Pm's 'cavoodle'

[toy*dog]

But did she buy her puppy from a puppy farm and if so by who's definition ?

Is this a filthy disgusting place or is it someone who breeds dogs commercially?

someone is saying the pictures tell all by animal welfare groups, designed to make it look as bad as they can no doubt, i haven't looked not interested to look, it is a commercial breeding farm that has a licence to breed dogs legally by the government and the shire in which they reside. and this is where i have a problem. i am against dogs being bred like battery hens this way because of the health status issue because i know that they can't possibly test each and every dog that they have in their possession and also each and every bloodline because nothing is down on paper pertainning to bloodlines because they have no pedigrees like we have in ANKC anyway. yes they can make up pedigrees but no research can be conducted like i would do on many generations before. Given the issues that the dog breeds have and it is an uphill battle to breed even pedigree dogs properly (im still not completely there even after 26 years battling it out!!!) they would find it near impossible. even when you test and research you still have diseases and genetic conditions coming through and its a battle to breed sound dogs a joy to own. and they are saying its easy to breed in good temperament, IT IS NOT EASY been there done that a thousand times over.

what the farmers have said on that article indicates to me they know zero about dog breeds and zero about the requirements needed.

Edited September 28, 2011 by toy*dog

[toy*dog]

and just to add onto what someone said (sorry didn't look back) about emailing ACA for instance here is the link if anyone wants to do that;

ACA tell us your story

[Nic.B]

Billabong Creek and the PMs Pooch on one side, V's Debra Tranter/Animal activisits on the other.

It should make for an interesting couple of weeks.

What a BIG FAILURE and a slap in the face for the Oscars Law folk.

Why is it that our PM buying a DD is a big failure for Oscars law in particular?

It is a slap in the face for registered breeders and rescue. It also highlights the scale of the DD problem.

I would say more so for Oscars Law - this is one of the farms they have targeted and written about as examples of what they are fighting.

Sorry Steve I disagree. Register breeders and rescue orgs have been around for a lot longer than Oscars Law.

We cant seem to be able to tackle the PF'ing issues either. Why do we expect OL to reslove all the issues overnight?

It can take years to close down a hideous and proven inhumane PF even when the RSPCA are involved.

I dont expect OL to resolve things over night and the way they are going the only thing they will change is any progress anyone else is making.

This is not a proven inhumane puppy farm at all and that is the whole point - apart from the obvious breed issues it is the selection of this particular breeder which is a slap in the

face for OL because from what I can see they are the only ones who have said it is inhumane.

I guess it is difficult to tell how reputable these breeders are. You certainly cant tell from a glossy website or what they sprout. I wouldnt trust them as far as I could throw them.

My concern is that our PM is sending a shocking message to the public who are in desperate need of education in these matters. The point of sale (which is anyone who has the money) is the same and of great concern as it is a contributing factor which leads to dumping or neglect of companion animals.

Where do we draw the line?

[Nic.B]

Billabong Creek and the PMs Pooch on one side, V's Debra Tranter/Animal activisits on the other.

It should make for an interesting couple of weeks.

What a BIG FAILURE and a slap in the face for the Oscars Law folk.

Why is it that our PM buying a DD is a big failure for Oscars law in particular?

It is a slap in the face for registered breeders and rescue. It also highlights the scale of the DD problem.

I would say more so for Oscars Law - this is one of the farms they have targeted and written about as examples of what they are fighting.

Sorry Steve I disagree. Register breeders and rescue orgs have been around for a lot longer than Oscars Law.

We cant seem to be able to tackle the PF'ing issues either. Why do we expect OL to reslove all the issues overnight?

It can take years to close down a hideous and proven inhumane PF even when the RSPCA are involved.

I dont expect OL to resolve things over night and the way they are going the only thing they will change is any progress anyone else is making.

This is not a proven inhumane puppy farm at all and that is the whole point - apart from the obvious breed issues it is the selection of this particular breeder which is a slap in the

face for OL because from what I can see they are the only ones who have said it is inhumane.

If they were breaching the codes in VIC, surely the RSPCA and the relevant council would have been onto it by now ?

Or is it that they are simply a commericial breeding facility and Oscars Law take exception to that, regardless of them ticking all the boxes in terms of what is spelled out under the current legislation?

Is it really a hell hole ? or simply another commercial breeding facility ?

