The "correct" Commands.

[Kavik]

I think it would be easier to memorize the routine! Then you know what you are doing beforehand, and can practice the sequencing, instead of not knowing what comes next. But then again when I played the piano I also found it easier to memorize the piece . . .

[Guest Shadowboxer]

Well, I had forgotten about 'over' and 'away', so that's my theory shot down :D

However, I have been told, by someone who "should" know that I would be penalized for using a two word command, even if the two word are run together, e.g. 'findit' for scent discrimination & seekback, and 'fetchit' for retrieve ? I'm not prepared to test it in the ring so will stick to single words :D

With directed jumping I use 'away', and a hand signal plus 'over' for whichever jump is indicated. For directed retrieve it is a directional signal close to the dog's face & 'fetch'.

[MonElite]

Hand signal is fine if your dog can see you, what about if you are hiding and cant give a hand singal?

Thats why in a trial it is used but how about outside the square ;-)

Is there a retrieve over a directed jump?

My dog somewhat knows to turn left when he is told corner (thats from the showring) - maybe I will start on left and right next...

Soniq - in agility every course is different and you are not told what to do, each obsticle has a number and you are given some time to walk the course before the trial to memorise it.

In Obiedience you are told what to do.

[Guest azaufc]

Wow, i was hoping for 1 reply and i end up with more than twenty! That is great!

Thanks for the specifics Eddy, i am feeling better after every post. To think that i would have to change commands, especially b4 Friday is very stressfull.

Does anyone actually have different commands that they use in the ring?

I personally thought that there would be more that did. As i said, i don't want my formal recall command "abused" by anyone. As with the "OUT", or "DROP IT" command. I use "ENOUGH", that way when she was a puppy, noone could tell her to Drop it as they tried to.

I can sort of understand if, judge says eg.. "SIT YOUR DOGS", and your command is "DROP" for sit. You say "DROP", and someone elses dog goes down, it could be unfair. Other than that, it is absolutely rediculous. Like Myzska said, if a Schutz dog comes along what is he suppose to do?

Interesting.

BTW, is it just me or is Myzska a comedian? LOL. Maybe she should be. :D

Aaron

[PAX]

When you work your dog in a trial you are the only one and all sits must happen automatically, you stop dog sits.

Lots of people have different commands. For fetch i say take. It does not matter as long as you follow the rule book. The dog does not have a clue they just learn the cue word for the behavior. For all cues you use a hand signal aswell (except sit) so that helps the dog a lot.

Myszka..........for the directed retrieve you send your dog out to the box so hopefully the dog is looking at you at you and you use a hand/arm signal to tell him/her which jump left or right then they come back to you and front.

Soniq......... in agility you know the set course before you start the course with your dog. Before the event starts every one walks the course and the obstacles are numbered.

Shadowboxer........i just had this conversation with Susan Garrett, you could in theory say "hippopotumus" but you cant say "fetchit" because the rule book says one word..........pretty dumb, be funny to test it out but i'm not going to.

I love dog trialing

[Lablover]

Dogs have to know the command/concept before they can relate IT to the vocal cue.

It sounds as though you trained your dog and yourself on your own.

Good luck. Better than being us, sheep, LOL. Try to keep your vocal cues as short as possible.

[Guest Shadowboxer]

Thanks for clarifying that packsapunch. I shall stick to the briefest word possible - no hippopotomi or antidisestablishmentarianism for me :D

[zayda_asher]

Zayda's command to come back to heel is "in" - this is from any spot.

She has no command to heel off - she follows my left leg

Her command to look at me is "ready" (when the judge says "are you ready?" I say "ready!" and she looks to me!). She knows "look" for outside the ring.

She knows "drop" (down is to get off)

She knows the difference between "Wait" (another command is coming - use this for recalls) and "stay" (don't budge missy!!)

"Return" is to come back around me to heel.

I use my left hand for signals (I'm left handed!!), my signals are mostly standard but look slightly different because I use the opposite hand.

We will hopefully start trialing later this year, our teacher is a judge with many years experience and these commands have all been vetted as suitable :D

Our agility commands are an entirely different kettle of fish!!

We're in WA - some things a different in other states......

Hope this helps!!!!

Dan

Edited March 9, 2005 by zayda_asher

[Tilly]

I have no idea about commands for the ring / agility as that is not something I am involved in.

One experience I had with commands was when I took my GSD to obedience classes when he was little I got a big lecture about using his name as part of the command. As we have a number of dogs so we add their name as part of the command (eg fred drop, fred come, fred sit).

