Time To Scrap All Puppy Farms

[Fanuilos]

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/opinion/its-time-to-scrap-puppy-farms/story-e6frfhqf-1226141260548

THE Baillieu Government should be congratulated for its commitment to shut down illegal puppy farms.

But why isn't it trying to shut down all puppy farms?

There's no such thing as a legitimate, safe puppy farm, or puppy factory.

There are about 70 Victorian registered dog-breeding establishments, many of which are puppy farms. This is 70 too many.

Should the Baillieu Government shut down all puppy farms? Blog with Susie all day at The Big O

According to Animal Liberation Victoria, puppy-farm dogs are kept in cages solely for the purpose of churning out puppies to supply the ever-expanding pet-shop trade. From around six months of age, female dogs are subjected to a gruelling continual cycle of pregnancies, and they're euthanased when they're no longer able to breed.

Dogs aren't allowed to mingle with other humans, they don't get to play, and they don't get the love and affection they desperately crave.

And, in most cases, puppies are often taken from their mothers at four or five weeks, and put on display in a sterile, noisy pet-shop window.

But puppy farmers are not the only ones to blame. If we really want to break their business model - where have I heard that before? - we must stop selling dogs and cats in pet stores. The RSPCA estimates that 95 per cent of dogs sold in pet shops are from backyard breeders or puppy farms.

Next time you walk past a pet shop in a shopping centre, don't just stop and coo at the cute little balls of fluff in the window. Tell the owner that they shouldn't be selling dogs and cats at all.

Stand and watch for a few minutes and you will see that a shop window is no place for a puppy or kitten to live. Young kids are continually tapping on the glass and upsetting the tiny animals. There's often not enough water or room for exercise. What happens if they're sad or lonely at night? There's no one around to hear them cry.

I also dislike the way these stores contribute to pets being an impulse buy, like a new handbag, or a dress.

Buying an animal isn't something you do after the movies on a Saturday afternoon because you feel like it. It's a major commitment and should be treated as such.

So if the Government is serious about improving pet-breeding conditions, it must ban the sale of dogs and cats from suburban pet stores - particularly those located in major shopping centres.

This is just another example of Premier Ted Baillieu talking tough, but apparently doing little. His family has three dogs, so you'd think he'd be a little more concerned about puppy farms.

Last year, his government pledged to "close poorly operated puppy farms", give the RSPCA more power and bring in stronger penalties.

I DO welcome stronger RSPCA powers, bigger fines of up to $30,000, and stronger codes of practice, but it's still not going far enough.

The Premier's media release from last year notes that "rogue" operators over-crowd animals, keep them in cages for a long period of time and give them insufficient water and food. So why allow any puppy farms if that's what they're like?

The picture painted by Animal Liberation Victoria is, admittedly, an extreme one. But even the RSPCA describes puppy farming as the "indiscriminate breeding of dogs on a large scale for the purposes of sale".

A defining characteristic is the "often permanent confinement of dogs in barren cages, and forced continual breeding for the duration of the animals' lives", the RSPCA says. It's no wonder that puppies raised in farms and sold through shops often have a range of psychological and behavioural issues because they haven't been raised in a normal home-like environment.

They may also have a range of genetic problems because of the intensive-breeding practices, as well as in-bred health problems that can be very expensive to fix.

At present, councils have to ensure puppy farms only abide by a conveniently broad code for breeding establishments, which means there is great variation between council areas.

It also means councils don't have the power they need to shut down or prohibit puppy farms in their local areas.

In July this year, a puppy-farm operator in Ballan wanted to establish a 100-dog development, against the wishes of both the local council and outraged locals.

But VCAT allowed the operators to establish a 50-dog farm, with a possible doubling of numbers if they are capable of caring for them.

No dog deserves to live and breed in a 100-dog farm, regardless of how clean or sanitary it might be.

There is no such thing as an acceptable puppy farm - they're a cruel form of animal abuse that continues to be sanctioned by the Government.

Puppies should only be brought from licensed breeders or animal-welfare shelters.

If a cute little ball of fluff is what you're after, there are a variety of reputable animal-rescue charities, such as Rescued With Love, which have lots of adorable retrained mutts waiting for a new home.

If you do buy through a shop, ask to see the pup's parents and to see where the puppy was born. You should quickly be able to work out whether the dog came from a puppy farm or not.

Last weekend, more than 1000 people rallied for Oscar's Law, which is a national campaign to end puppy farming.

I don't expect everyone to be activists, but I would hope that any family with a beloved pooch would care about the existence of puppy farms.

