Is This Reasonable Behaviour? Bit Of A Rant...

[Oskar & Zsa Zsa]

But hey, we all have our own opinions on how things should or shouldn't be and what you believe is what works for you and vice versa. I can only talk from my experience and in my experience, balls and sticks are wonderful playthings in a puppy park.

Sticks are a common source of mouth and upper respiratory tract injuries. Ask your vet.

I think you're missing the point here. Its not about what works for YOU. Its about preventing incidents and giving other dog owners choices about who their dogs run with. The issue is not how nice or how gently any one here's dogs are with other dogs. The issue is that unless someone knows your dogs, they don't know that. You also don't know about dogs you're just seeing for the first time.

So asking a stranger if its OK for your dogs to mix gives them time to inform you if there's an issue and protects your dogs from any adverse reactions they might have encountered.

An ounce of prevention and all that...

It will be interesting if Oscar's behaviour changes as he matures and with Zsa Zsa on the scene. Many male dogs (desexed or not) tend to be protective of bitches in their pack.

What you can rest assured about is that other male dogs attitudes to Oscar will start to change now. His puppy license is about to expire.

Sticks may well be a source of mouth and respitory tract infection, but I am not in the mindset where I am going to wrap my dog up in cotton wool and avoid him or her playing with things they find fun and which in 40 years of having dogs I have never had an issue with. I think you are being a little precious on that issue. They are dogs at the end of the day even though we do try to humanise them often.

PF, I don't think I am missing any point. As for asking a stranger, if it were not in a public dog park, then yes, it is not only common courtesy, but also safe for all dogs and owners concerned no arguments from me. However, with a public fenced off lead area, it is reasonable to expect that the dogs in there are safe to socialise with. Of course as with all dogs, supervision is paramount, as they sometimes have similiar reactions as we humans do, where they just don't like someone. But it is reasonable to expect a respectable level of behaviour of dogs in a dog park.

Thanks for the heads up on Ozkar's puppy Licence. I will try and renew it this month It will however be an interesting journey to see how he changes as he goes from puppy to dog. I hope his current persona doesn't alter too much, as he is such a beautiful natured boy right now. He is a rare Vizsla, in that he is quite chilled out. He doesn't have an aggressive bone in his body, but, he is also not a cowering fearful puppy. He will submit and let them know all he wants to do is be friends, but, if after warning 3 they don't take heed, he will make them well aware, without too much aggression, to back off. It's a nice balance in him which I hope stays. He is gentle around little kids too, and really careful with the smaller dogs. It's cute to watch him gently paw a small dog and bounce back, encouraging it to come play. He usually succeeds..

[suziwong66]

Whilst there appears to be some 'not so obvious' social norms at the club, respectful behaviour should always be a primary objective. It appears you violated some of the social norms of the club but i'm not sure that the woman's behaviour is either justified or acceptable. Kudos to you for your restraint

[poodlefan]

Sticks may well be a source of mouth and respitory tract infection, but I am not in the mindset where I am going to wrap my dog up in cotton wool and avoid him or her playing with things they find fun and which in 40 years of having dogs I have never had an issue with. I think you are being a little precious on that issue. They are dogs at the end of the day even though we do try to humanise them often.

No, I'm not being precious and I don't humanise my dogs. I simply don't encourage them to behave in a manner that could result in serious injury. In the case of one of my dogs, it did.

PF, I don't think I am missing any point. As for asking a stranger, if it were not in a public dog park, then yes, it is not only common courtesy, but also safe for all dogs and owners concerned no arguments from me. However, with a public fenced off lead area, it is reasonable to expect that the dogs in there are safe to socialise with. Of course as with all dogs, supervision is paramount, as they sometimes have similiar reactions as we humans do, where they just don't like someone. But it is reasonable to expect a respectable level of behaviour of dogs in a dog park.

So strangers in public dog parks deserve less courtesy than elsewhere?? Your expectation is not only false but potentially dangerous to the health of your dogs and others. Dogs are injured by other dogs (both intentionally and unintentionally) and occasionally die in public dog parks. Don't believe me? Ask other DOLers.

Thanks for the heads up on Ozkar's puppy Licence. I will try and renew it this month It will however be an interesting journey to see how he changes as he goes from puppy to dog. I hope his current persona doesn't alter too much, as he is such a beautiful natured boy right now. He is a rare Vizsla, in that he is quite chilled out. He doesn't have an aggressive bone in his body, but, he is also not a cowering fearful puppy. He will submit and let them know all he wants to do is be friends, but, if after warning 3 they don't take heed, he will make them well aware, without too much aggression, to back off. It's a nice balance in him which I hope stays. He is gentle around little kids too, and really careful with the smaller dogs. It's cute to watch him gently paw a small dog and bounce back, encouraging it to come play. He usually succeeds..

