Chequeredblackdog Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 (edited) I was bitten on the face by a Dalmation when I was three,I know my mum and dad made sure that I sent time with friendly dogs, one of which was a neighbours HUGE male GSD Luckily the incident, thanks to my parents sense (and probably my animal obsessed nature), didn't have a tramatic or lasting effect on me :D I'm with Ruralpug about the small "precious babies". Dachsunds in particular, I've almost lost digits on a couple of occasions. Apart from the "precious babies" I find my wariness tends to be more situational. Edited October 3, 2011 by Chequeredblackdog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuralPug Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 Agreed, Zuri, but genetic aggression can happen in ANY dog of any breed - breeders in many instances will know lines that can have this tendency, responsible breeders avoid using those lines. However I think that environmental factors play a HUGE part in agression, both DA and HA. The dog that has ONLY a genetic component to their aggression is a very rare beast, in my experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
german_shep_fan Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 btw, most aggressive dogs are that way because of the people that own them, they are usually not born that way. I had lengthy chat with a GSD breeder of 30 years experience about aggression in the breed which she maintains is in the dogs genetics, either they have an aggression tendency or they don't, and where it surfaces is when the owners of the potentially aggressive individuals haven't dealt with the problem adequately in training and management. She told us that she had aggression in her lines years ago that came in from one dog effecting a couple of generations mainly in males that were stranger aggressive and would instinctively bite people they didn't know, she said they were not safe dogs for anyone outside the family and she corrected the situation by breeding the trait out of her bloodlines? Others can correct me if i am wrong but as far a GSDs are concerned (to my knowledge) the working bloodline (used in police and corrective services work ect) do have a higher prey and aggression drive then other bloodlines of shep. They have been bred for this specifically in order to do the work required of them and have experienced handlers who know how to deal with them training and taking care of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Souff Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 btw, most aggressive dogs are that way because of the people that own them, they are usually not born that way. I had lengthy chat with a GSD breeder of 30 years experience about aggression in the breed which she maintains is in the dogs genetics, either they have an aggression tendency or they don't, and where it surfaces is when the owners of the potentially aggressive individuals haven't dealt with the problem adequately in training and management. She told us that she had aggression in her lines years ago that came in from one dog effecting a couple of generations mainly in males that were stranger aggressive and would instinctively bite people they didn't know, she said they were not safe dogs for anyone outside the family and she corrected the situation by breeding the trait out of her bloodlines? Others can correct me if i am wrong but as far a GSDs are concerned (to my knowledge) the working bloodline (used in police and corrective services work ect) do have a higher prey and aggression drive then other bloodlines of shep. They have been bred for this specifically in order to do the work required of them and have experienced handlers who know how to deal with them training and taking care of them. Which is why I did not use the phrase "all aggressive dogs" in my comment. I could have said "some aggressive dogs" but I really think that most of the aggression we see today is the result of having the wrong owners who do not seem to understand that dog ownership is all about training and management of the dog. Souff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zuri Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 btw, most aggressive dogs are that way because of the people that own them, they are usually not born that way. I had lengthy chat with a GSD breeder of 30 years experience about aggression in the breed which she maintains is in the dogs genetics, either they have an aggression tendency or they don't, and where it surfaces is when the owners of the potentially aggressive individuals haven't dealt with the problem adequately in training and management. She told us that she had aggression in her lines years ago that came in from one dog effecting a couple of generations mainly in males that were stranger aggressive and would instinctively bite people they didn't know, she said they were not safe dogs for anyone outside the family and she corrected the situation by breeding the trait out of her bloodlines? Others can correct me if i am wrong but as far a GSDs are concerned (to my knowledge) the working bloodline (used in police and corrective services work ect) do have a higher prey and aggression drive then other bloodlines of shep. They have been bred for this specifically in order to do the work required of them and have experienced handlers who know how to deal with them training and taking care of them. Actually, the GSD breeder I spoke of which I thought the stranger aggressive dogs would be used for police dogs, she said the police won't use dogs like that, they have to be high in prey drive but very stable in temperament apparantly? She said they train aggression into the dogs as an extension of prey drive and the type of dog they use is a courageous dog when challenged that doesn't back down or run away, but she said they teach the dog to win fights with obviously lengthy and specialised training. She told us that young GSD's the police pick for training are pups that mad on chasing balls, playing tug with heaps of energy, not one's that are snappy, fearful or show aggressive tendencies? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