[Steve]

Oh goody yet another definition of a puppy farm

[toy*dog]

no mention of going to an ethical reg ANKC breeder. it just mentioned licenced, who is that, licenced is a puppy farm! they are licenced from the govt. no wonder the public are confused. not enough education out there. still i say.

[Lollipup]

I got told last night that I shouldn't believe what the media says in regards to pet shops and puppy farms as its not all that bad. And that I have clearly been influenced by animal rights groups - because most pet shops are ethical and fine.

[Her Majesty Dogmad]

Lollipop, whoever told you that must have a vested interest of some kind. Pet shops are dreadful places, all about selling the goods before they get too old. It is all about profit and caters for impulse buying which isn't a good thing when the products are live animals whose happiness and wellbeing depends on finding good owners.

I'm not with an animal rights group but I do work (voluntarily) in rescuing and rehoming dogs in need. All you actually need is some common sense with regards to working out what goes on in petshops and why they are bad. Just take many of the phone calls that I get from people who've kids have persuaded them to go and get that cute puppy without a thought for how their life will be affected next week, let alone the next 12 years.

Edited September 20, 2011 by dogmad

[Steve]

Lollipop, whoever told you that must have a vested interest of some kind. Pet shops are dreadful places, all about selling the goods before they get too old. It is all about profit and caters for impulse buying which isn't a good thing when the products are live animals whose happiness and wellbeing depends on finding good owners.

I'm not with an animal rights group but I do work (voluntarily) in rescuing and rehoming dogs in need. All you actually need is some common sense with regards to working out what goes on in petshops and why they are bad. Just take many of the phone calls that I get from people who've kids have persuaded them to go and get that cute puppy without a thought for how their life will be affected next week, let alone the next 12 years.

So why not advocate for more regulation and enforecment of pet shops ? Instead of saying they are dreadful places when the public and the government can clearly see that not all of them are and using an argument of where they get their dogs from? Why - because using that argument is easily discredited and it affects all breeders and if it ever does get you to your goal that is decades away. Why because while ever the ANKC allows their members to sell to pet shops and the stated position statement of the RSPCA Australia is not against pet shop live animal sales and there is no research or data to prove pet shop puppies are sicker or more likely to end up dumped and while ever Australia has federal trade laws to protect them it prevents us educating the public, breeders and the pet shops on the real why and the alternatives.

Regardless of how progressive and well run a pet store which sells live animals may be, an argument against purchasing pet store puppies is that prospective buyers cannot contact the breeder to be sure of the parent dog’s temperament and health in order to understand the potential problems or management issues.

It is very easy to purchase a pup from this source as an impulse and the store is often motivated to sell the pup above any consideration as to whether the dog and the buyer will suit each other.

It’s difficult to believe the pet shop assistant is as qualified to educate the buyer on the breed’s characteristics and offer support as well as a breeder who has devoted their lives to learning about and becoming expert in their hobby.

There is no safety net in place for the puppy buyer for advice or support or to take back the dog if things go wrong.

It is NOT in the best interests of the dog for breeders to place their pups in pet shops and who as a result choose not to be involved in or take responsibility for the dogs they breed past sending them off to market.

[Her Majesty Dogmad]

Steve - there is an anomaly in what you say, surely you can see that?

There are many reasons - some of which you yourself have espoused - as to why pet shops shouldn't sell live animals. Yes, I do want more regulation of petshops.

Now you are saying if they are regulated and breeders put their own dogs in there it will be OK?

No live animals being sold by 16 yr olds is the only way to go and I don't think you'll ever stop kids getting a Saturday job, they are also easily manipulated into talking ---- by their bosses - one recently told me that the puppies they sell are not from puppy farms, no they are from RSPCA approved breeders - there wasn't a purebred amongst them and the RSPCA don't approve back yard breeders so that they can sell in petshops.

The ideal would be for pet shops to advertise breeders and rescue dogs but NOT have any animals in there.

I'm not going to type line after line of text - I'm sure some of the general readers of this thread - not your breeder colleagues who you've obviously rallied to place post after post in each thread on a puppy farm topic - have stopped reading long ago because it is just tedious repetition.

You are all obnviously most concerned about your own selves - that is not the motivation of the people who want to see puppy farms shut down. It's all about cruelty to animals. I say again, dogs are companion animals, mass breeding facilities cannot provide them with a fulfilling life of being loved and cared for properly. It's not only puppy farms but some breeders, even registered (oh my God, strike me down) who don't always care for their animals properly and I suspect that's what would worry some in the breeding community, that they may be checked out and found to be wanting. I can give you some recent examples but you will just claim I'm telling "fibs". Breeders do get prosecuted for cruelty, they are not God, they have failings like other people - lack of funds for vet care, lack of time, lack of attachment and so on.

