Tansy Posted June 11, 2011 Share Posted June 11, 2011 Interested in people's feedback on how they price puppies with faults. I do get that they all have 'faults', but I'm specifically talking things like incorrect bites and hernias. I have a pup in a current litter (7 weeks old) that is a popular colour/gender - I could sell pups of this colour/gender ten times over. This pup has a hernia AND is overshot. I haven't actually allocated this pup to anyone at this stage (I generally don't allocate any pups until I have chosen for myself). I also have some pups of the opposite gender and less desirable colour (not less desirable in the standard, less desirable to the puppy buying public) - good bites and no hernias. The enquiries for these pups are pretty slow. Normally, I charge a puppy price smack bang on breed average, and I normally charge the same regardless of gender/colour. My question is, should I charge less for the 'desirable' colour/gender pup because of it's faults, even though I'm sure people will pay full price for this pup, purely because of the colour/gender? Ironically, looking around at the other pups currently available in the breed, I may need to lower my price on the lovely littermates. It just seems a little wrong to charge more for a 'faulty' puppy than for the lovely littermates! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted June 11, 2011 Share Posted June 11, 2011 No idea.. but I wouldn't be tempted to buy a pup like that .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebanne Posted June 11, 2011 Share Posted June 11, 2011 If the hernia is going to need repairing then yes I would lower the price to reflect that. Having had a dog with a hernia it certainly wouldn't stop me buying another. As for the mouth, again as long as there was no health problem, difficulty eating, and I only wanted a pet, yes I would buy it. Would I expect the pup to be cheaper? Only for hernia repair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fordogs Posted June 11, 2011 Share Posted June 11, 2011 In my new litter I also have a puppy with a fault He is big strong and very healthy otherwise BUT he does have a serious tail fault. I do not believe in giving a puppy away nor can I ask normal price. JMHO if something is given away does that mean it has no Value? In reality all I want for this puppy is a fantastic forever home, the real value is what matters, how do we work this out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo Baggins Posted June 11, 2011 Share Posted June 11, 2011 I have sold a pup with a heart murmur at 8 weeks of and still there at 10 weeks for $100. I believe anything for free is not valued.These people had had cavs with heart murmurs live to 16 so where not concerned. I gave away a pup who had to have major surgery to his chest as he had minimal diaphragm. He was free because I knew the people the husband was a work colleague. I also did not know his life expectancy. He lived 8 happy years and died of something unrelated. A hernia I would offer $100 dollars to cover the extra at desexing. A hernia is not life threatening, not hereditary its a natural defect in the body that fails to close. Humans have them all the time. An off bite difficult as it may correct. Maybe small reduction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angelsun Posted June 11, 2011 Share Posted June 11, 2011 No and I would get the hernia fixed prior to leaving for a new home. Bite is a non issue. naturally, full disclosure on these issues is given, but no discounts. If that starts, the flood gates open..discount for too big, too small, wrong/undesirable colour, undesirable gender? Where does it end, and it turns into a flea market mentality about haggling for the price of a pup that is registered, purebred and well thought out prior to its birth, cared for by a registered breeder....consider that the puppy mills are getting four times what we often sell purebreds for, for a mixed breed out of unhealth tested parents...and people PAY it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oakway Posted June 11, 2011 Share Posted June 11, 2011 No and I would get the hernia fixed prior to leaving for a new home. Bite is a non issue. naturally, full disclosure on these issues is given, but no discounts. If that starts, the flood gates open..discount for too big, too small, wrong/undesirable colour, undesirable gender? Where does it end, and it turns into a flea market mentality about haggling for the price of a pup that is registered, purebred and well thought out prior to its birth, cared for by a registered breeder....consider that the puppy mills are getting four times what we often sell purebreds for, for a mixed breed out of unhealth tested parents...and people PAY it! My thoughts to. When I do breed a litter I have two prices one for prospective show quality puppies on the main register and de sexed pet puppies on the limited register. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
