Grand Champions & (new Title) Supreme Champions

[SwaY]

Yes, the changes to the "Grand Champion" Title is now official:-

This is a an excerpt from the Summary of the ANKC Board Meeting held in Brisbane on the 16th & 17th October 2011:-

5 Grand Champion Title

It was resolved that from 1 January 2012 the requirements for the Grand Champion Title will revert back

to the Pre 1 January 2010 requirement of 1,000 points only, and the requirements of: 1 All Breeds Best

in Show: or 4 Best in Group: or 4 Certificates of 25 points will be removed.

All dogs that qualify for the Grand Champion title under Regulations Part 5 Clause 7.9 are eligible to

apply for the title after the implementation date of 1 January 2012.

If you apply for the Grand Champion after 1 January 2012, as long as some of the points towards the title were awarded after the original implementation date of 1/1/98, there are no other additional requirements.

6 Supreme Champion Title - NEW

It was resolved to introduce a new conformation title 'Supreme Champion'. The requirements to attain

this new title by using the points system as approved by ANKC Ltd at the time will be 1,000 points,

including 3 All Breeds Best in Shows; or 10 Best in Group/Specialty Best in Shows. Either 3 different

Best in Show Judges or 10 different Best in Group/Specialty judges must be submitted, there can be no

repeated judges.

The implementation date of the new Supreme Champion title will be 1 July 2012.

For the Supreme Champion some of the points towards the title (1 Challenge Certificate)must be awarded after the implementation date of 1/7/12.

Edited November 21, 2011 by SwaY

[Shaar]

Heard about this today... not a fan.

They should have made regular Champion harder to get, it's such a cheap title now.

Plus GRAND champion should be something like 500 points and 4 best in groups... 1000 points is almost unachievable for those of us with rare breeds so they should have reduced the points and kept the group requirements.

I do like the supreme requirements though, will be good to see that only a select few dogs can gain that title.

[Dogsfevr]

i am so sick of hearing rare breeds & hard to gain the points,

I have 3 grands ,2 rarely had comp,my other had breed comp 3 times in my home state .

All grands at 3 years & under in a state where we have no options in shows we all show at the same .

1000 points is very achieveable & rare has no boundries .

Looking forward to the Supreme award, i have 2 who have meet the requirements just need that 1 CC.

[Sayreovi]

i am so sick of hearing rare breeds & hard to gain the points,

I have 3 grands ,2 rarely had comp,my other had breed comp 3 times in my home state .

All grands at 3 years & under in a state where we have no options in shows we all show at the same .

1000 points is very achieveable & rare has no boundries .

Looking forward to the Supreme award, i have 2 who have meet the requirements just need that 1 CC.

Agreed

If a dog can't achive 1000 points with no other requirements then just challenge points, then it doesn't deserve the award of Grand Champion.

[Gayle.]

I don't really get the rare breeds don't get picked for group wins either...because if they're good enough they will. If they aren't winning best in group then maybe they're not best in group material.

Not sure about the new title, it's getting a bit like cat show titles.......double gold supreme grand champion etc. etc.

[Shaar]

How many shows was that at over the 3 years?

We only have 30-40 shows a year here is Tassie and at 6 points a show that makes 180 points a year.

Providing I won best of breed at every single show it would take until the dog is 5 1/2 years old. I don't travel to every show PLUS there is competition at some shows and obviously I'm not always going to win taking that 5 1/2 years out a lot further.

I know this is a touchy subject but maibnlanders really do have it easy. A friend of mine did one circuit and attended 20 shows over 5 weeks... that's half of what we have in a whole YEAR!

[Dogsfevr]

How many shows was that at over the 3 years?

We only have 30-40 shows a year here is Tassie and at 6 points a show that makes 180 points a year.

Providing I won best of breed at every single show it would take until the dog is 5 1/2 years old. I don't travel to every show PLUS there is competition at some shows and obviously I'm not always going to win taking that 5 1/2 years out a lot further.

I know this is a touchy subject but maibnlanders really do have it easy. A friend of mine did one circuit and attended 20 shows over 5 weeks... that's half of what we have in a whole YEAR!

Not all mainlanders have it easy at all,not every state has the luxury of lots of shows or ease of heading to another state.

Tassie has it better travelling east than i do ,we don't have lots of shows either & we all attend the same show or no shows at all.

My guys are group winners so rare/limited numbers it is easy to attain the grand at a young age

[Shaar]

With all group wins to make a 1000 that's still 40 best in groups... Yes rare breeds still win big, mine had a BIS at our last group specialty plus several other all breeds BIG's but he's still nowhere near the points quota.