Edited September 20, 2011 by dogmad

[Steve]

Steve - there is an anomaly in what you say, surely you can see that?

There are many reasons - some of which you yourself have espoused - as to why pet shops shouldn't sell live animals. Yes, I do want more regulation of petshops.

Now you are saying if they are regulated and breeders put their own dogs in there it will be OK?

No live animals being sold by 16 yr olds is the only way to go and I don't think you'll ever stop kids getting a Saturday job, they are also easily manipulated into talking ---- by their bosses - one recently told me that the puppies they sell are not from puppy farms, no they are from RSPCA approved breeders - there wasn't a purebred amongst them and the RSPCA don't approve back yard breeders so that they can sell in petshops.

The ideal would be for pet shops to advertise breeders and rescue dogs but NOT have any animals in there.

I'm not going to type line after line of text - I'm sure some of the general readers of this thread - not your breeder colleagues who you've obviously rallied to place post after post in each thread on a puppy farm topic - have stopped reading long ago because it is just tedious repetition.

You are all obnviously most concerned about your own selves - that is not the motivation of the people who want to see puppy farms shut down. It's all about cruelty to animals. I say again, dogs are companion animals, mass breeding facilities cannot provide them with a fulfilling life of being loved and cared for properly. It's not only puppy farms but some breeders, even registered (oh my God, strike me down) who don't always care for their animals properly and I suspect that's what would worry some in the breeding community, that they may be checked out and found to be wanting. I can give you some recent examples but you will just claim I'm telling "fibs". Breeders do get prosecuted for cruelty, they are not God, they have failings like other people - lack of funds for vet care, lack of time, lack of attachment and so on.

Excuse me ? I didnt say if they are regulated and breeders put their own dogs in there that it is O.K. .It is never O.K. for breeders to sell puppies to pet shops .I agree the ideal way is for pet shops to advertise for breeders and reascue and not have live animals and its pretty easy to regualte the education level and age of a sales person who sells live animals.

You have no justification to accuse me of being most concerned about myself and its a typical response - the fact is everything I do and say is based on what I think is best for dogs - all dogs, dogs in general and you dont have to agree with what I think or say but you you are out of order when you accuse me of having that as a motivation.

Get it right I didnt accuse you of telling fibs I accused the Oscar's law and RSPCA Victoria's websites of telling fibs .

i accuse animal rights of taking cases and sensationalising them and making out there is an epidemic. Again I ask if people are treating animals cruelly isnt that enough?Why is there a need to beat it up. Breeders, registered breeders [ why do you think we started the MDBA] Rescue and owners can al be guilty of neglecting their dogs

Now just in case I over estimated you I will spell it out - I am [and the MDBA ]is against the sale of live animals in pet shops - it is against our codes of conduct and if any of our breeders did they would be gone. I would like to see live animals banned just as you would but when you bring in reasons for having them banned whichcan easily be disproved it prevents us being able to do anything which may actually have a chance of getting results.

Edited September 20, 2011 by Steve

[toy*dog]

Steve - there is an anomaly in what you say, surely you can see that?

You are all obnviously most concerned about your own selves - that is not the motivation of the people who want to see puppy farms shut down.

im a registered breeder and i have fostered dogs, i have rescued dogs from "breeders", i am an animal lover and i am against puppies being sold in petshops. it breaks my heart. there are alot on here like me too. you are wrong.

It's all about cruelty to animals. I say again, dogs are companion animals, mass breeding facilities cannot provide them with a fulfilling life of being loved and cared for properly.

