Tim'sMum Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 I wonder if that Greens MP is also a card carrying PETA member? ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mita Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 I'd encourage people to send email to shoebridge as well as posting . . . no point preaching to the choir. [i'm one of those people who would like to be green, and it bugs the hell out of me to see Green representatives taking idiotic stances. The environment needs protection. I wish these idiots would do a better job on their core mission and stop playing footsie with the animal rights crowd.] Good to someone suggesting being proactive. I'm a card-carrying member of the Greens & can't see the point of this foray into sniffer dogs. I'm wondering if it has more to do with a proposer's views on drugs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panto Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 email sent to [email protected] You might want to look at the negative reaction to your policy on sniffer dogs. See: http://www.dolforums...f-sniffer-dogs/ key points * the statistics provided may show a good 'find' rate * most people would rather have a quick sniff over by a dog than have a policeman have them turn out their pockets, ramsack their house, search their car, etc. * you need to compare success of humans without dogs to success of humans working with dogs to do a fair analysis. I'd encourage people to send email to shoebridge as well as posting . . . no point preaching to the choir. [i'm one of those people who would like to be green, and it bugs the hell out of me to see Green representatives taking idiotic stances. The environment needs protection. I wish these idiots would do a better job on their core mission and stop playing footsie with the animal rights crowd.] Nice one! Couldnt help but think that they were scraping the barrell for issues to bring up, or seemed like it was an immature speech written the night before it had to be presented with very little thought put into it. Dear Greens. Back to the drawing board and think tank please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aussielover Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 They have control programs for bomb squad dogs and customs dogs, where the dogs are regularly required to participate in "set ups" and are required to locate the offending item. If they fail, they are removed from the squad and sent back into training or retired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mita Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 They have control programs for bomb squad dogs and customs dogs, where the dogs are regularly required to participate in "set ups" and are required to locate the offending item. If they fail, they are removed from the squad and sent back into training or retired. And another 'yes' to that, aussie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alyosha Posted July 13, 2011 Share Posted July 13, 2011 Not one mention of the term "proactive impact" in their whole spiel. Greens, get a grip. It's not all about getting people to Court you know, sometimes it's about effective reduction in criminal activity and protecting the community. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A-B-C Posted July 13, 2011 Share Posted July 13, 2011 GRRRRRR... What an absolutely ignorant 'Green'!!! Do they even know the capacity to detect of a dogs nose??? Or the effect their sheer presence has on peoples actions??? Obviously not!... if they did they would not be writing or calling for such rubbish change! Such an asset should not be wasted or thrown away! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john.davey.1960 Posted July 14, 2011 Share Posted July 14, 2011 As usual humans degrade themselves and their companion animals in attempts to justify bad policy. Dogfighters, hunters etc. would say they produce the best dogs while we all know deep down there is more to dogs than being our workhorses. Get rid of sniffer dogs and racing dogs and let dogs be what they truly are, our companions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kavik Posted July 14, 2011 Share Posted July 14, 2011 (edited) Actually john.davey I think most working dogs would be happier working ;) They are chosen because they love to work! And some of them are shelter dogs that would otherwise have been pts, probably because they were so active. Edited July 14, 2011 by Kavik Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aussielover Posted July 14, 2011 Share Posted July 14, 2011 As usual humans degrade themselves and their companion animals in attempts to justify bad policy. Dogfighters, hunters etc. would say they produce the best dogs while we all know deep down there is more to dogs than being our workhorses. Get rid of sniffer dogs and racing dogs and let dogs be what they truly are, our companions. Are you serious? Would you also deprive people of guide dogs and assistance dogs? There is usually a strict selection criteria for these dogs. A dog that doesn't want to work just won't perform. Very difficult to actually make a dog do something they don't want to do. A lot of dogs would be bored s***less if they didn't have a job to do. Some dogs do really need to be more than companions... and often end up in the pound for this reason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RottnBullies Posted July 14, 2011 Share Posted July 14, 2011 As usual humans degrade themselves and their companion animals in attempts to justify bad policy. Dogfighters, hunters etc. would say they produce the best dogs while we all know deep down there is more to dogs