I asked the guy who was running the class how was the dog going to know the command was for him and not for one of the other dogs - he said I should have different commands for each dog. I just ignored him and continued using my dogs name as part of the command.

My boys have commands in english, german and hand signal - they response to all three.

[MonElite]

BTW, is it just me or is Myzska a comedian? LOL. Maybe she should be. ;)

Aaron

I think its only you....

When I'm in the ring - yes people are laughing, but to me it usually aint funny :D :D

[Greytmate]

I was told the reason why no other languages were to be used (other than english), is because some people used a made up word that had many syllables to get their dog to recall. They would keep talking gibberish until the unresponsive dog got motivated enough to get up and recall. When questioned they tried to say to the judge that it was Swahili or some other obscure language for "come". So the rule was brought in to stop these cheats.

Tilly, you were given the correct information about using the dog's name in the ring. You can use the dog's name to get its attention, but it must not recall on hearing its name, it must wait for the command. Therefore there must be a distinct break between using the name and the command, you cannot join them together. Otherwise the judge will say that the dog recalled upon hearing its name instead of recalling upon hearing the command, and you will fail the exercise. Even though you were not trialling with your own dogs, it would have been remiss of the instructor not to teach you the right thing, just in case you wanted to trial later.

[EddyAnne]

I'm sure that if I had some commands in Polish and asked a judge before the trial there would be no probs, most of them are human  :D  and will understand.

G'day, Eddy here.

Most Judges I've bumped into are quite human and understand, but then you might catch an odd one that for some reason may not be so understanding.

As I mentioned at the start of this topic, "all verbal commands must be in the English language unless approved otherwise by the Judge", so on approval from the Judge you can use any language including Swahili or even Polish words such as noga, mięsa, pasztet, but only on approval from the Judge.

Leaving things to the last minute at the trial increases the probability things mightn't get approved. The normal procedure for requests, say even if you wanted to trial in a wheelchair and there maybe concerns regarding access to hides for out of sight stays etc, is to contact the Trial Secretary at the time you are sending in your entry. The Trial Secretary can contact the Judge and together they can work things out and where the Judge can give approval or may not approve, and this even well before the trial.

For a Polish speaking competitor, maybe the Trial Secretary and Judge just might arrange that the Ring Steward speaks Polish fluently and that Steward can assist the Judge, but then who knows maybe the Judge might speak several other languages quite fluently.

Edited March 9, 2005 by EddyAnne

[MonElite]

Thanks Eddy makes a lot of sence.

Since I dont have this problem as I tought the dog in English, but I will remember for the future, never know the next one might be tought in Polish to limit strangers giving commands.

Ahhh who knows......

[FHRP]

Of course this will be only my PERSONAL opinion, but I think this rule is somewhat wrong.

Dumbell is thrown, if you say to the dog fetch it should just go and fetch it, perhaps without a jump. If you want your dog to fetch over a jump the command should be fetch, over.

But as I said that is MHO only.

In theory (of course) and not in a UD trial lets imagine that you have a jump to the left and a jump to the right and in the middle you throw a dumbell

If you say fetch the dog should run straight and get it, if you say fetch over right dog should fetch it over the right jump.

yes I know I'm dreaming :D

I just think it is important and difficult to teach dogs a series of words - such as go upstairs and get my red slippers instead of a one word fetch.

OK I will be quiet now, what do I know, dont even have a CD on my dog. :D

You can use a different command for the retrieve over solid from retrieve on the flat, and it can be taught to the dog that it means take the jump and retrieve. You may choose 'fetch' for a straight retrieve and 'over' for a retrieve over a jump. You then may choose to use 'jump' for a dog to take a jump without having to fetch something. Personally I use the same command for both retrieves, which I guess means to my dog take a straight line there and back (which for the retrieve over the obstacle means take the jump!!)

OK, to maybe help some confusion with the exercise. Straight forward retrieves are done in OPEN. A retrieve on the flat where you heel forward, halt, throw the dumbell then send the dog, there will be no obstacle between them and the dumbell (unless you have done a very bad throw ;) ). The retrieve over solid, you set your dog up directly in front of the obstacle, throw the dumbell and send the dog.

In UD, you have directed jumping, but there is no retrieve to it. You send the dog to a box (running between two jumps) and the dog sits facing you. You then recall the dog back via a jump. Two commands are given in this exercise, one to send the dog, and one to recall the dog. I use a hand signal and a different command from retrieve over solid for the directed jump.