and there's another aspect the hidden cruelty that i alert people to, what they don't mention because they don't know the breeding side of it all i suppose well i know that for a fact as i had to explain alot to the leader and she was very interested in what i had to say, is those pups often have hidden genetic problems as the parents are not health tested for that particular mix as they have several mixes of breed in them. pedigree dogs at least you can predict lots and have a better chance of obtaining a healthy puppy. as MDBA have written staff are often not qualified enough to address buyers concerns so those buyers are on their own and this leads into issues with dumpage etc etc. people (refuse to call them breeders becauae they are not!) who sell their pets to shops don't obviously care so churn out more and more. endless cycle. i think there is too much focus on the cruelty in farms when those same farms can say to govt and council as they do, the former mayor of one council i spoke to told me what these farmers actually tell govt and councillors! we do look after our animals, we feed them we water them, we exercise them so there is NO PROBLEM. anyway, i got chucked out for my comments on pedigree dogs when i wasn't really speaking about pedigree dogs! i was speaking about the breeding side in general to get people to think outside the box and to counteract what the farmers are actually saying to the people who make the laws. then i had one person come on just to wind me up and say i am cruel to expect my dogs to breed and what right do i have to breed dogs. and i thought right oh, if animal rights people think that all breeding is cruel then where do they expect to get their dogs when the shelters dry up because breeding will be banned? doesn't make sense. perhaps that person was from PETA i have no idea but it was scary and a really out there opinion. but i did wonder from then on, how many others think the same thing.

It's not only puppy farms but some breeders, even registered (oh my God, strike me down) who don't always care for their animals properly and I suspect that's what would worry some in the breeding community, that they may be checked out and found to be wanting. I can give you some recent examples but you will just claim I'm telling "fibs". Breeders do get prosecuted for cruelty, they are not God, they have failings like other people - lack of funds for vet care, lack of time, lack of attachment and so on.

i dont think anyone is disputing that fact. steve has stated she has come up against some registered breeders who have failed the grade and i have too and there are unscrupulous breeders amongst our midst. but its a difficult issue in how to eliminate these people out of the picture, dogsvictoria asked that same question and then there was a whole session on what is a puppy farmer and how do we go about gathering evidence that they are in the wrong. these people are giving us all a bad name. there were some on prisoners for profit website who said that DOGSNSW should be ashamed of themselves for taking the money when they knew these people were exporting and breeding alot of litters. perhaps they haven't got to that stage like dogsvic of actually asking the members why so many litters and what for. not that that's going to deter these people really i think to myself.

Edited September 21, 2011 by toy*dog

[Steve]

Steve - there is an anomaly in what you say, surely you can see that?

You are all obnviously most concerned about your own selves - that is not the motivation of the people who want to see puppy farms shut down.

im a registered breeder and i have fostered dogs, i have rescued dogs from "breeders", i am an animal lover and i am against puppies being sold in petshops. it breaks my heart. there are alot on here like me too. you are wrong.

It's all about cruelty to animals. I say again, dogs are companion animals, mass breeding facilities cannot provide them with a fulfilling life of being loved and cared for properly.

and there's another aspect the hidden cruelty that i alert people to, what they don't mention because they don't know the breeding side of it all i suppose well i know that for a fact as i had to explain alot to the leader and she was very interested in what i had to say, is those pups often have hidden genetic problems as the parents are not health tested for that particular mix as they have several mixes of breed in them. pedigree dogs at least you can predict lots and have a better chance of obtaining a healthy puppy. as MDBA have written staff are often not qualified enough to address buyers concerns so those buyers are on their own and this leads into issues with dumpage etc etc. people (refuse to call them breeders becauae they are not!) who sell their pets to shops don't obviously care so churn out more and more. endless cycle. i think there is too much focus on the cruelty in farms when those same farms can say to govt and council as they do, the former mayor of one council i spoke to told me what these farmers actually tell govt and councillors! we do look after our animals, we feed them we water them, we exercise them so there is NO PROBLEM. anyway, i got chucked out for my comments on pedigree dogs when i wasn't really speaking about pedigree dogs! i was speaking about the breeding side in general to get people to think outside the box and to counteract what the farmers are actually saying to the people who make the laws. then i had one person come on just to wind me up and say i am cruel to expect my dogs to breed and what right do i have to breed dogs. and i thought right oh, if animal rights people think that all breeding is cruel then where do they expect to get their dogs when the shelters dry up because breeding will be banned? doesn't make sense. perhaps that person was from PETA i have no idea but it was scary and a really out there opinion. but i did wonder from then on, how many others think the same thing.

It's not only puppy farms but some breeders, even registered (oh my God, strike me down) who don't always care for their animals properly and I suspect that's what would worry some in the breeding community, that they may be checked out and found to be wanting. I can give you some recent examples but you will just claim I'm telling "fibs". Breeders do get prosecuted for cruelty, they are not God, they have failings like other people - lack of funds for vet care, lack of time, lack of attachment and so on.

i dont think anyone is disputing that fact. steve has stated she has come up against some registered breeders who have failed the grade and i have too and there are unscrupulous breeders amongst our midst. but its a difficult issue in how to eliminate these people out of the picture, dogsvictoria asked that same question and then there was a whole session on what is a puppy farmer and how do we go about gathering evidence that they are in the wrong. these people are giving us all a bad name. there were some on prisoners for profit website who said that DOGSNSW should be ashamed of themselves for taking the money when they knew these people were exporting and breeding alot of litters. perhaps they haven't got to that stage like dogsvic of actually asking the members why so many litters and what for. not that that's going to deter these people really i think to myself.

