natural yoghurt - she can have some yoghurt too however she will not be as vulnerable as the newborn puppies and will probably not show any symptoms of gut flora imbalance. The symptoms as you describe could well be caused by the pups' ingestion of their mother's antibiotics via her milk, which has completely unbalanced (or virtually wiped out) their own healthy gut flora. Intevention is easy - just half an eyedropper of natural yoghurt syringed or squeezed out onto the tongue (let the pup swallow slowly - don't squirt it) or, simply dip your little fingertip into the natural yoghurt and wipe it off onto the top palate of the pup's mouth. While this may not have been your particular problem this time, there is nothing to lose in giving natural yoghurt to the newborn pups as an "antidote" to the potential gut effects of the post CS antibiotics. We have always used this routine for newborn CS pups (especially important if you see signs of indigestion such as vomiting/salivation or liquid, bright yellow "poos" The beneficial effects or turnaround of symptoms after just one or two feeds of natural yoghurt are both rapid and amazing. Protexin would be most effective as well, but often it is not readily on hand when needed and natural yoghurt is plus, it is also an easily digested food supplement and thus gives a quick pick-up to a poorly pup. Best wishes, hope all goes well from now on. I slept next to the box last night and the pups had a great night with regular feeding. I woke T&W boy a couple of times early on as the tri was awake and starting to feed and he was a touch lethargic until he had one teat then he went straight for a second. No vomiting only a couple of short crying period (2 mins) but that was before midnight. Will do a weighin soon Don't know what the heck has been wrong but really looking positive now Hilary Fantastic news Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo Baggins Posted November 23, 2011 Share Posted November 23, 2011 (edited) The mother doesn't have mastitis BB she is fine it's the pups not doing well and the amtiniotics could be causing rheir gut upset or it could be somerhing more sinister, hopefully not. How are they doing Hilaryo? I did not say that she had mastitis. I was just correcting the misinterpretation of mastitis. As LizT stated that old treatment for mastitis was to remove they baby, now it s not but not all have to caught on to this information. ETA. Had to change Aziah's post as the mail marshall blocked the word starting with b... ;) ;) Edited November 23, 2011 by Bilbo Baggins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aziah Posted November 23, 2011 Share Posted November 23, 2011 The mother doesn't have mastitis BB she is fine it's the pups not doing well and the amtiniotics could be causing rheir gut upset or it could be somerhing more sinister, hopefully not. How are they doing Hilaryo? I did not say that she had mastitis. I was just correcting the misinterpretation of mastitis. As LizT stated that old treatment for mastitis was to remove they baby, now it s not but not all have to caught on to this information. ETA. Had to change Aziah's post as the mail marshall blocked the word starting with b... ;) ;) I can only reply to how I interpreted your post BB - there was no harm meant. Anyhoo...moving right along. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LizT Posted November 23, 2011 Share Posted November 23, 2011 This is really encouraging and uplifting news hilaryo. Hope things continue on this positive note. So sad that you lost your extra two pups, as it were. Play together 4eva little sisters The mother doesn't have mastitis BB she is fine it's the pups not doing well and the amtiniotics could be causing rheir gut upset or it could be somerhing more sinister, hopefully not. How are they doing Hilaryo? I did not say that she had mastitis. I was just correcting the misinterpretation of mastitis. As LizT stated that old treatment for mastitis was to remove they baby, now it s not but not all have to caught on to this information. ETA. Had to change Aziah's post as the mail marshall blocked the word starting with b... ;) ;) I can only reply to how I interpreted your post BB - there was no harm meant. Anyhoo...moving right along. Ooops! I was just talking about mastitis in general as it appeared to be indicated that IF the bitch had it the pups shouldn't feed. Such is the way of the text conversation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belljari Posted November 24, 2011 Share Posted November 24, 2011 How are your babies doing today Hilaryo? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hilaryo Posted November 24, 2011 Author Share Posted November 24, 2011 I had to return home yesterday afternoon but he was well and truely on the mend then. Just a bit lethargic but no vomiting or crying. I just spoke to Sara this morning and she said he is now waking for all his feeds and moving vigorously around the box :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trisven13 Posted November 24, 2011 Share Posted November 24, 2011 Oh that is great news Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hilaryo Posted November 24, 2011 Author Share Posted November 24, 2011 Hopefully all is OK with the remaining 2 puppies in this litter. Thanks for all the concern and support - your all wonderful ;) Hilary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aziah Posted November 24, 2011 Share Posted November 24, 2011 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fifi Posted November 24, 2011 Share Posted November 24, 2011 fingers & toes crossed that these two thrive. Breeding...enough to drive a person to :drink: !!! fifi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belljari Posted November 24, 2011 Share Posted November 24, 2011 Great news!!! Hoping everything goes well from now on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LizT Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 Hopefully all is OK with the remaining 2 puppies in this litter. Thanks for all the concern and support - your all wonderful ;) Hilary And no more dramas for you guys either....you've had more than your share! ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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