Sunrise

[Katie P]

[Tempus Fugit]

Anyone else watching?

"Pittys should be destroyed", "pits are as dangerous as a lion", "get rid of them all"

"Ban them, they are awful things"

Here we go again

I know what happened to that little girl was a shocking horrible thing (thats why i started a new thread) , but when are people going to start looking at the owners and not the breeds?

Unfortunately, it IS the breed. They have been bred to fight over many, many years. It is imprinted into their genetics in the same way Retrievers were bred to fetch their masters' ducks, etc when hunting. No one, and I don't care how much of an expert they claim to be, but no one can control these dogs and stop them from attacking when they want to.

Matthew B

So you think because a breed was bred for a specific purpose they can't make wonderful family pets, if that was the case I shouldn't have a Rottie as I don't have cattle or a cart. I don't have sheep so I shouldn't own a GSD,you see how stupid your comments are.

Selective breeding over a number of generations can alter character traits in any breed, eg the divergence between show line and working line GSDs.

The dog that killed the child was reportedly not a purebred but a cross breed of the type often used pig hunters etc. Such dogs at least need to have a desire to stand up to and defend themselves against, if not attack, an aggressive quarry. I daresay out of a litter of such dogs 3 or 4 might go to hunting homes while the cast offs end up in the general community. If hunting with dogs was banned then there would be no need for such dogs but I don't think a government would have the political will to stand up to the hunting lobby.

The owner of the dog has been branded as irresponsible for allowing his dog to escape, apparently for the first time. Well, the DOL Lost & Found forum is replete with cases of dogs that have escaped from their owners premises - yet these DOLers seem to get sympathy rather than condemnation. I heard the other day of a case where 4 sibes escaped from a backyard because a delivery man opened the gate. Was the sibe's owner irresponsible for not padlocking her gate? I have a 1.8 m back fence, yet I have had a cattle dog actually jump from the rear laneway into my yard (and get roughed up by my 2 gsds). Maybe I am irresponsible for not topping my fence with broken glass and razor wire to deter trespassers, like the railways do with their train yards.

In the case of the Melbourne attack, I think the police and coroner should be allowed to complete their investigations before kneejerk condemnations are made, including by politicians.

[tarope]

Anyone else watching?

"Pittys should be destroyed", "pits are as dangerous as a lion", "get rid of them all"

"Ban them, they are awful things"

Here we go again

I know what happened to that little girl was a shocking horrible thing (thats why i started a new thread) , but when are people going to start looking at the owners and not the breeds?

Unfortunately, it IS the breed. They have been bred to fight over many, many years. It is imprinted into their genetics in the same way Retrievers were bred to fetch their masters' ducks, etc when hunting. No one, and I don't care how much of an expert they claim to be, but no one can control these dogs and stop them from attacking when they want to.

Matthew B

So you think because a breed was bred for a specific purpose they can't make wonderful family pets, if that was the case I shouldn't have a Rottie as I don't have cattle or a cart. I don't have sheep so I shouldn't own a GSD,you see how stupid your comments are.

Selective breeding over a number of generations can alter character traits in any breed, eg the divergence between show line and working line GSDs.

The dog that killed the child was reportedly not a purebred but a cross breed of the type often used pig hunters etc. Such dogs at least need to have a desire to stand up to and defend themselves against, if not attack, an aggressive quarry. I daresay out of a litter of such dogs 3 or 4 might go to hunting homes while the cast offs end up in the general community. If hunting with dogs was banned then there would be no need for such dogs but I don't think a government would have the political will to stand up to the hunting lobby.

The owner of the dog has been branded as irresponsible for allowing his dog to escape, apparently for the first time. Well, the DOL Lost & Found forum is replete with cases of dogs that have escaped from their owners premises - yet these DOLers seem to get sympathy rather than condemnation. I heard the other day of a case where 4 sibes escaped from a backyard because a delivery man opened the gate. Was the sibe's owner irresponsible for not padlocking her gate? I have a 1.8 m back fence, yet I have had a cattle dog actually jump from the rear laneway into my yard (and get roughed up by my 2 gsds). Maybe I am irresponsible for not topping my fence with broken glass and razor wire to deter trespassers, like the railways do with their train yards.

In the case of the Melbourne attack, I think the police and coroner should be allowed to complete their investigations before kneejerk condemnations are made, including by politicians.

It never ceases to amaze me the Ignorance of some people here on DOL these days, are you related to Matthew B as you both have the same backwoods mentality.

So you think the dog was defending itself against a small defenseless child as you have stated above, are you kidding.

As for your comments about the DOL Lost and Found forum, how many of the dogs lost by Dolers have attacked and killed a small child or injured anyone for that matter there's a big difference only you can't see it.

[LizT]

Anyone else watching?

"Pittys should be destroyed", "pits are as dangerous as a lion", "get rid of them all"

"Ban them, they are awful things"

Here we go again

I know what happened to that little girl was a shocking horrible thing (thats why i started a new thread) , but when are people going to start looking at the owners and not the breeds?

Unfortunately, it IS the breed. They have been bred to fight over many, many years. It is imprinted into their genetics in the same way Retrievers were bred to fetch their masters' ducks, etc when hunting. No one, and I don't care how much of an expert they claim to be, but no one can control these dogs and stop them from attacking when they want to.