Its a difficult issue to remove these kind of people from any group.

The people not just breeders, but also rescue and owners who I have seen who have not made the grade are people who keep their animals in true suffering. Suffering where they are being saturated from head to foot by the dog in the crate above them weeing on them for weeks at a time where they stand and sit and sleep in 6 inches of their own shit where the crate is never cleaned and they never ever get out .Where a bedroom door is shut to keep the stench contained in case any one comes. Where dogs are able to die in this filth and their bodies are left to rot with the rest walking all over them until they eventually die too.

Ive seen rescue who would leave most puppy farmers for dead - who pride themselves on no kill and keep dogs for years locked in pens, who have them living in filth and suffering. Ive seen smaller rescues who "rescue puppy farm dogs" only to use them themselves for breeding and continue to breed every cycle and sell the puppies as rescue dogs with dogs living in crap and costs cut .

Ive seen owners who are clearly mentally ill and hoard not just animals but anything including shit and filth. We have been in houses where we have had to put on masks and overalls and pay heaps of money to people to get the crap out so we can help the dogs and sometimes they are registered breeders.

How many they own , how many they breed, where they live or why they do what they do is no indicator of someone who keeps dogs in misery and Im talking real misery - not the emotional crap thats used all over the place to tell people what a puppy farmer is.

[juice]

Stikes me someone is more concerned about their own back.

If it makes breeders tow the line more, so be it, i have seen far more bad breeders with too many dogs, than good ones. I

f you do the right thing you have nothing to fear.

Keeping vast numbers of dogs , hiding behind ,"bettering the breed", when really its breeding for whats winning.

Not everyone in rescue is a crazy dog person who wants to save anything with a pulse, but we are realistic. :D

[BJean]

Stikes me someone is more concerned about their own back.

If it makes breeders tow the line more, so be it, i have seen far more bad breeders with too many dogs, than good ones. If you do the right thing you have nothing to fear.

Keeping vast numbers of dogs , hiding behind ,"bettering the breed", when really its breeding for whats winning.

Not everyone in rescue is a crazy dog person who wants to save anything with a pulse, but we are realistic. :D

This is my favourite line.

[Wookie]

Dogmad, absolutely agree with everything you've said.

'Empty vessels make the most noise'!

Some of these so called 'breeders' have plenty of opinions, but don't seem to have either substance or idea's to back them up.

[Crisovar]

Stikes me someone is more concerned about their own back.

If it makes breeders tow the line more, so be it, i have seen far more bad breeders with too many dogs, than good ones. I

f you do the right thing you have nothing to fear.

Keeping vast numbers of dogs , hiding behind ,"bettering the breed", when really its breeding for whats winning.

Not everyone in rescue is a crazy dog person who wants to save anything with a pulse, but we are realistic. :D

It is all relative to your experiences I guess. I know far more excellent Breeders than bad. But on Rescue front well the majority just make me shudder.

As for having nothing to fear, witch hunts, vendettas and plain ignorance do damage and drive away people who should be encouraged and supported. What is the right thing, no one can even agree on that.

Too much hysterical emotive bullshit splash it all over the press and tar all breeders with the same brush seems to be the common approach.

We have laws and regulations being made by people who have not a clue how healthy happy pups should be raised and we are intent on making it harder for those that do it well.

Talk to 6 different people about puppy farms and they will all have a different definition. Breeders who don't show,breeders who breed to show,breeders who feed out of stainless steel dishes, don't have dogs sleeping on their beds, Breeders with kennels, breeders who don't have kennels.

The more laws and regulations you push for the more the whole breeding game is going to become commercial and impersonal. Small Breeders with a few dogs in their home will be a thing of the past, because their homes will not meet the standard required. No more pups underfoot in the house watching telly with the kids, they will all be housed in their sterile purpose built facility way down the back. Way to go!

[WreckitWhippet]

Stikes me someone is more concerned about their own back.

If it makes breeders tow the line more, so be it, i have seen far more bad breeders with too many dogs, than good ones. If you do the right thing you have nothing to fear.