I'm just saying reducing the points needed but upping the group requirements makes more sense. There are probably GrCh's out there on the old system who never won a group, they just slogged away getting small challenges until they hit 1000 points, while other dogs winning groups consistently never got the title.

[Havasneeze]

I see this one managed to slip through without anybody noticing....

7.7 Championship Points System (05/99) (10/11)

The owner of a dog registered with the ANKC Ltd which:

(a) Wins not fewer than four Challenge Certificates/Best of Breed Certificates

under not fewer than four different Judges at four different exhibitions; and

(10/99)

(b) Gains a total of 100 points; may apply for such dog to be known as a

Champion.

NOTE that the 25 points after the age of 12 months is no longer required ;)

Edited November 21, 2011 by Havasneeze

[stone]

A retrograde step IMO. Really disappointing.

The possibility is being a made up "Champions" in 17 shows, grandies in 167 without actually having been placed before another exhibit?

Divided by 2 or 3 shows a week & it really show how ridiculous the situation is.

6 weeks for champ, just over a year for grand without opposition?

Not much credibility there.

Any wonder overseas associations regard our awards with suspicion.

[Trisven13]

A retrograde step IMO. Really disappointing.

The possibility is being a made up "Champions" in 17 shows, grandies in 167 without actually having been placed before another exhibit?

Divided by 2 or 3 shows a week & it really show how ridiculous the situation is.

6 weeks for champ, just over a year for grand without opposition?

Not much credibility there.

Any wonder overseas associations regard our awards with suspicion.

So with a breed like mine (Basset Fauve De Bretagne) where there are currently less than 10 being shown reasonably regularly between Townsville and Melbourne our challenges shouldn't count UNTIL we compete against others of our breed? I've travelled for competition and LOVE competition (even when my girls lose) but at the moment unless I travel the only competition my girls get is each other. ETA or should they count only when they also win a class in group? Or only when they win group? There IS no perfect answer to any of these problems. No matter which way the ANKC goes people are going to be pissed off.

Edited November 21, 2011 by Trisven13

[WreckitWhippet]

I liked the tweaked system of dogs requiring BIG's or a BIS or the 25 point CC's. The Grand has reverted back to the cheap chase for points, it was before.

Bring on the Supreme, at least the dogs awarded with that one, will have had to beat something along the way to get there.

I feel sorry for those who worked their arses off, to achieve a Grand under the revised system, their great achievement will now be lumped back in with those who were merely good enough not to get non awarded along the way, were prepared to travel and pay for the petrol.

[nabs]

Can someone give me the link to these changes please?

[stone]

A retrograde step IMO. Really disappointing.

The possibility is being a made up "Champions" in 17 shows, grandies in 167 without actually having been placed before another exhibit?

Divided by 2 or 3 shows a week & it really show how ridiculous the situation is.

6 weeks for champ, just over a year for grand without opposition?

Not much credibility there.

Any wonder overseas associations regard our awards with suspicion.

So with a breed like mine (Basset Fauve De Bretagne) where there are currently less than 10 being shown reasonably regularly between Townsville and Melbourne our challenges shouldn't count UNTIL we compete against others of our breed? I've travelled for competition and LOVE competition (even when my girls lose) but at the moment unless I travel the only competition my girls get is each other. ETA or should they count only when they also win a class in group? Or only when they win group? There IS no perfect answer to any of these problems. No matter which way the ANKC goes people are going to be pissed off.

IMO, The requirements apparently just dumped for the awarding of the GCh title were a breath of fresh air.

The requirements for Ch awards should have been a modification of that.

Two 25 point challenges to be gained before Qualifying for the title of Aust Ch for e.g.

Your challenge points would still count but being titled would require more credibility.

It is probably harder for a ''popular'' breed to be titled due to the amount of competition.

The rewards are greater for sure, but much harder to come by.

Consider a previous topic where it is possible for a r/u BIS to finish in front of a 1000 dogs for no reward & yet some go home with 6 points just for being there?

Ridiculous.

Just my opinion.

Edited November 21, 2011 by stone

[Trisven13]

I liked the tweaked system of dogs requiring BIG's or a BIS or the 25 point CC's. The Grand has reverted back to the cheap chase for points, it was before.

Bring on the Supreme, at least the dogs awarded with that one, will have had to beat something along the way to get there.

I feel sorry for those who worked their arses off, to achieve a Grand under the revised system, their great achievement will now be lumped back in with those who were merely good enough not to get non awarded along the way, were prepared to travel and pay for the petrol.

