Prydenjoy Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 Thank you for the information Toy Dog. I had a brief look at your web page and you have some excellent information on puppy farmers. It's a sad world we live in that we have to be so very cautious about what evil deeds people may use our beloved puppy's for. So many people don't see the problem with breeding dogs, and even those you aren't farmers would potentially decide to have "just one litter" from their pet. Desexing before sale is a good way to avoid that, but then how do you ensure adequate socialisation and early training etc? There is so much for a young pup to learn when it goes to its new home, and with the critical socialisation period lasting up until 16 to 18 weeks it's so very important for puppies to learn to be resilient to new experiences in this time. Do you have a socialisation program that you use with your puppies? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tommygirl Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 I hate it when you get an enquiry & the person seems really great & very keen, & says all the right things & you talk on the ph to them for over an hour, make a date & time for them to visit to see the pups...you wait for hours for them to come & they don't end up showing up. This happened to me on Sunday...the person was supposed to come at 2.00pm...I waited till 4.00pm & they still hadn't turned up. I then rang them up to see what was going & I'm then told that they had changed their mind about getting an Aussie terrier puppy & had decided on a JRT instead...I then say that it would have been nice if they had of phoned me to tell me this, so I wouldn't be wasting my time waiting for them, & all she can say is 'Oh sorry, I meant to ring you, but didn't get round to it" Some people are just so inconsiderate, as if I have time to wait for someone that has no intention of showing up all day. Agreed. I really dislike time wasters in general. Our last litter, I had this guy hassle me out about getting a pup, ringing me at least once a week (sometimes a few times a week) to double check he was for sure still getting one, at the start when he enquired he was offering me more money than the asking price to gaurantee himself a pup (which I told him was not necessary at all), then organised to come and pick one after they got their hearing tested- day and time organised, then never rocked up. I rang and text'd that day saying whats going on etc...then I got this txt message saying, he couldnt get a pup, his grandmother in Italy was sick and he had been over there so now had no money...the space of time between last contact and this message was 3 days, found it very hard to believe he had been to Italy and back in this amount of time...and for someone who was calling me flat out why text it, not just pick up the phone like he had been doing for the past 2 months? Very odd. Glad he didnt get a pup now! People whinge about breeders replying to emails etc, but I tell you I get sick of people who waste your time, so its easy for me to understand why breeders dont reply to emails they dont get a good feel for. I have found a lot of people who email are time wasters, and I like to get a feel for potential homes and prefer to talk to enquiries- so my puppy adds always say very clearly- do not email, please phone only, emails will not be answered...but people still email? So for me, time wasters do my head in! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prydenjoy Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 Very cute dogs you have tommygirl I can say it works both ways unfortunately, with breeders promising pups and then deciding to sell them to someone else at the last minute after emailing photos etc, which is very disheartening when you have your mind set on a pup. Do any of you take deposits on pups? Why/why not? Sorry if it's a little off topic, but I think it's relevant to what has been said Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paptacular! Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 (edited) I took deposits on my pups, one at 6 weeks (puppy was flown to his new mum at 9 weeks), and the other a week or so before he was picked up at 14 weeks. ETA - I never planned to take deposits before birth purely because having a small breed means less pups, more possible refunds of deposits given and disappointing more people who thought they were entitled! Edited May 19, 2011 by Paptacular! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toy dog Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 (edited) Thank you for the information Toy Dog. I had a brief look at your web page and you have some excellent information on puppy farmers. It's a sad world we live in that we have to be so very cautious about what evil deeds people may use our beloved puppy's for. So many people don't see the problem with breeding dogs, and even those you aren't farmers would potentially decide to have "just one litter" from their pet. Desexing before sale is a good way to avoid that, but then how do you ensure adequate socialisation and early training etc? There is so much for a young pup to learn when it goes to its new home, and with the critical socialisation period lasting up until 16 to 18 weeks it's so very important for puppies to learn to be resilient to new experiences in this time. Do you have a socialisation program that you use with your puppies? actually the socialisation period is about 6 - 13 weeks that they are impressionable. we only breed when we need new showdogs and mostly our little dogs only have about 3 pups in a litter and sometimes even just one. so its very easy for us to socialise ourselves and often we sell at about 6 months and they are fully trained and socialised by that time. i do know of alot of other chi breeders who are the same. and also in other toy breeds too. our socialisation program for show or just a general allround pet involves getting the pups use to people