Dog Park Rules / Law

[Aussie Boxer]

Why wont I let my little dog play with a larger breed? Purely for her safety until I know the dog and the owner first. There is no way in hell an unfamiliar larger dog is coming near mine at a dog park/beach without my full attention, consent and chat with the owner. Your larger breed dog might be the sweetest thing on the planet but one rough play move and I have an injured dog. I prefer to keep her play sessions evenly matched, and so does she.

I took her for the first time last week to an off leash dog beach down the coast, beautiful white sand, waves, blue sea, I want her to enjoy and experience that. I did however keep her on leash at all times so when the bigger guys rushed up to say hi, I could pick her up first to assess the situation. She met a few larger breeds but had no real interest in them anyway as she is somewhat aware of her size when a 50kg dog is bouncing around her trying to play.

Rough Play? Such a strange and open word isnt it? A 50KG dog is a BIG BIG DOG...The roughest I have seen dogs play is chasing after one another, I have never seen a dog that is playing start to kick, jump on or in any other way do something that wouldnt/couldnt be considered an accident, meeting the owner and knowing the dog doesnt mean an accident wont happen!

If you are at an off leash area with your dog, then you are also expecting the other owners to think that you and your dog are there for the right reasons yes? not like your there to knoock off their leads and collars and run to the nearest porn shop? (jokes) No one takes a known aggressive dog to a park to "knock" other dogs off do they? So why act and be all defensive to everydog until you chat to their owner/s? Once again, chatting to "Bill" doesnt mean his dog isn't going to roll your dog over, nor does his dog rolling yours over mean its going to have to end up in the vets!

In all my time the more aggressive dogs that DO BITE and play rough are the smaller breeds, once again though it just seems really niave and silly to me that people believe a dog will play "rough", I simply dont understand it, boisterous and jumping around spinning aka boxer like could not possibly be defined as being "rough" play!? For a larger dog to seriously break a leg or injure your dog it would have to be overtly aggressive for this to transpire, it simply wouldn't happen in normal dog play!

And the whole "I pick her/him/it" up to assess the situation is what im talking about, its teach's your dog nothing in the way of socialising, nor does it teach you anything in the way of other dogs behaviour's, your dog has way better sense's then you and would know whats going on with the other dogs temprement long before you realised it had its heckles up. (just saying, this isnt targeting you personally)

[Guest donatella]

Playing rough could be bouncing ontop of the dog, playing with open mouthes, just the sheer weight difference can lead to accident.

My dog can be socialized with well mannered larger dogs I know the temperament of, certainly not the ones at the dog parks who lets be honest most have no manners or recall at all.

[Aussie Boxer]

I know the temperament of, certainly not the ones at the dog parks who lets be honest most have no manners or recall at all.

See, these are the remarks that irk me the most, such a generalistion, and such a low point of view of the population surrounding yourself! I'm sorry, but what makes you (and everybody else that makes these same remarks) the absolute judge of all? Have you ever sat back and thought that maybe they all think the same of you!?

(the uneducated park people "oh look, here comes that woman with that little pommy that she doesnt even let socialise with the other dogs becuase she is to good for them, well well") a stretch but you see my point?

How do you know they aren't well trained? How do you know that most dont have a recall and good manners? Just by viewing the "big" dogs running arund like nutters with each other? In that comment you are also insinuating that the owners are neglectful in their training and that you are superior in some way?!

BTW, a good friend's wife has a pom, she was nearly in hysterics when her little pooch was put in our backyard when he visited here one day, (could have left lil sammy in the car like a kid at the casino) "they'll eat her" "squash her" "break her little body"...no such thing happened, you stand at his house now and say my dogs names and she runs to the front door looking for her "big friends".

You have validated my argument, Your personal fears are in getting in the way of actual experience (has your Pom ever been rolled and broken bones? been snapped up in a big dogs mouth and run around like a stuffed toy?, whilst it is good to protect your "children" life does need to be lived!

These same comments you are freely stating where once the opinion of white folk in the dark old ages,,,,at this moment in time I really dont think we have come to far?! All creatures, great and small after all!

[Guest donatella]

I've had my own experience with morons at dog parks that stop us visiting them. The dog beach we will continue at because its fun and a great experience not to mention a bigger space, not as crammed in as dog park fences.