I am not so sure about that. I know that some Pf's will not allow access for the RSPCA and stall for as long as they can.

Probably gives them time to clean up....

It is not just the offspring people are concerned about, it is also the males and females who spend their days penned up and having litter after litter. What happens to them once they are no longer useful? What is their quality of life?

[Rileys mum]

Oh my GOD. Look at the prices!!!!

$1500.00 plus for a cross bred???? Are.people actually stupid enough to pay that??? INSANITY.

Sorry slightly off topic....i just can't get over that.

[Ellie]

Oh my GOD. Look at the prices!!!!

$1500.00 plus for a cross bred???? Are.people actually stupid enough to pay that??? INSANITY.

Sorry slightly off topic....i just can't get over that.

[/quote

Yep, and $1,800 for a "spoodle". I couldn't see anywhere on the website where they health test the parents either.

[Esky the husky]

judging on their facebook page they are roughheads those people , threatening people!!!!! i was on the end of that one myself........

i just can't believe that the PM and her partner fell for their propaganda BS. prices of these mutts are going to sky rocket now. goodbye pedigree dog hello designer mongrel mutt.

I guess the only consolation might be that people can't afford one of these ridiculously priced mutts and might end up coming back to a registered breeder.

Bloody hell I felt sick opening the paper to see this picture today.

[Steve]

I am not so sure about that. I know that some Pf's will not allow access for the RSPCA and stall for as long as they can.

Probably gives them time to clean up....

It is not just the offspring people are concerned about, it is also the males and females who spend their days penned up and having litter after litter. What happens to them once they are no longer useful? What is their quality of life?

Nic No one who owns a dog in NSW or Victoria can stall the RSPCA they have the power to come and go and check at any time .In Victoria they have the power to police outside of POCTAA and their website would at least imply they are anti commercial breeder and wouldnt cut them much slack. They have been inspected by a constant stream of puppy buyers, council and RSPCA and put under the microscope over and over and they are still operating and whats more the people who buy their puppies are seemingly very happy with them. According to them they are not penned up all the time and they say they are doing what they need to in order to give them all good quality of life.

We have to stick to the facts which can be proven we cant beat a drum because we think the way they do it isnt any good without any evidence and without them being found guilty .We cant fight based on what quality of life they may have and what happens to them isnt something anyone else gets a say in. If they do kill them when they dont want them any more thats still not making them suffer and unless they do its not something anyone else can make a judgement on.

Stand back from this a minute - how you feel is how I feel but that wont win any battles. We need plans which entail gathering the science to back up what we think and real facts and data and we have to stop fighting with what we feel because obviously plenty of people dont feel the same way and feelings dont count when you go into to fight a war.

[Steve]

[Yep, and $1,800 for a "spoodle". I couldn't see anywhere on the website where they health test the parents either.

The whole point to their marketing since way back in Don Burkes most active pro DD days is that they dont need to test because each breed has different recessives. While ever there is no mandatory health testing and breeders from all groups dont test its rather a wasted argument .For every commercial breeder you find who doesnt test you can find breeders from any group who dont test .

Fact is it works more in their favour than against it as their stance is there is no need - and there isnt for recessives.

[Steve]

judging on their facebook page they are roughheads those people , threatening people!!!!! i was on the end of that one myself........

i just can't believe that the PM and her partner fell for their propaganda BS. prices of these mutts are going to sky rocket now. goodbye pedigree dog hello designer mongrel mutt.

I guess the only consolation might be that people can't afford one of these ridiculously priced mutts and might end up coming back to a registered breeder.

Bloody hell I felt sick opening the paper to see this picture today.

People havent gone away from registered breeders - we still have more demand than supply and we make it pretty hard to get one too.

[Nic.B]

Quote;

'Stand back from this a minute - how you feel is how I feel but that wont win any battles. We need plans which entail gathering the science to back up what we think and real facts and data and we have to stop fighting with what we feel because obviously plenty of people dont feel the same way and feelings dont count when you go into to fight a war.'

I know.....it is so bloody frustrating!! Fancy the PM getting a DD and its breeders being plastered all over the place.

[Steve]

Quote;

'Stand back from this a minute - how you feel is how I feel but that wont win any battles. We need plans which entail gathering the science to back up what we think and real facts and data and we have to stop fighting with what we feel because obviously plenty of people dont feel the same way and feelings dont count when you go into to fight a war.'