german_shep_fan Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 btw, most aggressive dogs are that way because of the people that own them, they are usually not born that way. I had lengthy chat with a GSD breeder of 30 years experience about aggression in the breed which she maintains is in the dogs genetics, either they have an aggression tendency or they don't, and where it surfaces is when the owners of the potentially aggressive individuals haven't dealt with the problem adequately in training and management. She told us that she had aggression in her lines years ago that came in from one dog effecting a couple of generations mainly in males that were stranger aggressive and would instinctively bite people they didn't know, she said they were not safe dogs for anyone outside the family and she corrected the situation by breeding the trait out of her bloodlines? Others can correct me if i am wrong but as far a GSDs are concerned (to my knowledge) the working bloodline (used in police and corrective services work ect) do have a higher prey and aggression drive then other bloodlines of shep. They have been bred for this specifically in order to do the work required of them and have experienced handlers who know how to deal with them training and taking care of them. Actually, the GSD breeder I spoke of which I thought the stranger aggressive dogs would be used for police dogs, she said the police won't use dogs like that, they have to be high in prey drive but very stable in temperament apparantly? She said they train aggression into the dogs as an extension of prey drive and the type of dog they use is a courageous dog when challenged that doesn't back down or run away, but she said they teach the dog to win fights with obviously lengthy and specialised training. She told us that young GSD's the police pick for training are pups that mad on chasing balls, playing tug with heaps of energy, not one's that are snappy, fearful or show aggressive tendencies? No they wouldn't take ones that show aggressive tendencies as these are not good traits to have, they need to be able to control the aggression and have the dog turn it on and off so to speak i suppose lol Someone who is more versed in the working lines might be able to answer you correctly. sorry :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zuri Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 (edited) btw, most aggressive dogs are that way because of the people that own them, they are usually not born that way. I had lengthy chat with a GSD breeder of 30 years experience about aggression in the breed which she maintains is in the dogs genetics, either they have an aggression tendency or they don't, and where it surfaces is when the owners of the potentially aggressive individuals haven't dealt with the problem adequately in training and management. She told us that she had aggression in her lines years ago that came in from one dog effecting a couple of generations mainly in males that were stranger aggressive and would instinctively bite people they didn't know, she said they were not safe dogs for anyone outside the family and she corrected the situation by breeding the trait out of her bloodlines? Others can correct me if i am wrong but as far a GSDs are concerned (to my knowledge) the working bloodline (used in police and corrective services work ect) do have a higher prey and aggression drive then other bloodlines of shep. They have been bred for this specifically in order to do the work required of them and have experienced handlers who know how to deal with them training and taking care of them. Which is why I did not use the phrase "all aggressive dogs" in my comment. I could have said "some aggressive dogs" but I really think that most of the aggression we see today is the result of having the wrong owners who do not seem to understand that dog ownership is all about training and management of the dog. Souff Mine aren't aggressive, but I haven't really done nothing special in their raising to achieve that, they are just not aggressive, where a friend of ours has a seriously dog aggressive dog which is improving but has had a lot of work and money spent in training etc to date, but my point is, this dog just started to go after other dogs with aggression at about 5/6 months old and escalated quickly into what appeared as wanting to chase and tear every dog apart that he saw?. To me, there is nothing the owners did to create this situation, where one of mine of similar age was enjoying other dogs and loved to play, this dog suddenly wanted to kill them, which I am thinking aggression has to be in the dog's make up, their older dog same breed and raised the same is fine, like mine, aggression was never a problem to be addressed? Edited October 3, 2011 by zuri Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erny Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 (edited) I'm not wary of breeds of dogs. It's a matter of understanding them; not making assumptions; and knowing there are individuals within breeds. I am wary of politicians in Government and their agenda for the making of laws even though they know from proven fact that they don't work; aren't warranted; and/or make things worse; for their double standards and for their breaches of the rules of Natural Justice and Procedural Fairness. There's no understanding them. Edited October 3, 2011 by Erny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