She's been rolled at the dog park before by 2 large huskies who "just wanted to play", she cried, squealed and we made a swift exit and we won't be returning. Sure the huskies wanted to play and I, sure they were harmless however, they are too big, she weighed 2.2kg, this is no match.

Dog fights in dog parks aren't as rare as shark attacks, they happen ALL the time and can be a downright dangerous place to be sometimes if you don't have your wits about you.

She doesn't need big dog friends, she's got lots of evenly sized playmates she is happy with.

I am that person with the pommy people most likely snicker at under their breath but I don't care, I come home with a happy and healthy dog at the end of the day :)

Edited January 14, 2012 by donatella

[Rebanne]

Dog fights in dog parks aren't as rare as shark attacks, they happen ALL the time and can be a downright dangerous place to be sometimes if you don't have your wits about you.

She doesn't need big dog friends, she's got lots of evenly sized playmates she is happy with.

I am that person with the pommy people most likely snicker at under their breath but I don't care, I come home with a happy and healthy dog at the end of the day :)

totally agree

[Crisovar]

Wow, some really big opinions in this thread! I think some more "over" protective mum's and dad's in here than in "skin" kid parenting forums or discussions about suitable day-care centres!

After reading all the comment's in this thread I think that we are missing a really important factor that comes into play in this.

Your OWN behaviour,

All to quickly everyone appears to look down upon the people that have their dog running freely and state that the attitudes of the owners are abysmal etc, Is this not the "blame" game (blame everyone else for a situation without looking at how they could have improved the situation themselves - we aren't all perfect), Whilst I don't disagree with the majority of the comments, I also don't agree 100%, The majority of your dog's behaviour is in response to its owners demeanour, how anxious or scared the owner is feeling when a situation arises, for instance;

You're in a Off Lead enclosed yard, you are walking your dog around minding your own business and there is a "pack" of overly hypo dogs all running around and enjoying themselves and they come on over to see the new "kid" that's in the playground, by the owner of the "new" dog fretting that its going to be attacked and that you don't "like" it being approached or sniffed (why are you in a "socialisation" place in the 1st place) your dog will automatically feed of your "vibe" and act accordingly, If u are scared your dog will become scared, it will either hide between your legs or will act defensively to protect its master, You will then read this incorrectly that your dog is scared of the big bad "Oscar" and you will then react again escalating the encounter! So many of these things can be combated by not only being smart about watching yours and others dog's behaviours' but also remembering first and foremost how YOU are acting in the situation.

As you can tell by my name I'm a Boxer owner (x2), As many of us are aware they are the over excited jump around want to play with anyone and anything type of dog, from what people have posted up on here it shows that their own level of knowledge of other dog breed's is very limited, Dog's in general don't attack another dog unless it's over one of a few things (1. direct threat to their pack, 2. Threat to their property 3. defence) All of these are pretty easy to avoid when you're out with your dog! Unless they are attacked by a stray pack that is hunting (nasty and no way the norm)

Why won't you let your little dog play with a medium, large or giant dog breed? It's not because the dog doesn't want to, it's solely because you have a preconceived idea that it's too dangerous! In my case, are the two boxers dangerous? No, certainly not, not unless they perceive (in your control) that their pack is under threat, otherwise it's all harmless dog play, it's fun, they all like it, I'm regularly looking after other breeds when owners are on holidays, they are all small/mini breeds, and play just fine with the bigger dogs! ranging from Pugs, Jack Russell's, Lab's to Maltese xhitshu?, not once have I had a problem! The only problem is other dogs owners being uneducated or thinking that they know everything!

Sorry for the long rant but opinions like some comments listed here infuriate me, everyone is entitled to their opinion but PLEASE base it on fact rather than false and misconceptions on dog breed's and size's! The real problem is the owners, not the dogs, in the end you are really only hurting your own dog as they are missing out on socialising with many types of dogs,

When it all comes down to it, it's a little like racism isn't it? Would you yell and rant at another "skin" kids parents because their child of different race/age/religion came near your child in the park? to me, that makes you the hysterical psychotic person that is not fit to own a dog, nor is it indeed effective control in a public place.

Food for thought,

Chappo.

So it is acceptable for small breeds to be body slammed or paw swatted in play by friendly but large bouncy breeds?? That's how small dogs are often injured, just in fun. And that is fact.