You don't get to renew the license. Other dogs won't grant him one. Once again you miss the point. It's not Oscar's behaviour you have only to worry about but how other dogs will react to a maturing male. Telling the wrong dog to back off will result in a full on dust up. My advice to you is to intervene before your dog needs to tell others to back off or he'll end up in an incident.

Suit yourself though It seems you're going to have to learn about this the hard way.

[Guest]

But hey, we all have our own opinions on how things should or shouldn't be and what you believe is what works for you and vice versa. I can only talk from my experience and in my experience, balls and sticks are wonderful playthings in a puppy park.

Sticks are a common source of mouth and upper respiratory tract injuries. Ask your vet.

I think you're missing the point here. Its not about what works for YOU. Its about preventing incidents and giving other dog owners choices about who their dogs run with. The issue is not how nice or how gently any one here's dogs are with other dogs. The issue is that unless someone knows your dogs, they don't know that. You also don't know about dogs you're just seeing for the first time.

So asking a stranger if its OK for your dogs to mix gives them time to inform you if there's an issue and protects your dogs from any adverse reactions they might have encountered.

An ounce of prevention and all that...

It will be interesting if Oscar's behaviour changes as he matures and with Zsa Zsa on the scene. Many male dogs (desexed or not) tend to be protective of bitches in their pack.

What you can rest assured about is that other male dogs attitudes to Oscar will start to change now. His puppy license is about to expire.

[Oskar & Zsa Zsa]

Sticks may well be a source of mouth and respitory tract infection, but I am not in the mindset where I am going to wrap my dog up in cotton wool and avoid him or her playing with things they find fun and which in 40 years of having dogs I have never had an issue with. I think you are being a little precious on that issue. They are dogs at the end of the day even though we do try to humanise them often.

No, I'm not being precious and I don't humanise my dogs. I simply don't encourage them to behave in a manner that could result in serious injury. In the case of one of my dogs, it did.

PF, I don't think I am missing any point. As for asking a stranger, if it were not in a public dog park, then yes, it is not only common courtesy, but also safe for all dogs and owners concerned no arguments from me. However, with a public fenced off lead area, it is reasonable to expect that the dogs in there are safe to socialise with. Of course as with all dogs, supervision is paramount, as they sometimes have similiar reactions as we humans do, where they just don't like someone. But it is reasonable to expect a respectable level of behaviour of dogs in a dog park.

So strangers in public dog parks deserve less courtesy than elsewhere?? Your expectation is not only false but potentially dangerous to the health of your dogs and others. Dogs are injured by other dogs (both intentionally and unintentionally) and occasionally die in public dog parks. Don't believe me? Ask other DOLers.

Thanks for the heads up on Ozkar's puppy Licence. I will try and renew it this month It will however be an interesting journey to see how he changes as he goes from puppy to dog. I hope his current persona doesn't alter too much, as he is such a beautiful natured boy right now. He is a rare Vizsla, in that he is quite chilled out. He doesn't have an aggressive bone in his body, but, he is also not a cowering fearful puppy. He will submit and let them know all he wants to do is be friends, but, if after warning 3 they don't take heed, he will make them well aware, without too much aggression, to back off. It's a nice balance in him which I hope stays. He is gentle around little kids too, and really careful with the smaller dogs. It's cute to watch him gently paw a small dog and bounce back, encouraging it to come play. He usually succeeds..

You don't get to renew the license. Other dogs won't grant him one. Once again you miss the point. It's not Oscar's behaviour you have only to worry about but how other dogs will react to a maturing male. Telling the wrong dog to back off will result in a full on dust up. My advice to you is to intervene before your dog needs to tell others to back off or he'll end up in an incident.

Suit yourself though It seems you're going to have to learn about this the hard way.

If you read my post, your reply is only re wording what I said? I don't understand what you are arguing about? I already agreed it will be interesting to see how he changes and that includes the way other dogs interact with him. As for learning the hard way, I've been with dogs my entire life, they all seem to have survived the experience.

[Swizzlestick]

She then goes on to say that its for dog owners whose dogs can't run around on the oval (so presumably out of control or aggressive) or wanted to do training (which is exactly what I wanted .

To assume a dog that needs a fully fenced secure off lead area is out of control or aggressive is wrong imo.

What about certain breeds eg. the majority of sighthounds. Not many Afghans, Saluki, Borzoi etc would be let offlead in an open area. (Some are exceptional, but this is rare). Many just don't have the 110% recall needed.

I too agree with others about asking first before entering when someone else is using the area. Mainly for the safety of my own dogs though. You never know what the other dog is like with strange dogs.