becks Posted June 11, 2011 Share Posted June 11, 2011 If the hernia needs fixing, then i would have that done before pup goes, otherwise, small ones can be left without any problem. If the bite is causing problems then this needs pointing out to the potential buyer, if it isn't causing any problems, then I would charge as normal. Overshot mouth may come right with time anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mini girl Posted June 11, 2011 Share Posted June 11, 2011 If a small hernia was the only fault and going to a pet home I tell them that at desexing it can be fixed and if the cost is higher than a normal desexing I will happily pay the difference. I did have a lovely little girl who had a hernia and a bad mouth the bottom teeth over the top slightly -first one ever to have this so I let her go to a lovely home at half price - I hear back from the new owners all the time and she is happy and healthy - I also put this in writing to the new owners. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stolzseinrotts Posted June 11, 2011 Share Posted June 11, 2011 I agree with angelsun and oakway, there are two prices for pups, potential show quality on Main Register that people wish to show and those that are to be pet only that go on the Limited Register. A lot of the time the "pets" are of a qaulity to show but people just want a pet only and do not want to show so they leave here on the Limited Register. All pups in the litter are given the same amount of time and care, nutrition and medication etc. Some may go as potential show pups and most will go as pets only. An obvious hernia that requires surgery would be given a slight discount and or I would have it fixed prior to letting the pup go, but for fault such as an over shot mouth or some white (DQ faults in my breed) the price is all the same for a pet. Of course disclosure of the mouth would be given. Discounting qaulity purebred pups with pedigree papers and breeder support is IMHO selling our quality pups short and under mining the real worth of them due to the health checks and history that can be supplied, plus to mention the rearing of them, breeder care and support etc. If somebody ties to haggle a price for a puppy they are quickly taken off the list or told to not ring back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fordogs Posted June 12, 2011 Share Posted June 12, 2011 I do agree, all puppies are reared exactly the same but we are talking faults, hernias as far as I am concerned are minor faults, they can be fixed and most do not require any attention, most mouth problems will come ok given time, testicles CAN also come down also or not ~ but most pet owners don't care. All of these faults should be declared to new owners and sold for the normal price BUT I have a puppy that has a tail like a docked Rottie about 2 vertebrae, in a breed that should have a normal length tail ~ how do I price this puppy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oakway Posted June 12, 2011 Share Posted June 12, 2011 I agree with angelsun and oakway, there are two prices for pups, potential show quality on Main Register that people wish to show and those that are to be pet only that go on the Limited Register. A lot of the time the "pets" are of a qaulity to show but people just want a pet only and do not want to show so they leave here on the Limited Register. All pups in the litter are given the same amount of time and care, nutrition and medication etc. Some may go as potential show pups and most will go as pets only. An obvious hernia that requires surgery would be given a slight discount and or I would have it fixed prior to letting the pup go, but for fault such as an over shot mouth or some white (DQ faults in my breed) the price is all the same for a pet. Of course disclosure of the mouth would be given. Discounting qaulity purebred pups with pedigree papers and breeder support is IMHO selling our quality pups short and under mining the real worth of them due to the health checks and history that can be supplied, plus to mention the rearing of them, breeder care and support etc. If somebody ties to haggle a price for a puppy they are quickly taken off the list or told to not ring back. Yes totally agree that many pups that go to pet homes are of show quality but we are lacking show homes. We run them on but it comes to a time when you just keep them any longer and off they go to be de sexed pets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stolzseinrotts Posted June 12, 2011 Share Posted June 12, 2011 I do agree, all puppies are reared exactly the same but we are talking faults, hernias as far as I am concerned are minor faults, they can be fixed and most do not require any attention, most mouth problems will come ok given time, testicles CAN also come down also or not ~ but most pet owners don't care. All of these faults should be declared to new owners and sold for the normal price BUT I have a puppy that has a tail like a docked Rottie about 2 vertebrae, in a breed that should have a normal length tail ~ how do I price this puppy? I would price this puppy as I would any other pet. The puppy is a very unique puppy and still a pet. So why would you price it any less than any other pet in the litter. The fact it is a little bit different would make no difference to me, it will still play like a puppy and grow into a adult the only difference it will have a short tail. The way I see it, the fact it is different it will be a draw card for some people, it will always be a unique puppy by default but a puppy all the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WreckitWhippet Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 I've sold one pup with a delayed closure, that was repaired at the