Troy Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 The Anatolian Shepherd Dog ANKC Standard(from http://www.ankc.org.au/Breed_Details.aspx?bid=158 ) Group: Group 6 (Utility) General Appearance: Large, upstanding, tall, powerfully built, livestock guarding dog with broad strong head and dense double coat. Must have size and stamina. Capable of great speed. Important Proportions: Foreface slightly shorter than skull. Characteristics: An active breed originally used as a guard dog for sheep; hard working; capable of enduring extremes of heat and cold. Temperament: Steady and bold without aggression, naturally independent, very intelligent and tractable. Proud and confident. Loyal and affectionate to owners, but wary of strangers when mature. Head And Skull: Skull: Large, but in proportion to body, broad between ears, slightly domed, with slight stop. Mature males have broader head than females. Foreface: Seen from above almost rectangular. Profile blunt, tapering very slightly to end. Nose: Black, except in livers, where it is brown. Lips: Very slightly pendulous, black-edged. Edge of upper lip not lower than the profile of the underjaw. Tight lip-corners. Eyes: Rather small in proportion to size of skull, set well apart, deep set, showing no haw. Golden to brown in colour according to coat colour. Eye rims black except in livers. Ears: Medium sized, triangular in shape, rounded at tip, pendant with front edge close to cheek, higher when alert. Mouth: Teeth strong, with a perfect scissor bite, i.e. the upper teeth closely overlapping the lower teeth and set square to the jaw. Complete dentition. Neck: Slightly arched, powerful, muscular, moderate in length, rather thick. Slight dewlap. Forequarters: Shoulders: Well muscled, oblique. Forelegs: Set well apart, straight and well boned; of good length. Elbows: Close to sides, free moving. Pasterns: Strong, slightly sloping when viewed from side. Body: Powerful, well muscled, never fat. Topline: Rather short in proportion to leg length, horizontal, slightly arched over loins. Underline: With the belly well tucked up. Chest: Deep to point of elbow, ribs well sprung, ribcage sufficiently long. Hindquarters: Powerful, not overloaded with muscles. Hindlegs vertical when seen from rear. Thighs: Long. Stifle: Good turn of stifle. Feet: Strong, with thick pads and well arched toes. Nails short. Tail: Long, reaching to hock, set on rather high, when relaxed carried low with slight curl; when alert carried high and curled over back, especially by males. Gait/Movement: Very noticeable level line of body, head and neck when walking; movement even, supple and long reaching, giving impression of stalking, with great power. Pacing acceptable at slow speed. Mincing or hackney action highly undesirable. Coat: Hair: Short or mid-length, dense, with thick undercoat. Great variations in length according to climate. Longer and thicker at neck, shoulders and thighs. The coat tends to be longer in winter. Colour: All colours acceptable. Sizes: Height: Dogs 74-81 cm (29-32 ins) at the shoulders Bitches 71-79 cm (28-31 ins) at the shoulders Weight: Mature dogs 50-65 kg (110-145 lbs) Mature bitches 40-55 kg (85-120 lbs) Faults: Any departure from the foregoing points should be considered a fault and the seriousness with which the fault should be regarded should be in exact proportion to its degree and its effect upon the health and welfare of the dog. Notes: Male animals should have two apparently normal testicles fully descended into the scrotum See Photos of the Anatolian Shepherd Dog QUESTIONS 1. What is my relationship with the breed? (ie breeder, first time owner etc) 2. Where and why was the breed first developed? 3. How common is it in Australia? 4. What is the average lifespan? 5. What is the general temperament/personality? 6. How much daily exercise is needed for the average adult? 7. Is it a breed that a first time dog owner could easily cope with? 8. Can solo dogs of this breed easily occupy themselves for long periods? 9. How much grooming is required? 10. Is it too boisterous for very small children or for infirm people (unless the dog is well trained)? 11. Are there any common hereditary problems a puppy buyer should be aware of? 12. When buying a puppy, what are the things you should ask of the breeder? (eg what health tests have been done (if applicable) and what is an acceptable result to those tests so the buyer has an idea of what the result should be) If you wish to contribute to the knowledge about this breed, please answer the above questions. (Copy and paste them into a new post). Please only answer if you breed or own a pedigree example of this breed. You do not have to answer all questions Please keep posts limited to answering questions or for asking further questions if you require more (or expanded) information. See Photos of the Anatolian Shepherd Dog Anatolian Shepherd Dog Breeders Anatolian Shepherd Dog Puppies For Sale Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BJean Posted August 1, 2011 Share Posted August 1, 2011 (edited) 1. What is my relationship with the breed? long time breed obsessive (or rather regional variants obsessive) and I'm fascinated by primitive guardian breeds and their traditional environments. 