Keeping vast numbers of dogs , hiding behind ,"bettering the breed", when really its breeding for whats winning.

Not everyone in rescue is a crazy dog person who wants to save anything with a pulse, but we are realistic. :D

This is my favourite line.

I've been getting that a lot lately, but there's just no getting through that many of the so called " ethical " breeders, the one's you's want to buy a well raised pup from, aren't or can't abide by the current legisaltion.

The simplist of things like raising pups in your loungeroom is enough to see you not abiding by NSW legislation.

[BJean]

Stikes me someone is more concerned about their own back.

If it makes breeders tow the line more, so be it, i have seen far more bad breeders with too many dogs, than good ones. If you do the right thing you have nothing to fear.

Keeping vast numbers of dogs , hiding behind ,"bettering the breed", when really its breeding for whats winning.

Not everyone in rescue is a crazy dog person who wants to save anything with a pulse, but we are realistic. :D

This is my favourite line.

I've been getting that a lot lately, but there's just no getting through that many of the so called " ethical " breeders, the one's you's want to buy a well raised pup from, aren't or can't abide by the current legisaltion.

The simplist of things like raising pups in your loungeroom is enough to see you not abiding by NSW legislation.

As with all succulent bs, it is not enough for the espouser to believe it, they want you to eat it too.

I also lurve how they believe that they are somebody to tell me what I should and should not fear.

As if my dogs and I should bear the burden of their anti-liberty control freak agenda.

Edited September 21, 2011 by lilli

[Steve]

Yep you just wait for it to be thrown around and used to shut us up when they dont agree with something we say.

In the main it works too where people are too frightened to tell the truth and stand up for what is right and dare to say what they think is wrong .

Perhaps - especially in Victoria where laws abound for defining shelters which need domestic animal licences and have to operate under mandatory codes are now there for rescue

its time we started dob in a rescue and snuck around in the night with cameras. After all what have they got to hide if they do the right thing they have nothing to fear.

We knocked a rescue member back a couple of months ago and refused membership for them because they could have 2 dogs on their property and they had 25 - nothing to fear if they do it right though.

[Steve]

Dogmad, absolutely agree with everything you've said.

'Empty vessels make the most noise'!

Some of these so called 'breeders' have plenty of opinions, but don't seem to have either substance or idea's to back them up.

Define substance and ideas ? So called breeders? Im a breeder alright - What does so called mean? Do you doubt that I breed dogs?

But you're dead right about empty vessels making the most noise and its animal rights loons who are way ahead in that department - blind freddy can see that

[Chris the Rebel Wolf]

The government really needs to take more responsibility, letting that farm have 50 dogs legally is a prime example! Simple, make it so puppy farms are against the law, they will be closed down, that's all it would take. No dog deserves to live a loveless life, sitting around in a cage being bred like machines

I can't understand why if you have to have a pet shop with a puppy in it, why not get a partnership through the RSPCA and local councils - do adoptions in store? That would be far better than having puppy farmed puppies.

In the end it all comes down to education as well. I still have people on a daily basis coming into the pet shop where I work and ask for puppies. (We do not sell them). Unfortunately with some of the shops out there, they will continue to stock puppy farm and other irresponsible backyard breeders until the public demands otherwise. The public at large needs to know the truth about puppy farms!

[Lollipup]

Lollipop, whoever told you that must have a vested interest of some kind. Pet shops are dreadful places, all about selling the goods before they get too old. It is all about profit and caters for impulse buying which isn't a good thing when the products are live animals whose happiness and wellbeing depends on finding good owners.

I'm not with an animal rights group but I do work (voluntarily) in rescuing and rehoming dogs in need. All you actually need is some common sense with regards to working out what goes on in petshops and why they are bad. Just take many of the phone calls that I get from people who've kids have persuaded them to go and get that cute puppy without a thought for how their life will be affected next week, let alone the next 12 years.

Sorry, I have been away from the thread and haven't read it all but wanted to reply to you. Yes, she works for someone who owns a couple of pet shops and her job is to source puppies. She also teaches the cert IV in companion animal services at TAFE. And she breeds dogs and sells them through the pet shops also. She said the key is education. But apparently I'm the type who needs it.

Even with the pet stores that have the best intentions though, my concern is that the puppies are there through their critical period of development and can miss a lot of important interaction. Also the issue of health testing and knowing the temperament of the parents. And if the pet shops are sourcing from bybs, then its just keeping them going. I think the choices of ethical registered breeder or adopt from shelter provide plenty of dogs available without the need for petshops, puppy farms and BYBs.