Matthew B

So you think because a breed was bred for a specific purpose they can't make wonderful family pets, if that was the case I shouldn't have a Rottie as I don't have cattle or a cart. I don't have sheep so I shouldn't own a GSD,you see how stupid your comments are.

Selective breeding over a number of generations can alter character traits in any breed, eg the divergence between show line and working line GSDs.

The dog that killed the child was reportedly not a purebred but a cross breed of the type often used pig hunters etc. Such dogs at least need to have a desire to stand up to and defend themselves against, if not attack, an aggressive quarry. I daresay out of a litter of such dogs 3 or 4 might go to hunting homes while the cast offs end up in the general community. If hunting with dogs was banned then there would be no need for such dogs but I don't think a government would have the political will to stand up to the hunting lobby.

The owner of the dog has been branded as irresponsible for allowing his dog to escape, apparently for the first time. Well, the DOL Lost & Found forum is replete with cases of dogs that have escaped from their owners premises - yet these DOLers seem to get sympathy rather than condemnation. I heard the other day of a case where 4 sibes escaped from a backyard because a delivery man opened the gate. Was the sibe's owner irresponsible for not padlocking her gate? I have a 1.8 m back fence, yet I have had a cattle dog actually jump from the rear laneway into my yard (and get roughed up by my 2 gsds). Maybe I am irresponsible for not topping my fence with broken glass and razor wire to deter trespassers, like the railways do with their train yards.

In the case of the Melbourne attack, I think the police and coroner should be allowed to complete their investigations before kneejerk condemnations are made, including by politicians.

It never ceases to amaze me the Ignorance of some people here on DOL these days, are you related to Matthew B as you both have the same backwoods mentality.

So you think the dog was defending itself against a small defenseless child as you have stated above, are you kidding.

As for your comments about the DOL Lost and Found forum, how many of the dogs lost by Dolers have attacked and killed a small child or injured anyone for that matter there's a big difference only you can't see it.

Indeed. The dog went into a house and attacked a 4 year old child that had been watching television, and then proceeded to kill the child while she klung to her mother.

What you are seeing is a "reaction" not a "Knee jerk reaction'.

[sandgrubber]

"The dog that killed the child was reportedly not a purebred but a cross breed of the type often used pig hunters etc. Such dogs at least need to have a desire to stand up to and defend themselves against, if not attack, an aggressive quarry. I daresay out of a litter of such dogs 3 or 4 might go to hunting homes while the cast offs end up in the general community. If hunting with dogs was banned then there would be no need for such dogs but I don't think a government would have the political will to stand up to the hunting lobby."

I think this is the crux of the problem. Question: What should happen to the cast offs? Is there a way to prevent them from going to owners who won't provide adequate restraint 365 days of every year, and training?

[mr.mister]

Does anybody know of a specific MP or similar that we can contact about this? Would we contact the member in our area or someone in Melbourne?

[Andisa]

"The dog that killed the child was reportedly not a purebred but a cross breed of the type often used pig hunters etc. Such dogs at least need to have a desire to stand up to and defend themselves against, if not attack, an aggressive quarry. I daresay out of a litter of such dogs 3 or 4 might go to hunting homes while the cast offs end up in the general community. If hunting with dogs was banned then there would be no need for such dogs but I don't think a government would have the political will to stand up to the hunting lobby."

I think this is the crux of the problem. Question: What should happen to the cast offs? Is there a way to prevent them from going to owners who won't provide adequate restraint 365 days of every year, and training?

Once upon a time breeders used to cull and for what ever reason they stopped and the pups were placed in pet homes.

The question would be WHY? -

One of my old breeding books has a line in it that still makes my skin crawl but very true to the time it was written. It was similar to *if a breeder can't bucket a puppy at birth then perhaps they shouldn't be breeding*.

Breeders used to cull to control numbers and cull any who didn't fit the purpose, I don't know at what age but many used to keep tight control on quality. Imagine the out cry from the public if that was still happening. So who is really to blame when so many dogs are placed in pet homes? Back then it was not for the money as they were still cheap or free to good homes so would it have been from public pressure and then opportunists who saw the opening for big $$$$.

Both of my grand parents used to be breeders, my mothers father used to show and breed a few different breeds while my fathers mother used to have Corgis, I only remember her having a few litters but don't remember if she had a prefix - maybe the old girl with the highest morels known to man kind was a BYB .

ed: sp?

Edited August 23, 2011 by Andisa

[sumosmum]

Does anybody know of a specific MP or similar that we can contact about this? Would we contact the member in our area or someone in Melbourne?

Bill Sykes from the Nationals (I think), he was very anti BSL in his speech opposing it in the last lot of dog laws that came into effect last year. However, he spoke well against BSL, but would not oppose the Bill which was pro BSL. Being that the Minister is a member of the same party, I don't know if he would speak up this time.

Sue Pennicuik from the Greens was the most outspoken, but nobody wanted to listen to her.

I think a lot of MPs know that BSL is wrong and doesn't work, but they won't speak up against it. It is all about votes really.

I would write to your local MPs and maybe the Minister himself. Apart from that, I can't think of anything else. BSL isn't working. We have had it for years now, and things seem to be just as bad, or worse. Why can't they see this isn't working?