Kelly_Louise Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 Hi! I had an incident yesterday with an offlead dog (in an onleash only area at a public lake) - and would just like your opinion as to who you think is at fault. Not that it really matters, but to me it does. I was walking Sasha yesterday at the lake as usual, on lead of course, and minding our own business. There are a few people with small dogs that assume their dogs don't need to have any manners, and also assume that because they have small dogs, it exempts them from having to obey the rules (and I know this doesn't apply to all small dog owners - just some of the ones around my area unfortunately). Now, a couple of days before - I saw a lady I'd never seen walking her small dog (onlead). I like to be courteous to people and keep Sasha out of their space, so I always walk her on my left side, and always put myself between her and anyone else/other dogs. While walking past, her little dog was pulling and lungeing and she let the lead slack go so it was right in Sasha's face (and we had to stop walking otherwise I'd have trodden on it). It was a fairly civil meeting, a bit stiff though - so I moved further to the left and around the dog and kept walking. Last night, I saw them walking down the street towards the lake. The little dog had a lead on, but no one was holding it. They walked about 5m in front of us across our path and there was no issue. However, we then saw them at the lake. The lady called the little dog back when she saw us coming and the dog went partly back to her, then turned around and ran straight for us. After being attacked numerous times in our area by offlead dogs, obviously Sasha did not like this. The lady continued to call the dog but was kinda laughing and did not make a run to try and get control of her dog. The dog ran straight at Sasha (they all seem to go for her feet) and a fight broke out. Obviously, being bigger, Sasha had the upper hand - but there were no injuries to the dog (nothing obvious on the skin anyway). After the lady saw the dogs fighting, she then realised and came running for her dog. By this time, and being 6 months pregnant, I was struggling - the dog kept running at Sasha and kept coming back to her (even though it was quite scared and squealing), I lost my balance trying to get Sasha away and got knocked down, I then grabbed Sasha by the choker and gave an almighty tug away from the dog so the lady could get her dog. I was hurt in the process myself - but luckily I landed on my leg/hip/arm only and protected the baby. The lady did apologise, and when her daughter asked why - she told her because she had done the wrong thing letting the dog offlead in an onlead/public area. Of course, I think it's her fault as well - allowing her dog to come uncontrolled into our space (if the dog had been onlead there would have been no issue). However, I would just like opinions on whether other people think I (or Sasha) is partly to blame as well? I am quite protective of her, so would like an outsiders opinion. I have now been banned (by my husband) from walking my own dog - which is my favourite thing to do each day, and I'm really cut up about it. But Sasha is a strong dog and I can't control what other people do... so I totally understand from his point of view. Doesn't make it any easier to deal with though... it's our 'bonding' time and the most enjoyable part of my day So just wondering what you think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brennan's Mum Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 Sounds to me like the other lady was in the wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dju Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 A dog that was off leash in a public area rushed your dog and a fight broke out because of that, I don't really think there's any other possible way to interpret it other than it being the other person's fault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W Sibs Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 I hope you're ok!! Sucks that you can't walk your Sasha The lady's fault and she knows it!! Idiots like her is what giving small breed dogs owners bad name Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly_Louise Posted August 17, 2011 Author Share Posted August 17, 2011 (edited) Idiots like her is what giving small breed dogs owners bad name Unfortunately, it's people like her that give both small and large breed dog owners a bad name. Firstly because they believe because their dog is small that it's harmless and doesn't have to obey rules - and secondly, because if people see the dog fight , they automatically assume that it's the big dogs fault and makes me look bad. I'm glad to have received reassurance that the other person is at fault - I think that is the case as well, but I guess because Sasha is the bigger dog and has potential to do more damage to a small dog than the small dog can do to her sometimes I wonder if I'm wrong. I'm not saying Sasha is perfect, but if people keep their dogs under control we don't have any issue (and why I don't take her to offlead dog parks - because I can't rely on her recall nor have control if she takes issue with another dog). And thank you for taking the time to respond Edited August 17, 2011 by Kelly_Louise Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trinabean Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 A dog that was off leash in a public area rushed your dog and a fight broke out because of that, I don't really think there's any other possible way to interpret it other than it being the other person's fault. +1 Especially as it was an on-leash park and she wasn't holding onto her dog's leash! Glad you weren't seriously hurt. I'm sad for you that you can't walk your own dog now because of this irresponsible woman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Fox Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 Not your fault KL. And even if Sasha had injured the small dog it would still not have been your fault. Where are peoples brains sometimes? It really makes me wonder.