Close friends young cav was slammed by a Golden last month, resulted in a fractured femur, but it's ok just play.

[Guest lavendergirl]

Wow, some really big opinions in this thread! I think some more "over" protective mum's and dad's in here than in "skin" kid parenting forums or discussions about suitable day-care centres!

After reading all the comment's in this thread I think that we are missing a really important factor that comes into play in this.

Your OWN behaviour,

All to quickly everyone appears to look down upon the people that have their dog running freely and state that the attitudes of the owners are abysmal etc, Is this not the "blame" game (blame everyone else for a situation without looking at how they could have improved the situation themselves - we aren't all perfect), Whilst I don't disagree with the majority of the comments, I also don't agree 100%, The majority of your dog's behaviour is in response to its owners demeanour, how anxious or scared the owner is feeling when a situation arises, for instance;

You're in a Off Lead enclosed yard, you are walking your dog around minding your own business and there is a "pack" of overly hypo dogs all running around and enjoying themselves and they come on over to see the new "kid" that's in the playground, by the owner of the "new" dog fretting that its going to be attacked and that you don't "like" it being approached or sniffed (why are you in a "socialisation" place in the 1st place) your dog will automatically feed of your "vibe" and act accordingly, If u are scared your dog will become scared, it will either hide between your legs or will act defensively to protect its master, You will then read this incorrectly that your dog is scared of the big bad "Oscar" and you will then react again escalating the encounter! So many of these things can be combated by not only being smart about watching yours and others dog's behaviours' but also remembering first and foremost how YOU are acting in the situation.

As you can tell by my name I'm a Boxer owner (x2), As many of us are aware they are the over excited jump around want to play with anyone and anything type of dog, from what people have posted up on here it shows that their own level of knowledge of other dog breed's is very limited, Dog's in general don't attack another dog unless it's over one of a few things (1. direct threat to their pack, 2. Threat to their property 3. defence) All of these are pretty easy to avoid when you're out with your dog! Unless they are attacked by a stray pack that is hunting (nasty and no way the norm)

Why won't you let your little dog play with a medium, large or giant dog breed? It's not because the dog doesn't want to, it's solely because you have a preconceived idea that it's too dangerous! In my case, are the two boxers dangerous? No, certainly not, not unless they perceive (in your control) that their pack is under threat, otherwise it's all harmless dog play, it's fun, they all like it, I'm regularly looking after other breeds when owners are on holidays, they are all small/mini breeds, and play just fine with the bigger dogs! ranging from Pugs, Jack Russell's, Lab's to Maltese xhitshu?, not once have I had a problem! The only problem is other dogs owners being uneducated or thinking that they know everything!

Sorry for the long rant but opinions like some comments listed here infuriate me, everyone is entitled to their opinion but PLEASE base it on fact rather than false and misconceptions on dog breed's and size's! The real problem is the owners, not the dogs, in the end you are really only hurting your own dog as they are missing out on socialising with many types of dogs,

When it all comes down to it, it's a little like racism isn't it? Would you yell and rant at another "skin" kids parents because their child of different race/age/religion came near your child in the park? to me, that makes you the hysterical psychotic person that is not fit to own a dog, nor is it indeed effective control in a public place.

Food for thought,

Chappo.

What an interesting statement I hardly think that people are hysterical and psychotic because they want to protect their small dogs. I will only take my small dog to a small dog off leash area and I make no apology for that. I have taken him to a vacant separate small dog area when the larger area is full of big and small dogs and had people look at me strangely for doing so. I couldn't care less. I want him to have a free run - if there are other small dogs there to play with thats fine but no way am I going to put him in to mix with much larger dogs. Kennels won't do it either - I should imagine there is some legitimate reason - beyond being psychotic that is :)

[jacqui835]

Well I have one of those big dogs - he's 45kg+ and when I have him at a the dog park there is only one type of dog I worry about - bull breeds. Any other dog and I can comfort myself with the fact that if everything went pear-shaped as much as it would be a terrible thing for both dogs, my dog would likely come out on top. But imagine owning the dog that you knew would always come last, and in fact could be killed at the first bite? It's a completely different feeling.