2. Where and why was the breed first developed? contentious question. Fact #1 In Turkey there is no breed called Anatolian. The ANKC / FCI breed name refers to the geographical region (Anatolia) where the dogs are from. Fact # 2 There is no Kangal breeder or knowledgeable person on Kangal in Turkiye who would call Australian registered Kangals as Kangal. In Turkey, all Kangals in Australia are regarded as Anatolians (ie mixes of Aksaray, Tuzkoy, Kangal etc) Because quite simply, according to Turkish definition of what is Kangal, Australian Kangals are not Turkish Kangal because of (most importantly) physical type and lineage. Black mask has nothing to do with pure Kangal heritage. Fact # 3 In Australia, Kangals and Anatolian look the same, act the same and cannot be differentiated based on their physical appearance. So for all intents and purposes Kangal = Anatolian in Australia. If there is a Kangal breeder in Australia (or owner) or I guess enthusiast who believes otherwise. They are welcome to make comment and explain why they believe is not the case. Kangal is a regional breed or variant - depending on your definition of the term 'breed'. In Turkiye, you will also find: Tuzkoy, Aksaray, Yoruk, Akbas, Haymana and others variants (depending on the knowledge abse you speak to) (Kangal x Aksaray would be termed Turkish Coban Kopegi which is equivalent to Anatolian Shepherd0) That said, if a Tuzkoy is crossed with a Kangal and then that offspring crossed with a Kangal, for the most part, it is regarded as a Kangal. In reality the lines between the dogs of turkey are fluid and are not the definite lines most Australians understadn by the term breed. Lineage is relative. From here on in, all information is related to Australia, and the Australian context. For reasons of simplicity, pedigree accuracy and actuality: Anatolian = Kangal. 5. What is the general temperament/personality? 6. How much daily exercise is needed for the average adult? 7. Is it a breed that a first time dog owner could easily cope with? Not really. 8. Can solo dogs of this breed easily occupy themselves for long periods? 9. How much grooming is required? 10. Is it too boisterous for very small children or for infirm people (unless the dog is well trained)? 11. Are there any common hereditary problems a puppy buyer should be aware of? 12. When buying a puppy, what are the things you should ask of the breeder? (eg what health tests have been done (if applicable) and what is an acceptable result to those tests so the buyer has an idea of what the result should be) Edited August 10, 2011 by lilli Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KitKat Posted August 2, 2011 Share Posted August 2, 2011 Yay!!!!! I've been waiting for this thread :D :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BJean Posted August 10, 2011 Share Posted August 10, 2011 (edited) 3. How common is it in Australia? The Anatolian is not common in Australia, although it is generally well known or 'heard of'. The Anatolian also goes by the name of "Turkish Karabash", "Anatolian Karabash" and "Kangal". As the Anatolian is primarily a dog suited to open space, most homes are in a farming or rural area. Anatolians can be found in suburban areas, although this is less common. 4. What is the average lifespan? The average lifespan is anywhere from 11yo - 17yo. Much depends on lineage and environmental factors. Edited August 10, 2011 by lilli Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BJean Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 As of January 1st, 2012 Anatolian Shepherd Dogs and Kangal Dogs will be regarded as ONE breed - ANATOLIAN SHEPHERD DOGS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fit for a King Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 My understanding lilli that this decision is now under review because of what transpired at the ANKC conference and information now at hand...... As an aside you seem so angry and determined to denegrate anyone who believes they are a separate breed....I really have to wonder why. Unless you are the world authority on the breed and not just a breed enthusiast then let people do what they want to do within the CoE of the ANKC...it really isn't up to you or me to tell them otherwise. There is a separate breed standard which still stands as of this time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BJean Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 (edited) Edited March 23, 2012 by lilli Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BJean Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 (edited) Anatolian Shepherd Dogs in Australia: History of Anatolian Karabash / Anatolian Shepherd Dog / Kangal Dog http://www.takasvolkodav.com/anatolian-shepherd-dogs-in-australia.asp Edited April 18, 2015 by lilli Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fit for a King Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 Lilli - self confidence is one thing...arrogance has a category all of its own..... and your posts smack of arrogance - of the "I know better than anyone else".... I don't believe anyone has the right to make that claim unless they have been in the breed for 50 years, know every pedigree there is and are known world wide in that capacity....everyone else is and should be, learning as one goes about their respective breeds and listening to opinions........the ANKC saw fit to separate the breeds so who are you to say it shouldn't happen?.......as I said that decision is being reviewed and I hope it is reversed....I can't help but wonder whether the Anatolian people are hell bent on getting their hands on the Kangals to get the bloodlines....mmmmm...... As for the breed differences.....why if they are identical are the breed standards different??? Anatolian - All colours acceptable Kangal - The head invariably has a black mask. Body colour ranges from dun to steel grey. A white chest blaze may be present. The Kangal Dog is never white or spotted. Height and weight differences.... Body description different....... People can make up their own minds......I have no intention of continuing to argue with you....let people make up their own minds....and at the end of the day we are all dictated to by the ANKC anyway.......they get the final say...