I know.....it is so bloody frustrating!! Fancy the PM getting a DD and its breeders being plastered all over the place.

Yep I know makes you want to yell and kick and scream and do all manner of things not classified lady like but seriously I really do think we have some things we can really use as long as we stay focused on what it true and legal and provable.Its the methodolgy that will kill us off if we dont stop and moderately develop a strategic plan .

[Elenbah]

In case it counts a federal MP has one of my beagles - labour too.

Yep.!...I had a labour backbencher give one of my shelties a lovely home as well.. He now has ADX and JDX after his name...

[Dju]

The puppy farm Billabong Creek Farm has a Facebook, and I'm happy to see that it's being bombarded by negative comments since the article arose. Maybe some DOLers should get over there and spread the love.

I wanted to like Julia so much just because she's Labor and we're all for Labor in this household, but I think I kind of hate her now. Her actions sure make me enraged at the very least. I really hope those puppy farmers don't get a nice spike in their business from being publicly announced as being the place Julia Gillard got her mutt from..

[raz]

The puppy farm Billabong Creek Farm has a Facebook, and I'm happy to see that it's being bombarded by negative comments since the article arose. Maybe some DOLers should get over there and spread the love.

And dont they look like a bunch of animal activist nutjobs.

[Nic.B]

Hey Raz you are spot on re the flag protocol.

Makes it even worse that the PM is attached to the story.

[Steve]

The puppy farm Billabong Creek Farm has a Facebook, and I'm happy to see that it's being bombarded by negative comments since the article arose. Maybe some DOLers should get over there and spread the love.

I wanted to like Julia so much just because she's Labor and we're all for Labor in this household, but I think I kind of hate her now. Her actions sure make me enraged at the very least. I really hope those puppy farmers don't get a nice spike in their business from being publicly announced as being the place Julia Gillard got her mutt from..

Stop - take another look at what you have written - then see how this looks to ordinary people .

Julia didnt buy the dog her partner did as a gift for her. He did the research and conducted the transaction.Do you ordinarily judge people because another person purchased them a gift ?

This is a free country - people do have the right to choose which breed of dog or part there of they want to own.

There is no evidence that the breeder is treating their dogs cruelly or that anyone who has purchased their puppies have any grievance against them.

All this is doing is giving them MORE publicity and ensuring we all look like a bunch of fanatics who lack any logic or credibility.Its proving everything they say is true.

Of course they will get more business - lots of people will assume that the puppy wouldnt come from them if they were crook and lots of people will feel special to own a dog bred by the same people as the PM's dog

But anywhere the PM's dog came from would get the same benefit.If it had been purchsed from a particular rescue group they would have used it to strutt their stuff and so would any purebred breeder.

Not sure what other clear demonstration we need to show us the methodology thats been used is counter productive and to make us see if we continue to say things out loud and behave like a bunch of fanatics we go backwards.

Sticking with something that not only isnt working here didnt work in the states or the UK and they have had 20 years to demonstrate is madness .

This stuff doesnt just take back any fight against puppy farms it also hurts purebred dogs and rescue.

[raz]

Hey Raz you are spot on re the flag protocol.

Makes it even worse that the PM is attached to the story.

Yes that's what I thought, Nic. If it had just been a puppy shot on a breeder's website I wouldnt have thought anything of it, but her name and the office of PM attached to it for the purposes of promoting something - looks really bad, doesnt it.

[Wags]

Oh for Pete's Sake !!!!! First it was Burke's backyard and now it's the PM. When are the idiots going to realise that they in fact have a mongrel of very questionable descendants as to breed, or health background with no responsible thought put into it by the so called breeder, let alone care properly for her dogs and puppies.

We poor registered breeders are battered and beaten in the media, spend thousands of dollars and time researching the background of our dogs and specialist health testing trying to give our puppies the best possible chance for a happy healthy life, then ensure that our dogs and puppies have absolutely every thing they need, are criticised for the prices we charge for our puppies, under scrutiny by the general public, other breeders and canine councils - and these people are heralded as they are in the media.

Lord !!! Give us strength.

I will never question the price of my puppies, ever again, and at least I can sleep at night !!!!

Edited September 28, 2011 by Wags

[Wags]

and just to add onto what someone said (sorry didn't look back) about emailing ACA for instance here is the link if anyone wants to do that;

ACA tell us your storydone that - hope it has some positive results.