I used to feel the same way as you, Australian Boxer, because I knew my dog knew how to play with small dogs, and I knew he would never hurt them - he can play with 8 week old kittens and grew up with toy breeds and he knows he needs to be careful. I actually used to tell people in a slightly peeved voice - seriously he won't hurt you or your dogs, or ask them why they came to the dog park when they didn't want their dogs to meet any others. But then I minded my sister's dogs for a weekend whilst they were away - 2 Papillons, and it was a completely different experience. You see these 'large' dogs (nowhere near as big as my Sammy, but still 5-10x the weight of the Papillons) and they are running and jumping around with seemingly very little care for their movements. You can pick my sister's dogs up with one hand - if a Labrador accidentally steps on one, it can be game over, and the lab might not even notice. It takes them hours to eat a chicken neck, when my dog can eat a whole chicken in about 5 minutes - there's dogs and then there's dogs and whilst they might be similar mentally you can't completely ignore the physical differences. I used to be offended when people picked their little dogs up when they saw Sammy, but how could they possibly know that my dog had been socialised with small dogs and animals? And there's just no room for error.

So now when I see someone pick up their small dog, I call Sammy's attention so he doesn't even look at them (because picking a dog up always gets attention), and move past quickly. That's the only thing I think I can do that will make them feel positively about the experience. They want their dogs to get to live normal lives and do things that can make dogs happy, like playing with other dogs, but not at the risk of losing their dogs so they're just trying to protect them from accidents that could be disastrous for them.

[Erny]

I should be sitting writing out a document but am distracted/stuck for words, so ventured back in here :D.

If it were me :

Great if big dogs can be taught how to properly 'mingle' with small dogs.

Great if small dogs can be raised to not fear big dogs.

But IMO, the above is not something to be done around dogs that dog-owners don't know - and that counts for whatever size of dog one might own.

I don't have my dog at parks where there is an abundance of other unknown-to-me dogs that I cannot avoid, and that counts for both little and big dogs.

I don't blame anyone for taking steps to protect their dog against a dog who is unknown to them/avoid potential incident, regardless of size.

[german_shep_fan]

I was told at obedience school that dogs actually have no idea of their own size and that the SWFs actually in their own minds think they are just as big as the large breeds :D

I have 2 GSDs and have no breed biases, often many of my friends clear the park when they see a staffy come in, all the poor staffies i have ever met at our park (and yes i go on average at least 6 out of 7 days per wk) just come up and greet you with their staffy smiles and then are happy to run and play with the other dogs. I have met some shocking dogs for dog socialisation from many breeds that are considered "family" dogs and no threat to anyone. It just depends on the individual dog. My boy loves hanging out with the SWF as he prefers to just spectate :laugh: SWF on the whole like him too and often will run underneath him if things are getting out of hand with other larger dogs lol

There is a small dog area at the park we go to and its great that ppl use that for their small dogs. Many owners love for their little dogs to mix with the bigger dogs and some do not, thats fine either way. I am particularly glad the little park exists though for owners who SWF come into the big park and try to bite all the bigger dogs or whose owners pick them up (thus raising them above all the other dogs- not just literally) and get pissed that other dogs want to say hi to theirs. In saying that though incidents such as those are rare at our dog park, and often the small and big dog owners have a great talk over the fence to each other

[OSoSwift]

I know of a Maltese cross that was killed when a Shepherd stepped on her when they zagged instead if zigged. Broken ribs and crushed lungs. Dead in minutes.

I have owned large dogs - Dobermanns and I Still hated dogs rushing them. I now own WHippets and I am more careful because they get hurt more easily.

I was training my dog at dog club he was in the prcess of going between jumps. A Labrador who shoudl have been on lead was let off and ran at him knocking him a good 3 to 4 feet, winding him and hurting his back - luckily not seriously or permanently. I know of a Whippet who died in evry similar circumstances from a snapped spine.

I will not risk my dogs welfare just because someone like you thinks I am too judgemental and need to get over it. I have no idea that the dog rushing mine is not going to take them out - even in play, or if they may attack. I have had my dogs attacked over the years by people who call out he/she is friendly they only want to say hello. I have then had to boot them to get them to back off. It is not on.

Incidentally I do not live in town and do not use dog parks but we do go to the beach and occassionally walk in town.

I do not care what you think, off lead areas are not free for all areas.

