Child Killed By Dog

[poodlefan]

The owner will no doubt be charged, but will he do time?

I can live with 3 to 5 for him. The fact that the dog was unregistered really peeves me off - it screams irresponsible.

An unregistered crossbred. Shall we go for undesexed as well?

There's two breaches of existing council by-laws. Why in hell do we need more legislation when there aren't sufficient resources to enforce what exists now.

Of course blaming the breed deflects that question and others very neatly.

[bulldogz4eva]

The thing that gets me is that a dog like a Golden Retriever is far more common in the average household than the pitbull, yet we see far more attacks and deaths from pitbulls than Golden Retrievers. I wonder why??? Could it be because it IS in fact a dangerous breed? I think so!

Where are the fatalities in Australia genius?There arent any.

[aussielover]

The thing that gets me is that a dog like a Golden Retriever is far more common in the average household than the pitbull, yet we see far more attacks and deaths from pitbulls than Golden Retrievers. I wonder why??? Could it be because it IS in fact a dangerous breed? I think so!

Dangerous "breed" of owner imo

[bulldogz4eva]

For the record, I don't agree with banning a breed either as the dickhead owners (who are the fault) will just move onto another breed. However, if the responsible owners here are to save their breed, they need to recognise there is a problem with ownership, get better spokespeople in the media and work with authorities to find a solution, not get on the defensive every time there is an attack.

The moment the public and the systems you voted in

'banned' the Pit Bull as part of BSL

that same action also removed any possibility of an organised effort to breed 'good PB' (and as a consequence, good PB mixes.)

Banning the breed resulted in the banning of good breeders, who otherwise could have set standards in place.

In many ways, this is what you get when you have no professional breeders nurturing a breed and leading the way for new breeders to follow.

No professional breeders to be very picky about where their puppies go and to whom

no professional breeders to defend their breed and bring in new lineage when needed.

(Yes there'd be a handful of professional PB breeders, rightly ducking and keeping

beneath the radar, but these smart folk aren't going to put their heads up now, they're keeping their good dogs and good lineage underground where they're safe.)

Back above ground:

Australia created this sealed cesspool of poorly bred pitbull genes + other breeds bred in add-hoc to fill in the void

And now Australia reals in horror when all these mixed goodness-knows-what-combinations go running around biting people.

Well really, what did you think would happen, when you ban organised registration systems and breeding standards that only professional breeders can put in place and uphold?

Yes the naive and daft still continue to believe in breed bans and that you can sweep up genetic footprints with the assistance of your local ranger ...

but really.

You wanted a breed banned, well applaud BSL.

The registered breeders and the breed are gone.

But the dogs and their progeny, their mixed progeny, their owners,and their owners who will breed, they still exist.

When you brought in BSL you kicked the PB custodians out, so now all you're left with is the nuff nuffs with no knowledge; and their bad dogs and bad dog mixes that noone can tell apart from the good dog mixes.

Every dependable breed of dog in Australia that is held in high regard,

is this way because of the organised breed club and professional breeders nurturing the breed.

Well said Lilli I couldnt agree more but the government that introduced it will never acknowledge that fact but they have created the breeding underground for those after fast cash and everyone gets lumped into the same category.They thought they would breed them out of existence and they were wrong.Now that it hasnt worked what are they going to do?

[RottnBullies]

Ok, so the dog is not a pitbull.

Where does that leave us?

It leaves us in the same place we have always been.The politicians and the media wont let that get in the way.The monster must be burned at the stake becuase it makes great sensationalistic tv and vote grabbing for pollies all the while doing nothing but taking the heat off of other issues.The pitbull takes the blame again and thats all the headlines will say PITBULL PITBULL PITBULL.See if you say it enough times you will believe it too.

How many of those damaging headlines are going to be retracted?? None that's the sad part as the damage Is done irrespective of what breed It was, It Is only one that Is going to be hung and sacrificed once again not to mention any look a likes that fall In their paths

[cathya]

Rep, I will lay you odds this dog was young, male, intact, poorly trained, not well socialised, possibly aquired for status or 'protection' purposes and with a history of aggression. If you told me it was kept chained I'd be unsurprised.

But "pitbull" is a lot more attractive to journo's. It's the "great white shark" factor of the name that will be guaranteed to set pulses racing and sell advertising on TV and in newspapers. Hysteria makes ratings and sells column inches folks. Your average journo has a vested interest in fanning the flames.

Lets hear about the OWNER of the dog shall we? Lets hear how it was acquired raised and cared for. And let's wait for the owner to lie his or her arse off to protect themselves. I can hear it now "he'd never done anything like this before".