than being our workhorses. Get rid of sniffer dogs and racing dogs and let dogs be what they truly are, our companions. If some of these animal rights orgs ever get their way, you can say goodbye to your companion dog, may as well replace It now with a hardy stuffed toy! I'm sure It can be a great companion for you and It's rights will never be violated! Take away a working dogs ability to work and you may as well kill them all, Is that what you want What do you suppose will happen if all these dogs were just companions? Sure some may very well adapt to a life of sleeping and eating, but I guarantee many won't! I've said It before every dog has a purpose, take away that purpose and you'll be left with nothing let alone a companion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john.davey.1960 Posted July 15, 2011 Share Posted July 15, 2011 As usual humans degrade themselves and their companion animals in attempts to justify bad policy. Dogfighters, hunters etc. would say they produce the best dogs while we all know deep down there is more to dogs than being our workhorses. Get rid of sniffer dogs and racing dogs and let dogs be what they truly are, our companions. If some of these animal rights orgs ever get their way, you can say goodbye to your companion dog, may as well replace It now with a hardy stuffed toy! I'm sure It can be a great companion for you and It's rights will never be violated! Take away a working dogs ability to work and you may as well kill them all, Is that what you want What do you suppose will happen if all these dogs were just companions? Sure some may very well adapt to a life of sleeping and eating, but I guarantee many won't! I've said It before every dog has a purpose, take away that purpose and you'll be left with nothing let alone a companion Your right about the animal groups. Dogs are what we make them. Pits are no more natural fighters than GSDs are natural, shepherds. Agility would be better for dogs than seeing them blown to bits on the battlefield. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandgrubber Posted July 15, 2011 Share Posted July 15, 2011 (edited) As usual humans degrade themselves and their companion animals in attempts to justify bad policy. Dogfighters, hunters etc. would say they produce the best dogs while we all know deep down there is more to dogs than being our workhorses. Get rid of sniffer dogs and racing dogs and let dogs be what they truly are, our companions. If some of these animal rights orgs ever get their way, you can say goodbye to your companion dog, may as well replace It now with a hardy stuffed toy! I'm sure It can be a great companion for you and It's rights will never be violated! Take away a working dogs ability to work and you may as well kill them all, Is that what you want What do you suppose will happen if all these dogs were just companions? Sure some may very well adapt to a life of sleeping and eating, but I guarantee many won't! I've said It before every dog has a purpose, take away that purpose and you'll be left with nothing let alone a companion Your right about the animal groups. Dogs are what we make them. Pits are no more natural fighters than GSDs are natural, shepherds. Agility would be better for dogs than seeing them blown to bits on the battlefield. I was taught the Golden Rule (do as you would be done by). I'd rather be blown to bits in my prime doing something that I found satisfying than live to a lonely, depressed, miserable ripe-old age with little that satisfies my inbuilt desires. The dogs to feel sorry for are the social animals kept in solitary confinement in someone's back yard for the duration of their life. Edited July 15, 2011 by sandgrubber Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WreckitWhippet Posted July 15, 2011 Share Posted July 15, 2011 As usual humans degrade themselves and their companion animals in attempts to justify bad policy. Dogfighters, hunters etc. would say they produce the best dogs while we all know deep down there is more to dogs than being our workhorses. Get rid of sniffer dogs and racing dogs and let dogs be what they truly are, our companions. tell that to my race dogs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
espinay2 Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 As usual humans degrade themselves and their companion animals in attempts to justify bad policy. Dogfighters, hunters etc. would say they produce the best dogs while we all know deep down there is more to dogs than being our workhorses. Get rid of sniffer dogs and racing dogs and let dogs be what they truly are, our companions. The majority of dogs would be MUCH happier doing the job they were designed to do that sitting around all day being 'companions'. I actually find it a little distasteful to have dogs considered as purely our 'entertainment'. While humans have developed a rapport with them, the majority of breeds were NEVER designed to be just companions and to say so shows an extreme lack of understanding of the species and its development. Dogs though history and now have assisted man. The jobs that dogs do are many and varied. They were on the whole bred to work. There are dogs that heard stock, dogs that protect stock, dogs that find things such as lost or trapped people, cancer, truffles and so on, dogs that alert to impending seizures, dogs that assist the deaf, dogs that assist with mobility, dogs that assist the blind, dogs that help control vermin, dogs that protect us, dogs that help us transport ourselves and our goods from A to B, dogs that help us hunt and feed our family (and on a worldwide basis these are still very important needs - we should not