[espinay2]

Dog fights in dog parks aren't as rare as shark attacks, they happen ALL the time and can be a downright dangerous place to be sometimes if you don't have your wits about you.

She doesn't need big dog friends, she's got lots of evenly sized playmates she is happy with.

I am that person with the pommy people most likely snicker at under their breath but I don't care, I come home with a happy and healthy dog at the end of the day :)

totally agree

Ditto!!

I don't care what people may think of me. My dogs welfare comes first.

BTW, I don't go to 'dog parks' either. But by dogs are very well socialised (in many ways probably a lot better than the average suburban dog that goes to dog parks)

Edited January 14, 2012 by espinay2

[TheCheekyMonster]

My view is if your dog cant be controlled off lead dont let it off lead.... I hate it when dogs come up to us when both dogs are on lead... its just a compromising position for both dogs..... I wont let Gus approach another dog unless I have spoken to the owner of that dog first and asked permission....

If my dog was bitten and the owner of the dog informed me to keep my dog away I would take full responsibility... it happens to Nala way too often... dogs just charge up to her and she doesn't like it.... and there is a conflict the owner is all the way on the other side of the park... some dog owners are just a joke when it comes to off lead parks.... i think more than anything there should be a level of common scenes for people who go to an off lead dog park.

[Leelaa17]

I don't know much about offlead dog parks as I don't utilise them for that purpose.

Lately though I visit my friend who lives opposite an offlead park, so we have a chat in the park and I bring one of my dogs onlead.

Anyway each time I go, invariably someone sees a big dog and thinks its glorious that their offlead dog is now running towards the big dog.

So I yell out and tell the owner to call their offlead dog(s) away - I don't want their dog(s) near me or my dog.

Always I am told:

"I's an offlead park. If you dont like it you should not be here. My dog is not aggressive"

And I go, "yeah I know but my dog might be, so call your dog away."

I had one lady argue the toss with me, and I'm thinking wtf okay let your elderly GSD get bitten and taken to the vet.

So how do offlead dog parks work - do dogs in offlead parks have the right to run up to other dogs and these other dogs must be friendly?

If my dog bites an offlead dog that runs towards my dog and myself, is it my dog's fault for being reactive in an offlead park?

Basically I want to know, if my dog is in control on lead and bites / attacks an offlead dog that rushes us, is my dog okay legally?

And: am I void of financial responsibility for any damage that may happen to the offlead dog?

Those who use offlead parks:

If your dog runs up to another dog after the owner has asked you to call your dog away -

and your dog is bitten because the two dogs did not get along -

do you consider it the fault of the dog onlead

or

the fault of your offlead dog who you did not call back?

I guess I should call the Council and ask them also.

because of an incident with someone who thought my two gsd were attacking his dog, i'm not going to get into it as I know for a fact my dogs weren't attacking, but after this guy threatened to get my dogs put down i lost my s**t. anywayyy.

When ever i walk into a dog park and there are dogs there, my dogs stay on lead until they have calmed down.

they do rush. and i know that freaks people out so I like to walk my dogs over to the offlead dogs and let them sniff etc. it makes the owners feel calmer. I say to owners in the dog park (because my dogs chase... they love chasing) that if at any point my dogs are annoying their dog or they are uncomfortable with my dogs, let me know, and they go back on lead.

when someone is in there throwing a ball, max has to be on lead because he chases the dog, constantly, so he stays on lead. i spend hours at the dog park so unless the owner is going to spend hours throwing a ball to their dog, im not worried about having max on lead for a bit.

when no one is in the dog park and then someone comes in, my dogs are already on lead because they rush the dogs that come in. again, makes owners uncomrtoable so I talk to owners and make sure they are comfortable my two can go offlead. I am also lucky because the dog park I go to, a lot of people know my dogs and know they are fine so I don't have many problems, but I still do all of this as a precaution.

Now to answer your questions.

If my dogs rushed yours (which they wouldn't now because they'd be on lead) but if they did and you asked me to get them away, I would immediately put them on lead and then probably have a discussion with you about why you asked me to do that (pure curiosity ) they would stay onlead until you left or you said they could go offlead.

If my dogs rushed yours, you asked me to get them away, I was running to get them and then your dog bit mine, I wouldn't blame you but I wouldn't be happy.

again, I do these things because i don't have great recall with max. jenna will come, all the time every time, but max wont if he is excited. so if your dog bit max, I wouldn't ask you to pay my vet fees, but I would be upset that you brought your dog that wasn't happy with other dogs into an offlead dog park.