german_shep_fan Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 I'm wary of some people in Government. Best "wary" in the whole post!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zuri Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 (edited) btw, most aggressive dogs are that way because of the people that own them, they are usually not born that way. I had lengthy chat with a GSD breeder of 30 years experience about aggression in the breed which she maintains is in the dogs genetics, either they have an aggression tendency or they don't, and where it surfaces is when the owners of the potentially aggressive individuals haven't dealt with the problem adequately in training and management. She told us that she had aggression in her lines years ago that came in from one dog effecting a couple of generations mainly in males that were stranger aggressive and would instinctively bite people they didn't know, she said they were not safe dogs for anyone outside the family and she corrected the situation by breeding the trait out of her bloodlines? Others can correct me if i am wrong but as far a GSDs are concerned (to my knowledge) the working bloodline (used in police and corrective services work ect) do have a higher prey and aggression drive then other bloodlines of shep. They have been bred for this specifically in order to do the work required of them and have experienced handlers who know how to deal with them training and taking care of them. Actually, the GSD breeder I spoke of which I thought the stranger aggressive dogs would be used for police dogs, she said the police won't use dogs like that, they have to be high in prey drive but very stable in temperament apparantly? She said they train aggression into the dogs as an extension of prey drive and the type of dog they use is a courageous dog when challenged that doesn't back down or run away, but she said they teach the dog to win fights with obviously lengthy and specialised training. She told us that young GSD's the police pick for training are pups that mad on chasing balls, playing tug with heaps of energy, not one's that are snappy, fearful or show aggressive tendencies? No they wouldn't take ones that show aggressive tendencies as these are not good traits to have, they need to be able to control the aggression and have the dog turn it on and off so to speak i suppose lol Someone who is more versed in the working lines might be able to answer you correctly. sorry :D The shows on TV with the K9 squads, the dogs are calm until commanded to work, they are not lunging at the camera man etc and they sit quietly during interviews with the officers. There has been a couple of retired police dogs shown at times running with other dogs and people patting them much like any average pet. It's amazing what the training can achieve with the right type of dog? As far as being wary, I am wary of off leash or unattended dogs I can't physically handle if it turns nasty, football size dogs are fine ;) Edited October 3, 2011 by zuri Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zug Zug Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 Hard to argue that there is no genetic component to aggression, I think. While it is easy to blame the owners, and at times this is justified, there are no doubt many sweet natured dogs being equally mismanaged who never feel a need to resort to violence or aggression. It has been an issue with GSDs in the past, and lots of effort went into breeding out tge aggressive lines. But I have met quite a few seriously reactive GSDs in recent times, and am a bit concerned these problems might be coming back. The nice GSDs are magnificent dogs though. Really something special. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Animal House Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 Stemming from a few childhood incidents, I'm rather cautious around Red Cattle dogs, and some GSD's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
german_shep_fan Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 Hard to argue that there is no genetic component to aggression, I think. While it is easy to blame the owners, and at times this is justified, there are no doubt many sweet natured dogs being equally mismanaged who never feel a need to resort to violence or aggression. It has been an issue with GSDs in the past, and lots of effort went into breeding out tge aggressive lines. But I have met quite a few seriously reactive GSDs in recent times, and am a bit concerned these problems might be coming back. The nice GSDs are magnificent dogs though. Really something special. Definately agree with your comment! It makes me so mad to see some of these young GSDs who wouldnt be more than 6-8mnths coming through the training school i go to who are shockers The owners look like they are responsible and trying everything they can with these dogs and seem to be getting little to no improvement. I have asked a few where they got their pup, its not hard to pick their breeders either Feel like giving the breeders of these dogs a blast and telling them to breed for the right things for a change! Hope this comment doesn't offend as obv i am a huge shep lover, but i feel atm some breeders are placing looks above temperament Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zuri Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 I have never had an issue with GSD's in terms of fearing them, I guess near were we lived growing up, there were a few car yards that used to have GSD guard dogs wandering around at night and on the weekend. One in particular I used to feed through the fence, he was beautiful, I wouldn't say I would have jumped the fence, but you could pat him through the fence and give him treats, he looked frocious running up to the fence barking, but he would settle, wag his tail, he was