be so insular as to only look at dogs through western urban eyes). I have met working dogs doing all sorts of roles and on the whole these dogs are happy, fulfilled, and live a fuller life than most 'companion' dogs who live at someone beck and call in their backyard - many of which are slowly going crazy for lack of a job and doing the things that we hear about time and time again on these forums - digging, barking ,escaping, destroying things etc etc. The 'working' dogs on the other hand get on the majority more attention and more fulfillment doing something they were bred to do. When it comes to 'sniffer' dogs quite a few are dogs that have such a high drive that they were not suited as 'companions' - Their suburban backyard owners couldnt give them what they needed to be happy. They could be PTS by the pounds and shelters at that point but instead they go on to have a fulfilling life as a working dog. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 (edited) As usual humans degrade themselves and their companion animals in attempts to justify bad policy. Dogfighters, hunters etc. would say they produce the best dogs while we all know deep down there is more to dogs than being our workhorses. Get rid of sniffer dogs and racing dogs and let dogs be what they truly are, our companions. Oh come off it! You say we all know deep down there is more to dogs than being a work horse whilst saying that all there is to dogs is their value as companions. Ask the dog what its most happy doing - give it a choice and watch what it thinks will make it happiest. How totally boring for dogs bred to work to have to sit all day and act like humans. Edited July 17, 2011 by Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aidan3 Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Pits are no more natural fighters than GSDs are natural, shepherds. I take it you are opposed to selective breeding practices also? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john.davey.1960 Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 As usual humans degrade themselves and their companion animals in attempts to justify bad policy. Dogfighters, hunters etc. would say they produce the best dogs while we all know deep down there is more to dogs than being our workhorses. Get rid of sniffer dogs and racing dogs and let dogs be what they truly are, our companions. The majority of dogs would be MUCH happier doing the job they were designed to do that sitting around all day being 'companions'. I actually find it a little distasteful to have dogs considered as purely our 'entertainment'. While humans have developed a rapport with them, the majority of breeds were NEVER designed to be just companions and to say so shows an extreme lack of understanding of the species and its development. Dogs though history and now have assisted man. The jobs that dogs do are many and varied. They were on the whole bred to work. There are dogs that heard stock, dogs that protect stock, dogs that find things such as lost or trapped people, cancer, truffles and so on, dogs that alert to impending seizures, dogs that assist the deaf, dogs that assist with mobility, dogs that assist the blind, dogs that help control vermin, dogs that protect us, dogs that help us transport ourselves and our goods from A to B, dogs that help us hunt and feed our family (and on a worldwide basis these are still very important needs - we should not be so insular as to only look at dogs through western urban eyes). I have met working dogs doing all sorts of roles and on the whole these dogs are happy, fulfilled, and live a fuller life than most 'companion' dogs who live at someone beck and call in their backyard - many of which are slowly going crazy for lack of a job and doing the things that we hear about time and time again on these forums - digging, barking ,escaping, destroying things etc etc. The 'working' dogs on the other hand get on the majority more attention and more fulfillment doing something they were bred to do. When it comes to 'sniffer' dogs quite a few are dogs that have such a high drive that they were not suited as 'companions' - Their suburban backyard owners couldnt give them what they needed to be happy. They could be PTS by the pounds and shelters at that point but instead they go on to have a fulfilling life as a working dog. Time to get real. Dog fighters say their dogs are happiest when fighting, hunters say their dogs are happiest when killing, slave owners say their dogs are happiest when chasing runaways. Dogs have to change with the times. Killing them rather than retraining them says more about the killers than the dogs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OSoSwift Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 I may be missing something but no one is saying we should fight dogs or hunt slaves or that we should take dogs out in droves to kill things. Guide dogs, sniffer dogs, assistance dogs,bomb detection dogs are all working, do it becaue they love it. You cannot force a dog to sniff out contraband. IT does it because it enjoys it and likes the reward it recieves. My dogs are my companions, but as I ask them to do obedience should I also stop doing that after all it is working them is it not?? I can guarentee you as I work my dogs with no leads there is no way I could make them do anything they didn't want to! I think it is time YOU got real! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tarope Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 I say get rid of the Greens, a useless pack of Muppets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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