I'm sure I will get critised for this but I can't help how I would feel. I wouldn't yell at you or even blame your dog, its onlead so you have control over it. but I would be unsure as to why you'd bring your dog into an offlead park when there is a very high chance a dog is going to come near your dog.

what happens if an owner is picking up a poo at the other side of the dog park (max tends to go to the furthermost point of the park to go to the toilet) and they don't see you enter the dog park... all of a sudden they turn around, have heard you yelling, and see your dog bite theres, without even a chance to call the dog back or get to them......

I would be, again, quite upset if that was my dog, because the dog park I go to is extremely large and depending on the situation, I may not have even heard you call out.

I just don't think a dog that is going to physically bite another dog should be in a dog park, onlead or off. just my opinion.

[Erny]

Leelah17 .... Congrats on at least taking the necessary steps of keeping control of your dogs at all times. This is a necessity and a benefit not only for others, but for your dogs as well.

The only thing that puzzles me is that you don't seem to think your dogs have an issue with rushing. IE That you think other people are in the wrong for having an issue about your dogs rushing, (even though you respect their issue and do something to prevent it ).

If a strange person came bearing down towards and on you, would you not take some fright and doubt as to his/her intentions? Could you not perceive that as being a potential threat? And did you not realise that potential threats can lead to the other dog/s acting in defensive aggression, which is something we'd prefer for our dogs to not learn? So you see, even a dog who has never bitten before, might react with a bite if it is frightened enough by being rushed. And then, once learnt, you're suggesting it shouldn't be at the park anymore, even though it (hypothetically speaking) could've learnt that aggression through your dogs being there and rushing (which I know doesn't happen because you now take control of your dogs to prevent it).

I only add these questions here - not for you to answer in this thread. It's for others to read as well. You've made it clear you don't wish to get into discussion about that and I respect that. But perhaps they are things you didn't realise. But I will repeat that for whatever your thoughts might be, congrats and good for you for respecting other people's discomfort they feel at the style of approach your dogs exhibit, by preventing it. That's good for the people, and good training for your dogs too.

Edited January 14, 2012 by Erny

[sausy.dog]

again, I do these things because i don't have great recall with max. jenna will come, all the time every time, but max wont if he is excited. so if your dog bit max, I wouldn't ask you to pay my vet fees, but I would be upset that you brought your dog that wasn't happy with other dogs into an offlead dog park.

I don't get this, why do people let their dogs off lead when they don't have any recall? Sorry I just don't understand.

[Leelaa17]

Leelah17 .... Congrats on at least taking the necessary steps of keeping control of your dogs at all times. This is a necessity and a benefit not only for others, but for your dogs as well.

The only thing that puzzles me is that you don't seem to think your dogs have an issue with rushing. IE That you think other people are in the wrong for having an issue about your dogs rushing, (even though you respect their issue and do something to prevent it ).

If a strange person came bearing down towards and on you, would you not take some fright and doubt as to his/her intentions? Could you not perceive that as being a potential threat? And did you not realise that potential threats can lead to the other dog/s acting in defensive aggression, which is something we'd prefer for our dogs to not learn? So you see, even a dog who has never bitten before, might react with a bite if it is frightened enough by being rushed. And then, once learnt, you're suggesting it shouldn't be at the park anymore, even though it (hypothetically speaking) could've learnt that aggression through your dogs being there and rushing (which I know doesn't happen because you now take control of your dogs to prevent it).

I only add these questions here - not for you to answer in this thread. It's for others to read as well. You've made it clear you don't wish to get into discussion about that and I respect that. But perhaps they are things you didn't realise. But I will repeat that for whatever your thoughts might be, congrats and good for you for respecting other people's discomfort they feel at the style of approach your dogs exhibit, by preventing it. That's good for the people, and good training for your dogs too.

Thank you for thanking me. I honestly thought I'd get butchered! .

And I realised, unfortunately a bit late, that my dogs had a problem with rushing when the incident with the dog happened and ever since then they have been on lead until the owner is comfortable with my dogs behaviour.