The dog was probably the terror of the street.

Well said Poodlefan, I would just bet that the owner is devastated as they say. Of course they are, they are now possibly (and hopefully) going to held accountable for being irresponsible. My prayers are with this family, the little girl and her dear mum who apparently fought so hard to protect her child. As a mum, I can only imagine the sheer terror of seeing this happen to your baby. I have certainly shed a tear for the child's loss and for her mum.

[cathya]

This breed of dogs (pitbull) needs to be banned, period. They have been bred over many, many years to be fighting dogs. That is their pedigree, it is what they were bred to do. They weren't bred to be cuddly playthings for the kids to poke and prod. They fight, maim and kill and once they have experienced the taste of human blood they will more often than not be involved in repeat attacks. It is as simple as that and arguing otherwise is just plain stupid and irresponsible. There is no need for these kinds of vicious dogs to be kept as pets by anyone. I don't care how much of an expert on this breed someone claims to be, you cannot make this breed of dogs a safe breed. It is imprinted into their brains to fight and takes just one moment, one thing for them to be set off and then there's virtually no stopping them except a Police Officer and his gun. Jailing or fining owners is not the answer, as it will not save victims of these aggressive, powerfully built dogs. We need to be more proactive, rather than reacting only after someone has been maimed or killed. The only responsible course of action is for the breed to be banned and for breeding these dogs to also be banned until they cease to exist.

Sorry buddy but I think you watch a little bit too much tv and whats with the taste human blood thing.They are dogs not vampires.Thats like saying every dog that hunts pigs is unsafe and that would be wrong too.Any dog that tastes human blood and not in the context of protecting owner or property or owned by the services should take a dirtnap.

What kind of vicious dogs being owned as pets are we talking about?You cant make this breed a safe breed?Dude you dont know what you are talking about.I have owned them for a long long time I also have small children.Rule number one always surpervise them.Know your own dogs and un derstand animal behaviour and recognise signs.Dont own unstable dogs nor make excuses for them.It does not take just one thing to set them off at all.You make them sound like they are a crazed killing machine and if they were as you described no one would be able to own one as they would be uncontrollable and that just is not the case I am sorry to inform you.You have been blinded by the media sensationalism as have many.The real American Pitbull Terrier is not a child killer.

EXACTLY Bulldogsforever, how many of these stats about dog attacks include a temp assessment on the owner - not many I would think! Anyone that generalises about a dog breed (or anything else for that matter) is simply revealing their ignorance

.

[rep628]

The 7 PM Project just had a decent spiel in regards to the attack. It was not their first headline (Melbourne shooting with 2 deaths was). Had the CEO from Lort Smith on who denounced BSL - it's the owners, was for tougher penalties for the irresponsible owner . David Hughes and Charlie Pickering were practically male versions of PoodleFan My only beef was their little map of Pit Bull type attacks in the last decade could have been left on the cutting room floor.

Their article online seems tactful as well.. even if the title isn't the best- http://7pmproject.com.au/fatal-attack-renews-dog-ban-calls.htm

They'll be getting a letter of thanks, in particular David and Charlie.

[Zug Zug]

If that was one of my dogs it would be dead. No way in hell would I get it assessed - it would be getting the needle.

I have to say I also find this perplexing. After a fatal attack and also a serious attack of several other people. I would have though euthanasing the dog would be automatic.

[krustie22]

If that was one of my dogs it would be dead. No way in hell would I get it assessed - it would be getting the needle.

I have to say I also find this perplexing. After a fatal attack and also a serious attack of several other people. I would have though euthanasing the dog would be automatic.

i dont think it is being assessed as to whether it will avoid being PTS or not...it will be, they have stated this, but i would imagine it is being assessed to see what triggered/caused the attack, THEN it will be PTS.

[The Spotted Devil]

If that was one of my dogs it would be dead. No way in hell would I get it assessed - it would be getting the needle.

I have to say I also find this perplexing. After a fatal attack and also a serious attack of several other people. I would have though euthanasing the dog would be automatic.

i dont think it is being assessed as to whether it will avoid being PTS or not...it will be, they have stated this, but i would imagine it is being assessed to see what triggered/caused the attack, THEN it will be PTS.

The police stated that forensic evidence would be collected before the dog was PTS.

[wolfgirl]

According to Channel 10 news at 5pm the dog has already been PTS????

[Bindo]

Does anyone know if there is an increase in the numbers of humans killed or seriously injured by dogs?