[poodlefan]

[

If you read my post, your reply is only re wording what I said? I don't understand what you are arguing about? I already agreed it will be interesting to see how he changes and that includes the way other dogs interact with him. As for learning the hard way, I've been with dogs my entire life, they all seem to have survived the experience.

What I'm arguing about is your assertion that you can expect every dog in a public dog park to be well socialised and that gives you the right to bowl in without checking with a stranger that its OK with them. I'm saying that for a range of reasons that doing that is both discourteous and potentially unsafe. That's hardly rewording what you said. Your 40 years of good luck could run out any day. All it takes is one dog. I hope for your sake it doesn't.

[Danois]

If I want to enter a fenced area and there are small dogs present, I will always call out 'are your dogs big dog friendly' before entering - got a no answer once but the owner said that they would leave so I could enter.

I have also had a couple of people say - oh yes. First thing the little SWF does is run up, get in his face and harass him - but of course this is amusing :rolleyes:

Edited July 5, 2011 by Danois

[Mrs Rusty Bucket]

Our dog club doesn't have any fenced areas except the club verandah. Members of the public sometimes wander through classes and trials with their dogs off lead - in an area clearly designated ON LEAD (Except for club sanctioned activities - I hope). Some of them can call their dogs clear, and lots of them think they don't need to ie that the dog club shouldn't be there or something.

ACT has a good dog park ettiquette list, and it's stuck to the gates as well.

http://www.tams.act.gov.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0017/125423/29061_Territory_Services_Dog_Etiquette_Rev.pdf

I avoid the fenced dog parks in our area. It's too easy for a dog to get trapped in a corner.

I know some dogs that are fine as long as no other dogs have food or toys. So it is polite to ask before getting those out. I had problems when my dog was a puppy with someone exercising their dog with a ball, and my dog nicked the ball. Eventually I got the ball back for the owner but she kept throwing it. Which I thought was a bit rude. My dog's manners have improved considerably since then - but I would have appreciated a heads up so I could have put my puppy on lead. She still nicks balls from time to time but she always asks the other dog first, and gives it back when the other dog says. Or I say.

[W Sibs]

PF, I don't think I am missing any point. As for asking a stranger, if it were not in a public dog park, then yes, it is not only common courtesy, but also safe for all dogs and owners concerned no arguments from me. However, with a public fenced off lead area, it is reasonable to expect that the dogs in there are safe to socialise with. Of course as with all dogs, supervision is paramount, as they sometimes have similiar reactions as we humans do, where they just don't like someone. But it is reasonable to expect a respectable level of behaviour of dogs in a dog park.

I don't agree with this. At all. I stay away from fence dog park and it's because my worst experience with dogs and people are at those parks.

I don't believe that there is a good dog fence park either. Been to quite a few that I truly believe there is no such thing. There is always one idiot owner or one uncontrollable dog at those park.

If I want my 2 to play in a fence area, it will be in my backyard or at a friend's backyard where I know the dogs and their owners.

[conztruct]

PF, I don't think I am missing any point. As for asking a stranger, if it were not in a public dog park, then yes, it is not only common courtesy, but also safe for all dogs and owners concerned no arguments from me. However, with a public fenced off lead area, it is reasonable to expect that the dogs in there are safe to socialise with. Of course as with all dogs, supervision is paramount, as they sometimes have similiar reactions as we humans do, where they just don't like someone. But it is reasonable to expect a respectable level of behaviour of dogs in a dog park.

I don't agree with this. At all. I stay away from fence dog park and it's because my worst experience with dogs and people are at those parks.

I don't believe that there is a good dog fence park either. Been to quite a few that I truly believe there is no such thing. There is always one idiot owner or one uncontrollable dog at those park.

If I want my 2 to play in a fence area, it will be in my backyard or at a friend's backyard where I know the dogs and their owners.

I agree with the bolded bit - your expectations are reasonable because they reflect what the rules generally around having a dog in a dog park. BUT, sorry to be direct, to expect that your reasonable expectations are a reality is misguided - one basic rule to remember is that when you're dealing with people (and their dogs) is to expect the unexpected - it happens in many situations, not just dog parks.

We should reasonably expect that people have respect for our property and don't steal from us - yet, we lock our houses up with appropriate security because the reaonsably expected is not a reality, and the list goes on and on.

These are two different issues - it's fine to have a reasonable expectation and if there was any action or legals over an issue you'd be in the right, but are you happy to blindly face the consequences of a possible incident, injury or death of a dog because of the unexpected when it is pretty simple to take a few steps to account for this?

I'm not knocking you - you're right - you should be able to expect what you have said but it's just not realistic, and being in the right is not more important than preventing a potential incident.

Edited July 5, 2011 by conztruct