If in your example of getting a dog to take a different line other than straight, over a jump and retrieve, I would have to train that as a seperate exercise, it certainly isn't something our dogs are expected to do in the trial ring here. I would start with a directional and then the retrieve, however I would hope to reduce it like every other exercise to a hand signal and single command.

I am not trying to justify why everything in the obedience ring has one command, I think your reasoning is very practical! In everyday life, I do use more than one command and see no reason why people can't, if it's not confusing the dog. In agility you can say things as much as you like!! Although I am using less and less different words in agility now.

[EddyAnne]

Thanks Eddy makes a lot of sence.

Since I dont have this problem as I tought the dog in English, but I will remember for the future, never know the next one might be tought in Polish to limit strangers giving commands.

Ahhh who knows......

G'day, Eddy here.

My wife and I have competed at hundreds of trials and we really didn't have any problems with strangers giving commands. Before we trialed we just included some additional training for various distractions which included strangers calling out different commands.

We knew that there might be odd occasions where my wife and I might happen to be in rings next to each other at the same time, say my wife in Open and me in UD, and that our doggies just might get confused or distracted, so we also did some additional training to counter these possible situations.

By the way, my wife and I use the same commands with our doggies, and at times we may swap doggies in training or may even swap doggies at trials. On some odd occasions a couple of close friends have trialed our doggies and we trialed their doggies, and we even got passes.

Personally I wouldn't bother training my dogs to another language, besides I may happen to bump into a Judge who for some reason may not approve the use of another language.

[Kavik]

So far very informative thread :D

Someone at work got her dog as an adult, and it was taught in French. She had been told she could only trial it if commands were in English, and never trialled the dog, so now I can tell her otherwise!

[FHRP]

One experience I had with commands was when I took my GSD to obedience classes when he was little I got a big lecture about using his name as part of the command. As we have a number of dogs so we add their name as part of the command (eg fred drop, fred come, fred sit).

I asked the guy who was running the class how was the dog going to know the command was for him and not for one of the other dogs - he said I should have different commands for each dog. I just ignored him and continued using my dogs name as part of the command.

My boys have commands in english, german and hand signal - they response to all three.

This is an interesting one.

When I am working my dogs for obedience, I do it one at a time. I want the dogs attention and I want them interacting with me. For that reason I have no need to use their name in obedience exercises as part of a command... BUT... I do use my younger boys name on the recall, with a definite pause between the name and call. When I release my dogs from the c-crate they are all in together at trials I will say their name and then their release word (which is the same for all of them). I think for this reason my youger boy was getting 'sticky' on the recalls. No other exercise seems to be affected.

At home, I will use their name before a command if I have multiple dogs around. Sometimes it is not so succesful and more than one dog wants to do the task, but it is always informal if I have multiple dogs around so I will restain one.

The difference may be between training dogs to live with and training for trials. I certainly wouldn't be teaching each of my dogs a different command for everything!! No way I would remember :D If it works for what you want, use the dogs names!!

[Kavik]

I don't use my dogs names when doing a formal recall, because they will come on their name :D

I do find that when I give a command with both dogs around they both do it! Normally this isn't a problem, but I am working on getting one of them to do a drop stay while I heel the other around, just to see if I can.

[MonElite]

Thanks for clarification of the jumps ad retrieves in UD and Open.

i think I might have gotten the idea of a retrieve over a directed jump from some European trails, thats why.

As to teaching dogs commands in other languages - for me it is easier to speak to my dog in Polish since it is my first language.

Non obiedience commands are in Polish in my household. Formal ones in English so its easier for training club, trials etc.

I guess what I mean by the dog not responding to commands given by other people is that my dog will work for anyone becouse he has been tought that, however I think the next one I will teach that he is to work for me and my husband only. Well not only but not that he does everything everyone tells him to do, if you know what I mean.

[EddyAnne]

i think I might have gotten the idea of a retrieve over a directed jump from some European trails, thats why.

G'day, Eddy here.

It's good to get ideas from many places and use them in your training.

I like to use directed retrieves when training for the broadjump. Briefly explained, I just position the dog then move to the side of the jump, then throw a food treat or toy and tell the dog to go get it. Later the food treat or toy is not thrown but the arm action signal is still used, and when the dog doesn't find the food treat or toy on the ground they then come to you.

By the way, a dog is capable of understanding up to 10 different command words for the one action, say down command for drop action, plus cheese command for drop action, plus noga command for drop action, etc. So you could easily teach your dog to drop and use 2 different command words for this, one word in English and another in Polish. You could even do this with hand signals or combination of hand signals and vocal commands.