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BJean Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 (edited) Edited March 23, 2012 by lilli Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fit for a King Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 That's it I have done the maths - the Kangal people are satisfied to bring in their own semen and new lines and they are NOT the ones pushing to have the breed brought back togther......seems you just proved my point...the Anatolian people want the lines to further their breeding........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BJean Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 (edited) That's it I have done the maths - the Kangal people are satisfied to bring in their own semen and new lines and they are NOT the ones pushing to have the breed brought back togther......seems you just proved my point...the Anatolian people want the lines to further their breeding........... Fit For A King, unique Kangal bloodlines in Australia do not exist in todays ANKC Kangals. Your math will improve when you educate yourself on the genetic facts of what you are attempting to sum. From above: Apart from Takas' imports: Zwingli Des Poteries (Belgium 2008) and Dogru's Turkish Passport (USA 2010), Bonnie & Bastion (Turkiye 2011) there have been no Anatolian/Kangal imports of new lineage. The breeding of every other Anatolian and Kangal in Australia, consists of the same 8 Anatolians and 3 Kangals. Edited December 22, 2011 by lilli Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BJean Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 (edited) Edited March 23, 2012 by lilli Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BJean Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 (edited) Edited March 23, 2012 by lilli Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BJean Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 http://www.cccq.org.au/News.aspx?id=364 Anatolian Shepherd Dogs From 1 January 2012 ANKC Ltd will combine the registrations of Kangal Dogs and Anatolian Shepherd Dogs under Anatolian Shepherd Dogs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shazzapug Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 http://www.cccq.org.au/News.aspx?id=364 Anatolian Shepherd Dogs From 1 January 2012 ANKC Ltd will combine the registrations of Kangal Dogs and Anatolian Shepherd Dogs under Anatolian Shepherd Dogs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BJean Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 (edited) The Kangal Breed Standard has been removed from the ANKC website and the Kangal breed has been deleted from the official ANKC Breed Listing: ANKC Edited March 12, 2012 by lilli Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fit for a King Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 And just so you are kept up to date Dogs Qld have moved to have an injunctuion passed so that the breeds remains separated until the ANKC can hear further debate on the issue....so don't hold your party just yet Lilli.....and just as an aside Kangals still appear in the breeds list for Dogs Qld as at today :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
protectorasd Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 And just so you are kept up to date Dogs Qld have moved to have an injunctuion passed so that the breeds remains separated until the ANKC can hear further debate on the issue....so don't hold your party just yet Lilli.....and just as an aside Kangals still appear in the breeds list for Dogs Qld as at today :) As both a formally Kangal registed dog owner as well as an Anatolian owner, amalgamating the breed is in the best interest of the breed and I don’t see why the ANKC would need more time to debate the issue. The facts are the facts. Sometimes we don't like them, but they still remain as facts. ANKC Kangal=ANKC Anatolian. If you do your research, or simply look at a formally ANKC Kangal dog pedigree, I’m sure you will see that in Australia, there is no such thing as a pure Kangal. I’m happy to provide you with a number of pedigrees to look at anytime :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BJean Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 (edited) And just so you are kept up to date Dogs Qld have moved to have an injunctuion passed so that the breeds remains separated until the ANKC can hear further debate on the issue....so don't hold your party just yet Lilli.....and just as an aside Kangals still appear in the breeds list for Dogs Qld as at today :) I am not sure what the due process is for a State CC to move to rescind an ANKC Ruling, but I imagine it would require the State CC to consult with ALL of its registered Breeders of the affected breed, and not just one breeder? Otherwise it looks like Dogs QLD are acting on behalf of one breeder while obfuscating the other. That looks really bad and I hope I am wrong. In any case I will ask in General ... maybe this is allowed, I genuinely do not know. Edited March 12, 2012 by lilli Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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