tobie Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 Sorry if this sounds nasty but why do people buy dogs with the intention to breed when they clearly have no idea about even the basics. Rather than looking at breeding I think this person needs to spend time learning about dogs before even considering breeding her dogs. There are so many things this person can do with her dogs that will help her to learn and there is a wealth of knowledge out there. I'm sorry but I find attitudes like this persons extremely frustrating as there are enough inexperienced people breeding dogs. I think the original poster needs to really have a good think about why she wants to breed and then get out there and learn as much as she can. Working in an animal shelter I see the end results of inexperienced breeders and BYBs on a daily basis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HollyMilo Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 for a numpty like me, what is the difference between King Charles & Cavalier? I see/hear a lot of people talk as though they are one breed (usually the same ones who say Maltese TERRIER ). King Charles Spaniels (3 - 5 kgs) are smaller than Cavaliers (5 - 8 kgs). King Charles have a squished in face (that's the correct technical term you know ) and a high domed head. Cavaliers have a skull that is flat between the ears and their muzzle is longer than a King Charles. No offence intended to King Charles Spaniel lovers, but everytime I see one, I think of a Cavalier that's been smacked in the face with the bottom of a frypan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mjosa Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 Tobie, everyone has to start from somewhere, I started in the showing and exhibiting, BTW with Pem Corgis back in 1969, had a fantastic mentor and I am sure that the OP would have a great mentor in her Grandmother who has been breeding Pem Corgis for 30 years. I have now been with French Bulldogs for almost 30 years and I am always willing to mentor people new to this breed who are willing to listen and more importantly learn from what I can impart to them about a rather complex breed. I do not understand why when someone is asking for help why it eventually turns into a witch hunt with negativity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ons Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 great post Mjosa that's exactly what I was thinking If only experienced people bred eventually they would pass on and there would be no one breeding pedigree dogs you could bet your bottom dollar though that byb would be flourishing. I'm hoping to get into breeding griffons, I have no experience in breeding but would consider that i do have a good knowledge of dogs (and i have rescued dogs), I have a mentor in griffons, I just want to go up the "next step" if I can describe it as that and show and become a breeder as well, should I not because I have no experience of breeding? I actually thought the OP was a reasonable question although I am aware that smaller dogs can come into season early on. and I also liked the way the OP said provided that the dogs were a good example of the breed so does show some knowledge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TsarsMum Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 great post Mjosa that's exactly what I was thinking If only experienced people bred eventually they would pass on and there would be no one breeding pedigree dogs you could bet your bottom dollar though that byb would be flourishing. I'm hoping to get into breeding griffons, I have no experience in breeding but would consider that i do have a good knowledge of dogs (and i have rescued dogs), I have a mentor in griffons, I just want to go up the "next step" if I can describe it as that and show and become a breeder as well, should I not because I have no experience of breeding? I actually thought the OP was a reasonable question although I am aware that smaller dogs can come into season early on. and I also liked the way the OP said provided that the dogs were a good example of the breed so does show some knowledge. totally agree ....... I thought she was really asking about the puppy more then the bitch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gretel Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 Yes temperaments are very different with the breeds too. The Charlies I've known couldn't really care less whether they please you or not whereas most Cavaliers are eager to please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tobie Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 Tobie, everyone has to start from somewhere, I started in the showing and exhibiting, BTW with Pem Corgis back in 1969, had a fantastic mentor and I am sure that the OP would have a great mentor in her Grandmother who has been breeding Pem Corgis for 30 years. I have now been with French Bulldogs for almost 30 years and I am always willing to mentor people new to this breed who are willing to listen and more importantly learn from what I can impart to them about a rather complex breed. I do not understand why when someone is asking for help why it eventually turns into a witch hunt with negativity. I understand people have to start somewhere but I beleive that it is very important that people learn as much as they can before even considering breeding and I'm sorry but if someone does not know when to expect a bitch to come in season for the first time they are showing their basic lack of knowledge and that they should spend alot more time educating themselves before even considering breeding and I don't see what is wrong with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasBull Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 Tobie, everyone has