lovely Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erny Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 (edited) Hey!! Why doesn't someone start a list of dog breeds that can be dug up and used by the Govt/authorities/media/whoever down the track, that they might use as extra back-up (fallible though it is, but what does the Government care when it's their own point they like to defend) when they're looking for more breeds to pick-on and throw to the slaughter, to escape the heat? Oh . Somebody already did. Edited October 3, 2011 by Erny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mim Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 I am wary of any dogs displaying stand-offish or possibly aggressive body language, regardless of their breed or mix of breeds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gsdog2 Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 (edited) I have a German Shepherd and also foster a Military Working Dog GSD puppy and I have to say I've been so disappointed with the reaction of many people when they see me walking around shopping centres etc with my MWD pup - he's a puppy for goodness sake! Honestly, I have had people react as if he had a terrible contagious disease and must be avoided at all costs . As has already been said - although he is very high drive he is also great with both people and other dogs. New neighbours moved in last weekend with young primary-school aged kids who (thankfully) fell in love with my 3yr old GSD and my foster MWD puppy on sight and I have to say the feeling was obviously mutual, with the two shepherds lapping up all the attention these children were giving them. And yes, the children were being supervised, but it was quite obvious to everyone that both my own GSD and my foster puppy were never going to put them at any risk and it was a great introduction to German Shepherds for these children - so different to reaction I often receive on the streets when walking my MWD puppy Edited October 3, 2011 by gsdog2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandgrubber Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 (edited) Hey!! Why doesn't someone start a list of dog breeds that can be dug up and used by the Govt/authorities/media/whoever down the track, that they might use as extra back-up (fallible though it is, but what does the Government care when it's their own point they like to defend) when they're looking for more breeds to pick-on and throw to the slaughter, to escape the heat? Oh . Somebody already did. Good post! Hey, Ernie, I think you need an adjective before Nanny State . . . stupid, evil, brain-dead? Cruel? If I had more faith in government I'd grind my usual saw about breeders who select FOR aggression. But it would require sophistication to identify such breeders. Breed clubs might be able, but it's too much to expect of government. Personally, I'm wary of Labradors. Those big brown eyes get me. I always want to take them home. Edited October 3, 2011 by sandgrubber Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zuri Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 Hey!! Why doesn't someone start a list of dog breeds that can be dug up and used by the Govt/authorities/media/whoever down the track, that they might use as extra back-up (fallible though it is, but what does the Government care when it's their own point they like to defend) when they're looking for more breeds to pick-on and throw to the slaughter, to escape the heat? Oh . Somebody already did. Erny, it's quite clear what they are after, the policing of "restricted breeds", absolutely nothing indicates they are looking at adding breeds to the list. It's already been tested with the Amstaff when claims made it was a Pitbull of a different name and was the Amstaff struck off the ANKC register? No it was fixed in the same fashion it will be fixed if they target any other established breed. The Pitbull was never established or recognised in the first place, the poor thing has no voice of authority it's a soft target. Try restricting GSD's for example and watch the voices of authority come out swinging punches, it won't happen, the ANKC breeds have nothing to worry about for what my opinion is worth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
german_shep_fan Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 I have a German Shepherd and also foster a Military Working Dog GSD puppy and I have to say I've been so disappointed with the reaction of many people when they see me walking around shopping centres etc with my MWD pup - he's a puppy for goodness sake! Honestly, I have had people react as if he had a terrible contagious disease and must be avoided at all costs . As has already been said - although he is very high drive he is also great with both people and other dogs. New neighbours moved in last weekend with young primary-school aged kids who (thankfully) fell in love with my 3yr old GSD and my foster MWD puppy on sight and I have to say the feeling was obviously mutual, with the two shepherds lapping up all the attention these children were giving them. And yes, the children were being supervised, but it was quite obvious to everyone that both my own GSD and my foster puppy were never going to put them at any risk and it was a great introduction to German Shepherds for these children - so different to reaction I often receive on the streets when walking my MWD puppy I get that reaction everyday from the public with my normal blk/tan GSD i just don't even bother looking at them. My right to own whatever the hell breed of dog i want, and if they don't like them, stiff cookies as far as im concerned, they are trained and well socialised members of society Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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