The Spotted Devil Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 (edited) Hey corvus! Just thinking - but isn't the opposite of boldness not timidity or sensitivity but SHYNESS (perhaps better encompasses a reserved nature too)? Have you read Svartberk 2005? Edited October 11, 2011 by The Spotted Devil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corvus Posted October 11, 2011 Author Share Posted October 11, 2011 It is, and I should have said 'shy', but actually somehow thought 'timid' was practically the same thing and might be easier to swallow. Oops! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poodlefan Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 It is, and I should have said 'shy', but actually somehow thought 'timid' was practically the same thing and might be easier to swallow. Oops! I don't find "shy" any less easy to swallow. "Reserved" on the other hand.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spotted Devil Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 (edited) It is, and I should have said 'shy', but actually somehow thought 'timid' was practically the same thing and might be easier to swallow. Oops! I think shy encompasses "interest in" as well as "fear of" but "timidity" really refers to fearfulness. But I'm not a psychologist! ETA: pf - we posted at the same time. The psychs have a bold-shy continuum scale. I think it's really important to acknowledge that we cannot know the internal motivation and thus the descriptive only refers to what we can observe. Also, I would be interested in a comparison between how an owner describes the behaviour of their dog in a certain setting and how an independent third party would describe it. corvus - how many dogs? Sorry I might have missed it..... Edited October 11, 2011 by The Spotted Devil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatsofatsoman Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 It is, and I should have said 'shy', but actually somehow thought 'timid' was practically the same thing and might be easier to swallow. Oops! I don't find "shy" any less easy to swallow. "Reserved" on the other hand.. Or "couldn't give a sh!t about things I'm not bred for" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Podengo Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 None of the sighthounds I have met yet in my search for the perfect dog breed have been timid or shy, and none of the Greys I have met or worked with were timid or shy either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poodlefan Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 (edited) It is, and I should have said 'shy', but actually somehow thought 'timid' was practically the same thing and might be easier to swallow. Oops! I don't find "shy" any less easy to swallow. "Reserved" on the other hand.. Or "couldn't give a sh!t about things I'm not bred for" Which manifests in some sighthounds as "couldn't give a shit about making nice with strangers". I dont know about all Sighthounds but I can tell you that there's no way known I'd be on SSM's property if there was no one home and Jadir was on patrol. Some sighthounds (not necessarily Salukis) have performed guarding functions over the years (hello Azawakhs) and anyone concluding that all sighthounds aren't protective could be in for a bit of a shock.. a 50kph or more closing fast shock ;) Edited October 11, 2011 by poodlefan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WreckitWhippet Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Male 'Zoi are growing on me.. goofy seems to be hard wired into them. Mine is a complete idiot and is about as far from timid, as one could get Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spotted Devil Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 It is, and I should have said 'shy', but actually somehow thought 'timid' was practically the same thing and might be easier to swallow. Oops! I don't find "shy" any less easy to swallow. "Reserved" on the other hand.. Or "couldn't give a sh!t about things I'm not bred for" Yes, that exactly describes my Dally Yet some would thus define him as being "weak nerved" - don't get me started Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alyosha Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 If you could prise mine off your legs, shoulders or lap (if you're silly enough to sit down that is!) for long enough to try and find out, you might find them far less than timid or shy... Until they see something better to do that is! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WreckitWhippet Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 I wasn't trying to communicate my intent in the OP. I was trying to open the way for sighthound people to comment without leading them. I am happy with how people responded and continue to respond. It gave me the different perspective I was seeking. If I had data that showed gundogs were more often overweight than other breed groups, I think "Why are gundogs fat?" would be a good question. It gives people the opportunity to say "They're not if fed properly" or "they do seem to have a tendency to get fat easily" and an opportunity to offer explanations for why it might appear that they are, which is basically what I got from the sighthound people. If some gundog people get offended along the way, well, that's a shame because I wasn't saying their gundogs were fat. However, I would like to point out once again that there's nothing wrong with being shy or "less-bold". There is something wrong with being fat. As far as statistics is concerned, we like to pretend that our samples are representative of the population, but I think realistically that is highly unlikely. In my view, there will be skews. It doesn't mean the research is codswallop. It just means there are pieces missing and I get to try to guess what they are and how to fill them in, which is uber fun and challenging. From here I hit the literature again and try to find support for some of the things people here have said. If I find it, it goes into the paper and I get to discuss it. If I don't find it, it's difficult to justify discussing it. Journals don't like a lot of speculation. Academic speeak for " we make it up as we go along " Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keshwar Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 It is, and I should have said 'shy', but actually somehow thought 'timid' was practically the same thing and might be easier to swallow. Oops! I don't find "shy" any less easy to swallow. "Reserved" on the other hand.. Or "couldn't give a sh!t about things I'm not bred for" Which manifests in some sighthounds as "couldn't give a shit about making nice with strangers". I dont know about all Sighthounds but I can tell you that there's no way known I'd be on SSM's property if there was no one home and Jadir was on patrol. Some sighthounds (not necessarily Salukis) have performed guarding functions over the years (hello Azawakhs) and anyone concluding that all sighthounds aren't protective could be in for a bit of a shock.. a 50kph or more closing fast shock ;) LOL - Jadir is the decoy - it's Faxon you really need to watch out for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maddy Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 The opposite of bold is not necessarily timid. Reserved might be a better description for sighthounds if that's what you're looking for. Not clear on what you're calling timid, I've always had sighthounds and any visitors we have or people we meet when we're out and about are pretty much mobbed. Bold for sighthounds is contextual as well. Many are bold on the hunt - because that's what they are tuned into. But may not be bold around people, as many sighthounds can