to start from somewhere, I started in the showing and exhibiting, BTW with Pem Corgis back in 1969, had a fantastic mentor and I am sure that the OP would have a great mentor in her Grandmother who has been breeding Pem Corgis for 30 years. I have now been with French Bulldogs for almost 30 years and I am always willing to mentor people new to this breed who are willing to listen and more importantly learn from what I can impart to them about a rather complex breed. I do not understand why when someone is asking for help why it eventually turns into a witch hunt with negativity. I am one of those people Mjosa has helped and I can say with much appreciation she has guided me and helped me into the wonderful world of Frenchies, yes I did research but would not know half as much without her mentoring me. If I did not have her help when starting out then I would not have had the pleasure of this wonderful breed. Now even though I know there is still lots to learn (their always is)I can help others to learn. I think the fact that the OP is asking for help is a good start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toolz Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 i am just starting out down the road to breeding in the future and i guess i am lucky in that i have an experienced breeder of the same breed who is also a friend of mine that is willing to help me along the way. OP get yourself a mentor if you can.. an experienced breeder of your chosen breed who is willing to work with you thru the process.. mentors are in my opinion worth their weight in gold.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 hey, melstar - Glad you came on here and asked - there is lots of advice for you to act on already . Stick around!! as you are just starting out , and have a LOT to learn - perhaps try & find yourself a mentor amongst breeders of your chosen breed! Ask the breeder/s from whom your sourced your dogs - they should offer you lots of advice, and may know someone who can help you fill in the gaps in your knowledge ...who can show you/teach you things Pups of the age of your two may indeed mate - and even if the male is not fertile - it is not something which should happen, IMO. they are only young - and may get hurt/scared - which is NOT something a future breeding dog wants to do.Whilst those knickers are good for mopping up drips - total separation for the three weeks is what's needed for your two now.Knickers are NOT birth control. Being unsure of how to proceed now, and not being ready for your bitches season occurring, does indicate your lack of experience ..and basic research, sorry . Get your phone dialling finger going, and the computer keyboard clicking - and research, research, research!! Dog anatomy, oestrus cycles, management of entire dogs , dog behaviour , first aid - these are all useful basic things which, if/when you do decide to have puppies will mean a lot more calm and a lot less panic ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melstar-36 Posted July 10, 2011 Author Share Posted July 10, 2011 thanks for all the POSTIVE feedback guys, it was late the other night and i didnt get much sleep. Firstly i have a cavalier king charles spaniel, was up late the other night i forgot the "cavalier" at the start. and i do agree i have alot to learn and i was taken by surprise, shes still my little baby. and i didnt make the post to be critzed by others, i was seeking advise and any ideas to what would ease my boys sulking. And evan though i have my breeders licence, doesnt mean im going to breed my bitch straight away and without meeting all health standards, as stated i have alot to learn. Just wanted to get it as soon as i could, to show my nan. she was very proud of me and considers me as a "mini me". i will know when im ready to breed my bitch and it wont be anytime soon, and if i do decide it wont be for profit, it will be to add a new addition to my family. i have been reading books and researching like mad for well ove a year, my main interest is showing but i dont want to embrass myself by jumping in the show ring without any knowleadge. Im sorry if some of you think that im "extremely un-educated" i did know when my bitch was coming into season, i did know to seperate them, i do know about health testing. And of course im an inexperienced breeder, ive never breed before !!! and now i know that my bitch can come into season at 6 months. Its great to know that theyre are some poeple who are willing to help and give advise without grilling somebody. we all started somewhere !!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 I hope you stick with us ... There is such a wealth of info on here .... for anything doggy ! You must admit though .. someone naming their breed incorrectly , and being taken by surprise at the age a small dog can come in season ....after lots of research... well... When do we see photos of these two cuties? Cavs have the most beautiful eyes /expressions! I hope they grow up to be wonderful, and sound, but, no matter what - they are your little beauties Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo Baggins Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 i think that king charles spaniels are smaller than Cavaliers as well from memory those beautiful spaniels that you see in old english paintings are king charles spaniels The old paintings are actually cavs. But they where called King Charles. When the squished face became popular and the longer nose dropped out the name stayed. When the breed was reformed in 1925 they had to come up with a name so they became Cavalier King Charles as King Charles who had the breed was known as the Cavalier King. Long Story shortened. :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo Baggins Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 