time of desexing and I discounted the price of the pup to reflect the additional costs at desexing. New owners were more than happy with this. As for bites, unless it's go grossly under or overshot, so as to impact on the dogs ability to eat, then it's full price Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lyla Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 (edited) I just had a litter with one pup having an undershot jaw, and another with its second testicle undescended. Obviously both things that may or may not correct themselves. I did not discount for these things, but advised the buyers on what the outcome would be if they did not correct themselves. Worst case scenario for pup 1, 2 teeth are pulled from the pup with the mouth issue at the time of desexing, so no extra surgery is required, pup 2 might need to have his bit found at time of desexing. Both parties rang their vets for verification, then were happy to proceed. Mind you, the pups had already been discounted $200 to compensate for the fact that they had a dreaded white spot on the chest (allowed but not desirable), and I was sick of people saying no thanks I want a pure one. Still the same quality of pup whether they had a few white hairs, they had great conformation, and parents with lovely temperaments. At the end of the day, some people are horrified by small issues that others find special. It all comes down to the individual. Little issues can touch heartstrings in some. Give a small discount for the hernia explaining why, then explain all the other good quality points from the lines. ETA: funny how a cosmetic issue has caused more drama than the health issues. Edited June 13, 2011 by Got nuthin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angelsun Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 Re: short tail. we had a pup from the last litter with a broken tail. Broken at birth or while in utero. We simply pointed out the tail to the new owner, and gave them a chance to refuse the pup. No discount was offered. The new owner never blinked and called his girl 'unique' and has never looked at the tail as a fault on any level. We as breeders, know a pups faults. Most pet owners could care less. If it doesn't impact the dogs life directly, they don't care. Pets are desexed anyway so no worries about passing anything along. As for discounting the hernia, no...I would get it fixed at my expense, end of subject. The only dog I gave to a home was one that had one eye because its mother was a jerk and tossed it around as a newborn and injured it. The pup is now about 10 years of age or something and never figured out it had only one eye. The owners don't care and tried to pay for the pup but I refused as at the time, I didn't know if there would be surgery involved and was not prepared to make them have that expense as well as it was a to die for home. This was not just a fault from the standard, this was a physical deformity....one that could have directly impacted the dogs longevity. (it hasn't) I've had dogs with mismarks (white flashes on the chest) and dogs missing some toes...(they could walk, run, move etc) it never occured to me to offer a discount in these cases, nor would I now with many more litters and years under my belt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fordogs Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 Thank you, I may not have started this topic BUT I have certainly learned a great deal. Every puppy we rear is worthy of a great home and just because of the things that we as breeders consider a fault does NOT devalue the puppy, mouths can correct, ears can go up, testicles can come down, sadly tails cannot grow but at the end of the day it is NOT life threatening and potential puppy buyer can always say NO and walk away. The major thing for each puppy is that we place them in the BEST possible home and it is not about the money. The only puppy that I have sold with a fault (as far as I know ) was a boy that I knew had only 1 testicle declared and it later became 2 testicles BUT he only ended up with 1 ear up, Go figure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
experiencedfun Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 (edited) My puppies have always been priced pets (limited register) a pet price and show quality (main register). I have never charged a different rate for different colours, that seems to lead to breeding for colour over type and is exactly what the puppy farmers do. If it is something that wont affect quality of life as in the bite I would make no exceptions but the hernia as others have said can be repaired at time of desexing which would of course be mandatory for a pet puppy, so I would offer to refund the difference of the desexing operation on production of the vet bill, and even advise to use my vet. ooops just re-read original post....re: colour ignore that bit Edited June 14, 2011 by experiencedfun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leema Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 I would sell the pup at full price, and offer a $100-200 refund on production of a receipt saying the hernia had to be surgically repaired. Pet people don't care about mouths. I wouldn't offer a discount for a mouth fault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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