take or leave people (other than their own ones that is!). And the fine bones and coat thing is a bit general. A good many sighthound breeds are long or rough coated, and care not for what they crash into if they are enjoying themselves... I'm trying not to be offended by the timid generalisation as it is so far from correct sighthound temperament, and seems an unnecessarily negative box to put them in. Agree with all of this. Our hounds are behind a second gate because otherwise, visitors can't get to the back door for the mob of excited greeters who seem to believe every visitor is for them :p And as far as being wary about hurting themselves.. if they were, my vet would see a lot less of me One current foster has almost injured himself horribly a few times. One involved galloping directly into a door frame (he'd been playing with a toy and was having a bit of a crazy run around). He turned his head at the last moment and just bruised up his shoulder but it could've been a lot worse if he'd hit it head-on. In my experience, their sense of self-preservation is a bit.. lacking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poodlefan Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 (edited) I dont know about all Sighthounds but I can tell you that there's no way known I'd be on SSM's property if there was no one home and Jadir was on patrol. Some sighthounds (not necessarily Salukis) have performed guarding functions over the years (hello Azawakhs) and anyone concluding that all sighthounds aren't protective could be in for a bit of a shock.. a 50kph or more closing fast shock ;) LOL - Jadir is the decoy - it's Faxon you really need to watch out for. I'd believe it but it is hard to take blondes as seriously. ;) Did 'Ghans have a guarding role in their villages Bear? Edited October 11, 2011 by poodlefan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OSoSwift Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 The opposite of bold is not necessarily timid. Reserved might be a better description for sighthounds if that's what you're looking for. Not clear on what you're calling timid, I've always had sighthounds and any visitors we have or people we meet when we're out and about are pretty much mobbed. Bold for sighthounds is contextual as well. Many are bold on the hunt - because that's what they are tuned into. But may not be bold around people, as many sighthounds can take or leave people (other than their own ones that is!). And the fine bones and coat thing is a bit general. A good many sighthound breeds are long or rough coated, and care not for what they crash into if they are enjoying themselves... I'm trying not to be offended by the timid generalisation as it is so far from correct sighthound temperament, and seems an unnecessarily negative box to put them in. Agree with all of this. Our hounds are behind a second gate because otherwise, visitors can't get to the back door for the mob of excited greeters who seem to believe every visitor is for them :p And as far as being wary about hurting themselves.. if they were, my vet would see a lot less of me One current foster has almost injured himself horribly a few times. One involved galloping directly into a door frame (he'd been playing with a toy and was having a bit of a crazy run around). He turned his head at the last moment and just bruised up his shoulder but it could've been a lot worse if he'd hit it head-on. In my experience, their sense of self-preservation is a bit.. lacking. Ah yes I fully agree with this and it seems my friends Whippets are also the same Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snippet Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Our whippets suffer from excessive greeting disorder and are anything but shy; but..............our Jed is the spook, terrified of most things in life. He was three and an ex racer when we got him, no idea whether it was his handling or if it is the way he was born. Two years on and he will go up to some people but is still terrified of children and most people. It has been the most rewarding experience to have him and all the greyhounds that come and go through our life I have never seen another like him. He has pannus which probably does not help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keshwar Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 I dont know about all Sighthounds but I can tell you that there's no way known I'd be on SSM's property if there was no one home and Jadir was on patrol. Some sighthounds (not necessarily Salukis) have performed guarding functions over the years (hello Azawakhs) and anyone concluding that all sighthounds aren't protective could be in for a bit of a shock.. a 50kph or more closing fast shock ;) LOL - Jadir is the decoy - it's Faxon you really need to watch out for. I'd believe it but it is hard to take blondes as seriously. ;) Did 'Ghans have a guarding role in their villages Bear? Faxon is the black one! ;) Depends what you want to believe. There is the legend about Afghan hounds guarding a British outpost in Afghanistan in the 19th century. Apparentlyy they patrolled in pairs with no human intervention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alyosha Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 My old 'Ghan was a quiet defender of property too, rarely did he bark - but it was a big one when he did. A local teenage girl thought she'd take a shortcut through our backyard one evening as she'd met him outside the yard and he was a fluffy goofball. He was off his bed and had her down with a foot on each shoulder before she knew what was what. Scary indeed. Didn't hurt her but pinned her. An inspection showed him he knew her and he let her up. But no way was she going anywhere otherwise. I wouldn't enter an Afghan's property without their owner, even if I thought I knew them. No more than I would enter a GSD or Rottie's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monah Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 (edited) Sighthounds I've had have never been shy or timid..but they have not been interested in other humans or dogs most of the time, so appear to be snobs! we've had them allow people IN, but not OUT, and I remember asking a neighbour, very well known to the dogs, to let them out while I was out for the day, and coming home at 6pm to find him trapped in the house! plus, they did not go out for wees 'cause they would not go with him! wolfies can be embarrassing though, any amount of Ooohs and aahhhs and chatting them up leaves them mostly cold and aloof I've had the same happen to me when I've been 'all over' deeries I've met and they've turned and looked the other way!.. I adore sighthounds. Edited October 11, 2011 by Monah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alyosha Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Corvus, imagine doing a study on canine nutrition and coming in here and starting a topic "Why are gun dogs so fat?" All of your research will be wasted if people don't want to hear it. I was thinking about this and agree with you Greyt. But even more so, think the implication of timid/shy is offensive because it's a physical fault in so many Sighthound breeds. So it's equivalent to doing a study on health issues and coming in asking something similar to "Why do working breeds tend to have hip dysplasia?" It's insulting to insinuate broad sweeping generalisations about a group of dogs that, if correct, would constitute bad breeding. Corvus still hasn't answered my questions about what use will the results of this study be to anyone if the starting point information is widely considered completely incorrect? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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