Melstar 6 months is young, its usually around 8-9 months. If you are interested in showing I am willing to help you navigate scary group 1. :rofl: Please PM me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andisa Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 (edited) Melstar 6 months is young, its usually around 8-9 months. If you are interested in showing I am willing to help you navigate scary group 1. :rofl: Please PM me. What a fantastic offer BB - melstar-36, I highly recommend you take up this wonderful and generous offer, you will be in the best hands with BB as a mentor. :D Gr 1 can be a scary place... Edited July 10, 2011 by Andisa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JulesP Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 Melstar 6 months is young, its usually around 8-9 months. If you are interested in showing I am willing to help you navigate scary group 1. :rofl: Please PM me. Nice :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OSoSwift Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 :thumbsup: BB - your a gem, and yes please take this offer you will learn more than you could ever have thought! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olivebaby Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 I have asked a very broad question about breeding before and been slammed by people for asking a question. It's not fair and everyone should be giving helpful advice or just not answering at all. It's hard enoug for a new puppy owner as it is, without being ridiculed for asking questions on a dog forum. In saying that i have had many many many more supportive and helpful comments. So to those people, keep it up. You are the reason I am still here looking for ways to make my girls life happier and healthier! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B-Q Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 (edited) thanks for all the POSTIVE feedback guys, it was late the other night and i didnt get much sleep. Firstly i have a cavalier king charles spaniel, was up late the other night i forgot the "cavalier" at the start. and i do agree i have alot to learn and i was taken by surprise, shes still my little baby. and i didnt make the post to be critzed by others, i was seeking advise and any ideas to what would ease my boys sulking. And evan though i have my breeders licence, doesnt mean im going to breed my bitch straight away and without meeting all health standards, as stated i have alot to learn. Just wanted to get it as soon as i could, to show my nan. she was very proud of me and considers me as a "mini me". i will know when im ready to breed my bitch and it wont be anytime soon, and if i do decide it wont be for profit, it will be to add a new addition to my family. i have been reading books and researching like mad for well ove a year, my main interest is showing but i dont want to embrass myself by jumping in the show ring without any knowleadge. Im sorry if some of you think that im "extremely un-educated" i did know when my bitch was coming into season, i did know to seperate them, i do know about health testing. And of course im an inexperienced breeder, ive never breed before !!! and now i know that my bitch can come into season at 6 months. Its great to know that theyre are some poeple who are willing to help and give advise without grilling somebody. we all started somewhere !!!!!! You do have a good attitude Melstar, too many people when first faced with DOL decide they DO know it all thankyou very much and will take their business elsewhere. You sound like you have good intentions but also keep in mind that the dogs you have now might not work out as suitable to breed and in the grand scheme of things, 1 year of research is a drop in the bucket. I come from a family of dog lovers, my auntie was a registered ACD breeder in her early twenties, then went on to breed cockers and british shorthair cats (although I wouldn't say she was ever as ethical as I would like to see, she loved and still loves her animals a great deal and is very kind to them) I have lived with dogs my entire life and at 15 years old I got online and started reading, stumbled onto a forum, read more, joined DOL at 17, kept reading and now after 6.5 years of research the main thing I've learnt is that I have SO much to learn. I'd love to breed one day but am a long way off feeling confident to take on that responsibility. Be a sponge, be open minded, take advice and know your dogs. ETA: Don't feel attacked by people wondering why you are asking questions like you are, but I think one of the most important things you can have as a responsible breeder is an incredible amount of breed knowledge. You should know your breed (and your lines) inside out and back to front, health issues, odd behaviour traits, life expectancy, normal time for first heats, etc etc etc. Edited July 11, 2011 by B-Q Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mjosa Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 Well Tobie not all breeds come in at six months, my breed for instance, French Bulldog, you are lucky if they come in by 12 months of age and even later for the first time, I also think that the Basenji is the same and because it is one of the more "primitive" breeds only cylce once a year, I stand to be corrected, so from just these two examples I am guessing you have not done your research on this on all breeds so I think your critisism is out of order. The OP is dong the very best by asking here and she has received a lot of very good advice and BB you are an angel to offer her the help around scary ring one, of course that is no exception LOL try the other six LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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