I understand completely what you are saying and see where you are coming from. I think that if a dog reacts out a fear because a dog is rushing them and if have never being bitten before bites... I would place absolutely no blame on the owner. Perhaps I didn't make that clear in my previous post i apologise!

I meant that if someone brought a dangerous dog into the dog park, with history of attacking, i would be uncomfortable, onlead or off. And that is in no way the owners fault, but I would be worried and I would prefer for the owners not to bring the dog in.

But in saying that, I am now doing whats necessary to prevent incidents of rushing and a dog attacking.

I am constantly learning new and better things from being on this forum and going to dog parks etc and am constantly trying to improve my dogs and my behaviour to situations.

Again, if my dogs rushed at a dog, dangerous or not and got attacked, I would take full responsibility because I know it is a problem.

[Erny]

Thank you for thanking me. I honestly thought I'd get butchered! .

Butchered? On DOL? Wherever could you have gotten that idea? Lol.

No - I thought you were brave enough to put your thoughts forward. It's a good way to learn - not just the person writing, but people reading.

[RiverStar-Aura]

Why wont I let my little dog play with a larger breed? Purely for her safety until I know the dog and the owner first. There is no way in hell an unfamiliar larger dog is coming near mine at a dog park/beach without my full attention, consent and chat with the owner. Your larger breed dog might be the sweetest thing on the planet but one rough play move and I have an injured dog. I prefer to keep her play sessions evenly matched, and so does she.

I completely agree with you Donatella. While my Kirah isn't as small as your gorgeous pom (she's about 6.5 kilos), there's no way I'd let her romp around with unknown big dogs. She wouldn't be to much of a problem as she drops onto her back and submits immediately but she could still get squished by an overly boisterous big woofa.

However, being an Aussie Terrier, she has a tendency to prefer playing rough and tumble with larger dogs rather than ones her own size so it can be a struggle to keep her away from the labradors, boxers, mastiffs etc. There's a gorgeous mastiff cross at our local off leash park who I have no problems letting Kirah play with (as well as a GSD) because I've known these dogs for nearly 3 years now. Zeus (beagle cross and 13.8 kilos) has grown up around them and has a rough play style to match theirs. Kirah stays out of the way because her idea of playing with large dogs is to bounce around them in the puppy play pose. If the bigger dogs get too rough I simply call her over and she comes immediately. Zeus is a little tricker but I'm always working on his recall.

I actually find it embarrassing that my 8 month old puppy has a far better recall than Zeus (nearly 3) but I have to work with his stubborn, independent streak and beagle nose -- he's my WIP (in fandom terms).

Rough Play? Such a strange and open word isnt it? A 50KG dog is a BIG BIG DOG...The roughest I have seen dogs play is chasing after one another, I have never seen a dog that is playing start to kick, jump on or in any other way do something that wouldnt/couldnt be considered an accident, meeting the owner and knowing the dog doesnt mean an accident wont happen!

We're not actually debating whether or not accidents happen but the point of the matter is we can't PREVENT them happening. An accident by definition is an accident, after all! ;) I'm sure Donatella would much rather stop her little pom from playing with rough, much larger and unknown dogs, than to have to possibly experience it being maimed, hurt (either severely or not) or mauled. And then have to deal with the after-effects such as costly vet bills or in worst case scenario, have to PTS her best friend/family member.

You should be lucky you've only seen large dogs play chasey because I've sure as h*ll seen a LOT more. The mastiff cross and GSD I mentioned above go as far as mouthing, jumping and grabbing on hind legs and bouncing around (as much as an 80/90 kilo mastiff cross can "bounce" :laugh:) -- basically they go nuts but it's okay because we're all a tight-knit dog park community and we've all known each other for years. However, we all still call our dogs off to give them a chance to settle down.

But I was nowhere near as sure of these dogs when I first arrived at the park. Zeus was still a smallish puppy at the time and yes, I do find large dogs intimidating, but it's just a matter of getting to know their owners and their temperaments. I also wasn't rushed at by these dogs either and that makes all the difference too!

If you are at an off leash area with your dog, then you are also expecting the other owners to think that you and your dog are there for the right reasons yes?