My perception is that the issue is ocurring with more frequency, but this may not be the reality.

I can tell you for a fact that it pales into insignificance compared with deaths and injuries caused by bicycles.

Lets ban those too shall we? ;)

Gee, great analogy! Difference is, most bicycles kill their owners (ie the rider), not other people.

For the record, I don't agree with banning a breed either as the dickhead owners (who are the fault) will just move onto another breed. However, if the responsible owners here are to save their breed, they need to recognise there is a problem with ownership, get better spokespeople in the media and work with authorities to find a solution, not get on the defensive every time there is an attack.

Hi Bindo

I have a female bully breed who outgoing & safe, obedient, is a puppy preschool tutor/regulator, an AVA Pet Pep dog, a Certified Therapy dog in hospitals and nursing homes who now has been greenlighted to be assessed as a Children's Reading Program Dog. How do you propose I become a spokesperson?

Because here's my problem, the moment I step up and broadcast what she (possibly**) is as a breed of dog, in some states she will be outright stripped from me and killed; others, muzzled in public. Now can you really imagine a Certified Therapy Dog laying next to a child at the childrens hospital in a muzzle?

No, so I quietly plod through my little circle of nursing homes, hospitals and primary school halls.

I am a responsible owner, and every day my dogs change minds. Be it the old school Lab breeder at one of the nursing homes I visit who now thinks the world of females and fully admits that those "staffy types can actually be alright", or the rather bogany tradie who walks up with admiration in his eyes to my Big Daddy Version of an Amstaff (cropped ears and all) - totally in love with his look (hey, do you breed your dog?) and super impressed with his loose lead walking & obedience skills. As a vet nurse and dog trainer, I can then quietly stress that my male's desexed and the importance of training & socialization - with the added note that if they don't do either of those things, they're a disservice to humanity and their dogs. For some reason, coming from a 51kg chick with a good looking dog makes them "get it". That's the thing, they often listen to me, I come at them as one of them, not an lab/poodle/whatever breeder who is marginalizing them.

Anti-BSL people have spokespeople; the AVA (& other int'l bodies), the RSPCA(ditto), and every major kennel club in the world - with the exception of ANKC (but I'm not pointing the finger at any individual member of course) have all made outright statements as to BSL not being a viable solution. But again, why should politicians listen to science and the experts, it's all about media spin.

I'm legitamitely asking you Bindo - without defense, without sarcasm. If you were in my position, what would you do?

**My female dog is a rescue, so we don't really know exactly what she is. I know her mother, and the kennel she came from, but we don't know sire.. and what good is that supposed to do you in this country?

Hi Rep,

You sound like the ideal owner (for any dog) and exactly the type of person who should be in the media, getting the message across. The 'sound bite' that was repeated today from a breed representative ( I didn't catch his name) was something along the lines of 'children should never be left unsupervised around dogs' or something similar. In these circumstances, those words should never had been said.

Most people on here seem to agree that the problem is at the other end of the leash - well then that's what should be targetted. Perhaps active and visible lobbying by owners/associations whose dogs are in the firing line, for increased penalties and jail terms for people whose dogs (of any size and description) inflict grevious bodily harm on others. Then it becomes an owner's issue rather than a breed issue. Perhaps breed reps were saying this today, but I didn't hear it.

[poodlefan]

Most people on here seem to agree that the problem is at the other end of the leash - well then that's what should be targetted. Perhaps active and visible lobbying by owners/associations whose dogs are in the firing line, for increased penalties and jail terms for people whose dogs (of any size and description) inflict grevious bodily harm on others. Then it becomes an owner's issue rather than a breed issue. Perhaps breed reps were saying this today, but I didn't hear it.

Frankly I think all dog owners (not just owners of breeds at risk) have a vested interest in ensuring that irresponsible dog owners are penalised for their failure to socialise, train and contain their dogs. Its their actions that see ALL of us subject to increasing restrictions and dislike.

[Angelina]

I am going to put my head on the chopping block

but I don't think, the blatant, defense of pitbulls, helps at all... or saying, all dogs can bite, etc, etc. why don't they put a fluffy dog up, blah, blah, blah... because even if a crazy maltese terrier got loose, and ran into my house, it is not going to kill me, or sever an arm... how do you counter these... I am just trying to play devils advocate.