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly_Louise Posted August 17, 2011 Author Share Posted August 17, 2011 +1 Especially as it was an on-leash park and she wasn't holding onto her dog's leash! Glad you weren't seriously hurt. I'm sad for you that you can't walk your own dog now because of this irresponsible woman. Yes I'm pretty upset about it... but I can see my husbands point of view. Sasha is a strong dog, and while we can usually go without incident, if I get caught off guard it's easy to be pulled off my feet. I've dislocated my finger before being pulled over by her (during a storm). I guess that's why I wanted to know if anyone thought I was to blame - because in this situation, I got knocked off my feet and didn't have the strength to stop and pull her out of the fight (well I did manage somehow - but not before there was a few moments of fighting). But I just can't believe that I should feel guilty because I have a big dog, who normally (when there are no offlead dogs bothering her) can be controlled quite easily (and most of the time, even when there is another offlead dog she behaves quite calmly and just tries to get out of their way, I think this time she'd just had enough... or maybe felt protective of me?). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeckoTree Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 What Dju says. Glad you wern't hurt badly. Perhaps both you and your husband can walk together with the dog? It might appease his concern etc. I am sure his concern lies in the fact that you are pregnant and were knocked over during the barney that the dogs were having. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly_Louise Posted August 17, 2011 Author Share Posted August 17, 2011 Not your fault KL. And even if Sasha had injured the small dog it would still not have been your fault. Where are peoples brains sometimes? It really makes me wonder.. Thanks SK I also wondered about the bolded part. It's easy for people to 'assume' that it would be my fault because Sasha is the bigger dog. And if somehow the lady turned nasty and made some kind of complaint (after admitting she was at fault) I did wonder if I could be blamed. There are many people with dogs I could use as witnesses though to say she isn't like that normally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly_Louise Posted August 17, 2011 Author Share Posted August 17, 2011 What Dju says. Glad you wern't hurt badly. Perhaps both you and your husband can walk together with the dog? It might appease his concern etc. I am sure his concern lies in the fact that you are pregnant and were knocked over during the barney that the dogs were having. Thanks GT. That's the plan, for us to walk together. But still, it's hard to give it up... it was our special 'bonding' time each day, a bit of 'me' time with my puppy. I've always been the primary caregiver/trainer etc to Sasha - so it's hard to let that go, if that makes sense. I won't be able to just pick up and say 'okay we're going for a walk' any time I like, as I do now - have to wait for hubby to not be busy. I"m not sure he'll want to trek as far as we generally do each day either. I do understand his concern though - and it's fair enough, because as he says, it could have been worse and I was lucky. It's the second time it's happened while I've been pregnant - the first time 2 offlead dogs attacked Sasha - there was no fight because she just tried to run away from them, but all the pulling and jerking of me trying to get them away from us and Sasha to safety caused bleeding (which thankfully wasn't anything serious, but a warning). So I totally understand, it just sucks that because of other people though, I can't do the thing I love to do each day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W Sibs Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 Not your fault KL. And even if Sasha had injured the small dog it would still not have been your fault. Where are peoples brains sometimes? It really makes me wonder.. This! You wrote it before I could, SK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trinabean Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 Yes I'm pretty upset about it... but I can see my husbands point of view. Sasha is a strong dog, and while we can usually go without incident, if I get caught off guard it's easy to be pulled off my feet. I've dislocated my finger before being pulled over by her (during a storm). I guess that's why I wanted to know if anyone thought I was to blame - because in this situation, I got knocked off my feet and didn't have the strength to stop and pull her out of the fight (well I did manage somehow - but not before there was a few moments of fighting). But I just can't believe that I should feel guilty because I have a big dog, who normally (when there are no offlead dogs bothering her) can be controlled quite easily (and most of the time, even when there is another offlead dog she behaves quite calmly and just tries to get out of their way, I think this time she'd just had enough... or maybe felt protective of me?). You shouldn't feel guilty. Sasha was rushed and attacked by (effectively) an off-lead dog. You should never have been put in this situation (having to pull her out of a fight). Had the other owner done the right thing in the first place then this situation wouldn't have happened. Maybe Sasha is feeling more protective of you because you are pregnant. In itself this is not a bad thing, only when other dog owners are inconsiderate idiots! ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzy82 Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 The other dog wasn't under effective control, and not on leash, so clearly the other owner is at fault. I have a fear aggressive dog, he is on leash at all times so he can't bother anyone, and I manage him so that he won't have a reaction to other dogs, and I put a lot of effort into managing him and his environment. He's the aggressive one, but I have effective control, so if another off leash dog runs up to us and my dog takes a chunk out of him, the other owner is still at fault. Btw, your partner can't forbid you from doing anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pie Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 Jeepers, glad you and baby are OK KL I got so frustrated reading your post - do people just not think?? How hard is it to hold a lead. Owners have every right to walk their dog in peace in an on lead area where dogs should be ON LEAD and not bothering others... unfortunately some people think they are too good to leash their dog... there are a few in my neighbourhood too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aussielover Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 Glad you're ok K_L! There is no way you're at fault- what else could you have done? You had your dog on lead and under control. I have to say the way that some small dogs run up to larger dogs and have a go at them is very irritating and stupid and it s***s me that some owners find it funny. My dog is submissive and the owners think its hilarious to see their little fluff ball "beat up" the big dog. When i told one they were lucky my dog is placid and that she didn't attack theirs they simply said they would have reported my dog if it had attacked! Umm hello, who started it??? But I guess it does raise a good point- it would literally be my word against theirs. Luckily these sorts of dogs are well known in our area and I'm sure others would vouch for us. At least the owner seemed apologetic and realised she was in the wrong. I had an embarrasing situation last night at training where my dog had gotten out of her crate without me realising and wandered over to say hello to a DA dog. I was so embarassed and apologised to the owner (the dog luckily didn't react and my dog hadn't gone right up into its face but was within a metre of them) but I think they were still annoyed and they had every right to be, I was totally in the wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Rusty Bucket Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 Hi KL You're not at fault http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/nsw/consol_act/caa1998174/index.html Item 16 is the most relevant one but that lady broke multiple sections of the act. As far as you not being able to walk Sasha safely - your husband will need to pick up the slack here. Or is there any chance you could try some walking dog tools that would give you extra leverage when Sasha gets excited. For me - the front attach harness works really well. http://www.softouchconcepts.com/ Gives me extra leverage - like a wheel barrow lets you carry more weight - the harness has a pivot point and gives you more strength to turn the dog around. Or prong collar - but for that - I'd recommend getting lessons from Steve Courtney at k9pro.com.au in how to use it effectively. Although depending on how you ask - it may be that you have the baby before you get in to see him. Do point that out, he's got a soft spot for kiddies at the moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest lavendergirl Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 Well I think its irrelevant what size the off leash dog was - the owner was at fault. There are just as many irresponsible large dog owners who think the rules don't apply to them. All dogs big and small should be on leash at all times in public unless they are in designated off leash areas. Even then owners should be in control of their dogs at all times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JulesP Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 (edited) Not your fault at all. Glad you are ok. I can see your partners point if you had some bleeding the last time. Can he go with you? Or can someone else? ETA: I thought about a stronger control method but am concerned about the potential for you to get knocked over still. Edited August 17, 2011 by JulesP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dee lee Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 I won't be able to just pick up and say 'okay we're going for a walk' any time I like, as I do now - have to wait for hubby to not be busy. I"m not sure he'll want to trek as far as we generally do each day either. I do understand his concern though - and it's fair enough, because as he says, it could have been worse and I was lucky. It's the second time it's happened while I've been pregnant - the first time 2 offlead dogs attacked Sasha - there was no fight because she just tried to run away from them, but all the pulling and jerking of me trying to get them away from us and Sasha to safety caused bleeding (which thankfully wasn't anything serious, but a warning). So I totally understand, it just sucks that because of other people though, I can't do the thing I love to do each day. Just think of it as some pre baby bonding time with your hubby. Soon enough you will be rushed and trying to fit everything in, for now you can enjoy the relaxing walks with your man and your dog. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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