No. That's not always the case. I sometimes use the off leash park as a training ground while I work on Zeus's recall and focus on me. I can't do this effectively if owners continue to let their dogs rush up and distract him by bouncing everywhere and playing with him. How can I train my dog to ignore other dogs who are up in his face and racing towards him? Zeus's problem is that he sees another dog coming towards him and he instantly thinks "ooooh FRIEND!!!!" and races off. I don't want him doing this because one day, said dog might not be "ooooh FRIEND!!!" and he could get seriously hurt.

I think it's wrong to assume that all dogs at the off leash park are friendly. Humans have bad days and I'm sure dogs can too. One day, something might just set a normally happy dog off and I want to make sure I can get my 2 dogs away before they become a target.

No one takes a known aggressive dog to a park to "knock" other dogs off do they?

You'd be surprised! But then again, those are the owners who claim their dog just plays "rough". I once met a woman when I was leaving my local dog beach who told me to keep my LEASHED dogs away from her dogs as they were service dogs. No problem I told her, only to continue to my car (on the other side of the parking lot) and have her dogs start growling, barking and lunging aggressively at my guys. Service dogs my @$$!!

In all my time the more aggressive dogs that DO BITE and play rough are the smaller breeds, once again though it just seems really niave and silly to me that people believe a dog will play "rough", I simply dont understand it, boisterous and jumping around spinning aka boxer like could not possibly be defined as being "rough" play!? For a larger dog to seriously break a leg or injure your dog it would have to be overtly aggressive for this to transpire, it simply wouldn't happen in normal dog play!

I think you're seriously misjudging the fragility of a small dog's bones. I once owned a cat who broke his leg by falling off a TV, which would've only been about 1.5 metres high and I'm sure if a 50 kilo dog landed on my terrier's leg/foot/back the wrong way and in the wrong place it could end up broken too.

Or if not broken, have you thought about the possibility of a slipped vertebra/disc; muscle, cartilage or tendon damage or even a dislocation?

Small dogs can be very seriously hurt by larger dogs and that doesn't always mean a broken bone. There are numerous ways to be hurt.

What if the big dog decided to shake the little one by the scruff? Would it still be okay as it's just "play"?

And the whole "I pick her/him/it" up to assess the situation is what im talking about, its teach's your dog nothing in the way of socialising, nor does it teach you anything in the way of other dogs behaviour's, your dog has way better sense's then you and would know whats going on with the other dogs temprement long before you realised it had its heckles up. (just saying, this isnt targeting you personally)

It's really got nothing to do with teaching the dog how not to socialise. You're forgetting that it is the RIGHT of EVERY dog owner to decide who they want their pet to interact with. Not just "oh, that boxer is bounding at you at a million miles per hour and doesn't look like stopping. It must be friendly and if you get bowled over/hurt in the process … meh. *shrug*"

If I don't want my dog interacting with a dog I don't know then that's my RIGHT as an owner. It doesn't give you the right to be offended because I want to get to know you and your dog first. You're just assuming that because your boxers are boisterous that every dog, regardless of size, will play the same way.

My terrier was in puppy obedience with an Akita owner who wanted to teach her dog manners when playing with smaller dogs. She'd get her dog to calmly lie down and play in a "drop", so it wasn't walking over and squishing the much smaller puppies. I'd gladly let my guys interact with her dogs as I know she cares about other people's pets as much as her own. And it didn't matter how psycho my little pup got, she'd always make her Akita lie down to play with dogs smaller than her -- and in turn, Kirah learnt how to take a time out when she got too "feral". :laugh:

[dancinbcs]

I have already stated on here that I think it is totally wrong for any dog to be allowed to approach a strange dog, on or off lead, without the owners permission but how anyone can think it is alright for their big boisterous dog to play with a tiny one is absolutely beyond me.

I have a 25kg Border Collie, entire male that loves all dogs. He has a particular fascination with Pom babies and whines, wanting to say hello when he sees them at shows. He is an incredibly gentle dog but I would not let him interact with a Pom baby at ground level. One gentle swat of his paw could easily break a tiny puppy like that. We always make him sit while the owner holds the puppy up so he can sniff and say a gentle hello with no risk of broken bones. I let Border Collie babies jump all over him but they are a lot more sturdy than toy breeds.

With my new JS baby he got to meet lots of BCs including mine but in those first couple of months I could not let him play with them offlead because they were just too rough for such a small puppy. He got swatted too hard by a couple in play even on lead and as much as he was game to play with them I couldn't risk it. Little dogs are easily broken.