A lot have discounted statistics, but clearly, there is something in those ... even even if they are only half true.

just seems people here, jump automatically to the dogs and the breeds defense, without acknowledging, their may be a problem

I don't think that helps

you shout down people who put statistics up, but then pull out the statistics that support your claim

I don't know what the answer, but sheer bloody mindness on either side of the argment is going to help

[Brennan's Mum]

I am going to put my head on the chopping block

but I don't think, the blatant, defense of pitbulls, helps at all... or saying, all dogs can bite, etc, etc. why don't they put a fluffy dog up, blah, blah, blah... because even if a crazy maltese terrier got loose, and ran into my house, it is not going to kill me, or sever an arm... how do you counter these... I am just trying to play devils advocate.

A lot have discounted statistics, but clearly, there is something in those ... even even if they are only half true.

just seems people here, jump automatically to the dogs and the breeds defense, without acknowledging, their may be a problem

I don't think that helps

you shout down people who put statistics up, but then pull out the statistics that support your claim

I don't know what the answer, but sheer bloody mindness on either side of the argment is going to help

With all due respect, whilst the injury risk can be greater with a bigger dog, the little Maltese dogs or 'SWF' are still capable of causing injury. What happens if a 'small breed' bites an elderly person with fragile skin? or rushes at an elderly person causing them to trip? a friends grandmother ended up in hospital from a fall caused by a neighbours loose Maltese...the dog took this lady by surprise and she lost her footing.

[bulldogz4eva]

I am going to put my head on the chopping block

but I don't think, the blatant, defense of pitbulls, helps at all... or saying, all dogs can bite, etc, etc. why don't they put a fluffy dog up, blah, blah, blah... because even if a crazy maltese terrier got loose, and ran into my house, it is not going to kill me, or sever an arm... how do you counter these... I am just trying to play devils advocate.

A lot have discounted statistics, but clearly, there is something in those ... even even if they are only half true.

just seems people here, jump automatically to the dogs and the breeds defense, without acknowledging, their may be a problem

I don't think that helps

you shout down people who put statistics up, but then pull out the statistics that support your claim

I don't know what the answer, but sheer bloody mindness on either side of the argment is going to help

I can understand what you are saying but for just a moment look at the other side iof the coin.

It doesnt matter what kind of dog it was to the poor woman that has lost her beloved child and will now never feel the joy of so many wonderful things in her childs life and will more than likely suffer PTSD becuase of the circumstances.As an owner it matters to me because it was not a purebred American pitbull Terrier as has been found out time and time again when it has been reported in the media.I just watched channel nine news whom I spoke to earlier in the day and discussed this.They new it wasnt a purbred American Pitbull Terrier but still they reported it as such.Do you think that is fair?

I am not a blind breed supporter nor do I think every pitbull is a fluffly cuddly toy but I have enough experience to know media beat up when I see it.

When you mention statistics.Why dont Ihave the right to refute them when they are statistics from another country.What do stats from the US have to do with Australia?When people have to garner stats from overseas on dog fatalaties becuase they cant find any here what does that say to you?Like I haqve said a million times before no purebred American Pitbull Terrier has been responsible for a fatality in this country in the 30 years they have been here.I amke no apologies for that becuase it is a fact that matters.

What happens in the US and what passes for a "pitbull" has no bearing here.If my comments sound defensive its because I have more experience with the dogs than anyone here and I know the difference between a well socilaised well bred well adjusted American Pitbull Terrier.

[Shazzapug]

It was Poodlefan that posted the link to the US stats here........just saying

Edited August 18, 2011 by Shazzapug

[Angelina]

I do see the other side of the coin and thank you Bulldogforeva for your response, because it was balanced ...

and I realise that stats in the US, don't equate to here

but the news was showing terrible attacks from Australia in the last couple of years, and they are hard to defend.

I don't really know much about pit bulls, as in, not having come in contact with a lot, all I really know them is from Dog Whisperer, and I love them

I also do not want to see entire breed of any dogs banned, but I am just saying, people can't just discount the statistics...

anyhow, I don't know the answer, I guess it all comes to education, and strong ownership ... but I don't see that happening for a long time

[gsdog2]

With all due respect, whilst the injury risk can be greater with a bigger dog, the little Maltese dogs or 'SWF' are still capable of causing injury. What happens if a 'small breed' bites an elderly person with fragile skin? or rushes at an elderly person causing them to trip? a friends grandmother ended up in hospital from a fall caused by a neighbours loose Maltese...the dog took this lady by surprise and she lost her footing.

I'm sorry I don't see how you can make this comparison

I agree that small breeds will also bite and because of size the media disregard this. But an elderley lady losing her footing has nothing to do with a child being attacked by a dog