Aziah Posted November 18, 2011 Share Posted November 18, 2011 Breed specialist JUDGES. Doesn't matter to me if it's an all breeds show, group show or breed show if the judge is an acknowledged expert in the breed. Many breed club shows are judged by NON specialist/all breed judges ^ this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stone Posted November 18, 2011 Share Posted November 18, 2011 Wouldn't say invariably myself. The ones who know a breed inside out and have done a genuine apprenticeship almost always acknowledge the virtues of the various types within a breed. That's a description of every experience, ethical breeder/exhibitor. Specialty shows have any amount of outstanding breed examples. Stunners wall to wall. Bias is ''invariably'' a decisive player. Human nature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandra777 Posted November 18, 2011 Share Posted November 18, 2011 That's a description of every experience, ethical breeder/exhibitor. Absolutely - but not all the judges who are engaged to judge specialist shows are actually very experienced breeders or exhibitors or judges Yes sometimes as you said they look only for their "type" - but the GOOD ones get quite different results, so IMO it's not inevitable that only one type goes up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stone Posted November 18, 2011 Share Posted November 18, 2011 That's a description of every experience, ethical breeder/exhibitor. Absolutely - but not all the judges who are engaged to judge specialist shows are actually very experienced breeders or exhibitors or judges Yes sometimes as you said they look only for their "type" - but the GOOD ones get quite different results, so IMO it's not inevitable that only one type goes up The one who placed my little girl 3rd from 26 entries certainly knew what he was doing..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jr_inoz Posted November 18, 2011 Share Posted November 18, 2011 The problem with breed specialty judges is they invariably have bias to toward the "types" they breed themselves. Wouldn't say invariably myself. The ones who know a breed inside out and have done a genuine apprenticeship almost always acknowledge the virtues of the various types within a breed. I agree that if they find an outstanding one of the type they prefer that one will go up - which I guess is only to be expected, if you prefer a certain thing and find an outstanding example of that then you're bound to favour it This.... and it is certainly better than seeing a judge who doesn't know the breed well, (in a double coated breed) putting up the best groomed, trimmed dog, not the one that moves best or conforms best to type. It is interesting to see some of the dogs that will win challenge points at an all breeds show but can't even win their class under a breed specialist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwaY Posted November 18, 2011 Share Posted November 18, 2011 Defintely Specialty shows - IF judged by a Specialist, however it is nice to have a breed specialist judge you at All Breeds level as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stone Posted November 18, 2011 Share Posted November 18, 2011 (edited) Is there such a person who is a breed specialist who isn't a breeder of the subject breed? Would a specialty club contract a judge who wasn't a breed specialist? First, I don't think so. Second, I have heard of one such an instance. SBTS of NSW contracted an overseas all breeds judge who was a Kerry Blue specialist. Many raised eyebrows as to the awardings. So the story goes. Also, if the person who advised of the B.I.S on the morning I arrived at my last specialty show had have rang me with the information the night before it would have saved me a lot of time & money. Specialty shows ain't always that special. Edited November 18, 2011 by stone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwaY Posted November 18, 2011 Share Posted November 18, 2011 Is there such a person who is a breed specialist who isn't a breeder of the subject breed? Would a specialty club contract a judge who wasn't a breed specialist? First, I don't think so. Second, I have heard of one such an instance. Happens often im afraid. You also have large specialties in some States and small ones in another. Dane Champ show NSW 25 entries VIC 67 entries Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PomsNZ Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 JUDGES! I do very well under breed specialist JUDGES, but none are chosen for our breed shows. In all the years I have been showing I dont think a single breed specialist has been chosen for our breed shows. This is for a number of reasons Id presume. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zensu Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 It depends onthe breed specialist judge... I like to enter (and hopefully win) under a specialist judge who has awesome dogs that I admire. Is winning under a "specialist" judge with ordinary dogs that bigger deal?? JMHO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandra777 Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 It depends onthe breed specialist judge... I like to enter (and hopefully win) under a specialist judge who has awesome dogs that I admire. Is winning under a "specialist" judge with ordinary dogs that bigger deal?? JMHO Agree - but can someone who only breeds ordinary dogs even a specialist? Not to me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stone Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 (edited) It depends onthe breed specialist judge... I like to enter (and hopefully win) under a specialist judge who has awesome dogs that I admire. Is winning under a "specialist" judge with ordinary dogs that bigger deal?? JMHO Agree - but can someone who only breeds ordinary dogs even a specialist? Not to me & one shudders to think what would be awarded...... Edited November 22, 2011 by stone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conztruct Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 It depends onthe breed specialist judge... I like to enter (and hopefully win) under a specialist judge who has awesome dogs that I admire. Is winning under a "specialist" judge with ordinary dogs that bigger deal?? JMHO Agree - but can someone who only breeds ordinary dogs even a specialist? Not to me I think it depends if they know what a good specimen of the breed is, can recognise it, can recognise that their own dogs are mediocre, and can judge objectively. Although one would hope that someone who knows what a good example of the breed is would be able to build a line that would produce just that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angelsun Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 We don't have breed specific (stand alone...currently we have one specialty event that has three breeds featured) We do not have a qualified judge in my breed here in this country. If we had someone say from Sweden (one of the big countries with my breed that has routinely 25+ at any given routine all breed show) I'd hope to present and do well. At this point, doing well in the All Breed is more important, simply because that's where I am most weekends. This is where the new potential owners hang out, and this is where I get a chance to show off my breed to the general public that came along to see Dobermann and realized that my breed might be a better size or suit their lifestyle and never heard of it. General public do not usually attend specialty events held at the major dog centres (based on what I have seen since I have been here) Unless they have contacted me prior, and I tell them to go on such and such a day at whatever time, so that they can view....we never see general public attend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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