I agree - I liked the old system and was quite happy with the fact that I would only have a dog that achieved a Grand after it had earnt it. There is currently only one Fauve in Australia who would have achieved it under that system but he deserves it as he is lovely. I do however get sick of being told that our titles aren't worth as much because we haven't had to beat anyone to get them - its not like I actively avoid competition and in fact, despite being told by others that I shouldn't do it that way, I refused to pull my older bitch out of shows just so my younger bitch could be titled. My view was that she would get her title when she was good enough to beat the older bitch, which she now does.

[Blakbelgian]

"Judges must be submitted, there can be no repeated judges."

I like this part of the rule. No more following Mr Joe Blow all over the state cause he will pretty much give your dog

Best in show or Best in Group where ever he is judging.

BB

[SparkyTansy]

A retrograde step IMO. Really disappointing.

The possibility is being a made up "Champions" in 17 shows, grandies in 167 without actually having been placed before another exhibit?

Divided by 2 or 3 shows a week & it really show how ridiculous the situation is.

6 weeks for champ, just over a year for grand without opposition?

Not much credibility there.

Any wonder overseas associations regard our awards with suspicion.

So with a breed like mine (Basset Fauve De Bretagne) where there are currently less than 10 being shown reasonably regularly between Townsville and Melbourne our challenges shouldn't count UNTIL we compete against others of our breed? I've travelled for competition and LOVE competition (even when my girls lose) but at the moment unless I travel the only competition my girls get is each other. ETA or should they count only when they also win a class in group? Or only when they win group? There IS no perfect answer to any of these problems. No matter which way the ANKC goes people are going to be pissed off.

IMO, The requirements apparently just dumped for the awarding of the GCh title were a breath of fresh air.

The requirements for Ch awards should have been a modification of that.

Two 25 point challenges to be gained before Qualifying for the title of Aust Ch for e.g.

Your challenge points would still count but being titled would require more credibility.

It is probably harder for a ''popular'' breed to be titled due to the amount of competition.

The rewards are greater for sure, but much harder to come by.

Consider a previous topic where it is possible for a r/u BIS to finish in front of a 1000 dogs for no reward & yet some go home with 6 points just for being there?

Ridiculous.

Just my opinion.

2 x 25 point challenges for a breed to become a champion? some breeds (even the ones with higher numbers) can't achieve a 25 pointer. Be realistic, the system national and needs to suit as many states as possible...

imo reverting back to the old grand system makes no sense... those who gained the grand with the harder requirements now have nothing to show for it.

[Rebanne]

I feel sorry for those who worked their arses off, to achieve a Grand under the revised system, their great achievement will now be lumped back in with those who were merely good enough not to get non awarded along the way, were prepared to travel and pay for the petrol.

don't you think that is a bit rude to some of the GR Ch that got their title under the old (new) system. Not the dogs fault or the handlers that they won under the rules of the day. They can't have all been undeserving surely

[Rebanne]

I see this one managed to slip through without anybody noticing....

7.7 Championship Points System (05/99) (10/11)

The owner of a dog registered with the ANKC Ltd which:

(a) Wins not fewer than four Challenge Certificates/Best of Breed Certificates

under not fewer than four different Judges at four different exhibitions; and

(10/99)

(b) Gains a total of 100 points; may apply for such dog to be known as a

Champion.

NOTE that the 25 points after the age of 12 months is no longer required ;)

well I think that's a bit disappointing. I realise the smaller breeds would be mature by 12 months of age but all the others, mine included, are being judged on potenial. It would be unrealistic to wait, for any breed, to be fully mature, in my breed we would be waiting for the boys to be at least 4 :D , but I think 25 points after 12 months was reasonable. Actually it wouldn't bother me if the age was put up to 18 months but I suspect I would be in the minority

[Rebanne]

A retrograde step IMO. Really disappointing.

The possibility is being a made up "Champions" in 17 shows, grandies in 167 without actually having been placed before another exhibit?

Divided by 2 or 3 shows a week & it really show how ridiculous the situation is.

6 weeks for champ, just over a year for grand without opposition?

Not much credibility there.

Any wonder overseas associations regard our awards with suspicion.

So with a breed like mine (Basset Fauve De Bretagne) where there are currently less than 10 being shown reasonably regularly between Townsville and Melbourne our challenges shouldn't count UNTIL we compete against others of our breed? I've travelled for competition and LOVE competition (even when my girls lose) but at the moment unless I travel the only competition my girls get is each other. ETA or should they count only when they also win a class in group? Or only when they win group? There IS no perfect answer to any of these problems. No matter which way the ANKC goes people are going to be pissed off.

Don't worry Trisven, do what I did and breed your own competition Not all of us live near the showing centres or have the money or time to go chasing competition. Particularly when there is no competiton within cooee to chase.

ETA as for getting a 25 point Challenge would have to move overseas to have any hope of that.

Edited November 22, 2011 by Rebanne