as well as alot of dogs around. So we take them down busy streets and train from about 8 weeks and get as many people as possible coming up and patting. then we take them to shows, i am near the dog complex here so quite easy for me to do that every weekend if i want. ETA: in our breed you can have a confident dog that shows itself with little training and some breeders do rely on this aspect while others like us, rely more on conditioning the puppy/dog for the showring. i prefer the other way rather than just relying on their temp. it does also depend deeply on their genetics as to how they handle the socialisation as well i.e. come from a long line of timid dogs or confident dogs. been there done that a million times. Edited May 19, 2011 by toy dog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prydenjoy Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 Thanks toy dog. I'm trying to decide what I'll do when the time comes, whether I'll desex the pups before selling them, or just to carefully screen new homes etc. That's given me a lot to think about Of course, Paps are like Chi's, only having a few pups per litter, so I should only ever have to worry about finding up to two or three homes at a time. I'm a dog trainer, so am all for conditioning pups to the show ring, or family home alike ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toy dog Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 (edited) Thanks toy dog. I'm trying to decide what I'll do when the time comes, whether I'll desex the pups before selling them, or just to carefully screen new homes etc. That's given me a lot to think about Of course, Paps are like Chi's, only having a few pups per litter, so I should only ever have to worry about finding up to two or three homes at a time. I'm a dog trainer, so am all for conditioning pups to the show ring, or family home alike ;) oh ok, i found i worried alot if they weren't desexed but then again i always worry alot when they first go into their new homes. we found having a good open communication with buyers and letting them come and view the dogs/pups several times before buying often helps with the communication so you know that they are in a good home no need to worry. did have one lady i sold an older male dog to (3 yr old) that i could no longer show due to a major fault and contacted her 5 months after and she promptly told me to leave her alone don't bug her all the time!!! so rude some people. i spoke to others and asked them what they do and most said they wait until the buyer contacts them some did say they contact the buyer ever so often to see that the dogs are okay thats what i was doing. its not as if i was contacting this lady every week or anything, she was a bit of a nutter anyway, i did everything for her, i drove the dog out to her she didn't have a car, he was considerably alot less than what i normally charge and the list goes on what i did for her and her son. do i get a thanks, nope i get a P**SS off instead! some people i don't know. Edited May 19, 2011 by toy dog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prydenjoy Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 Wow, that is very rude. I find I always contact my dogs breeders time and again just to let them know how the dogs are going. I know I would want the same consideration shown to me with any pups I sold! And no, I wouldn't consider it bugging if someone passed something they loved and cared for to me and followed up with a phone call to see how it was going.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toy dog Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 Wow, that is very rude. I find I always contact my dogs breeders time and again just to let them know how the dogs are going. I know I would want the same consideration shown to me with any pups I sold! And no, I wouldn't consider it bugging if someone passed something they loved and cared for to me and followed up with a phone call to see how it was going.... yeah i know wasn't it. i actually invited this lady along to a get together involving chihuahuas and she also threw that back in my face as well. i contacted her to tell her that the grandmother of the dog in question had died thought i'd kill 2 birds with one stone and ask how the boy was doing. big mistake. i welcome people asking me questions and they don't have to buy a dog from me to get any answers either. i have made quite a few friends this way online over the years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prydenjoy Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 i welcome people asking me questions and they don't have to buy a dog from me to get any answers either. i have made quite a few friends this way online over the years. :thumbsup: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tommygirl Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 Very cute dogs you have tommygirl I can say it works both ways unfortunately, with breeders promising pups and then deciding to sell them to someone else at the last minute after emailing photos etc, which is very disheartening when you have your mind set on a pup Do any of you take deposits on pups? Why/why not? Sorry if it's a little off topic, but I think it's relevant to what has been said I personally don't take deposits until after pups get their BAER testing done, which is 6 weeks, and they have had vet check etc done. I dont let people put a name on a pup before this point as If there was anything wrong I would hate to have taken someones money and had their hopes up only to tell them there was a health issue...haven't had it happen but it's a 'just in case'. I don't ask for them but if a buyer wants to leave one I would take it and give them then their choice of pup (after me of course!) At least from that point you know they are serious... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lyla Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 I take deposits at about 2 weeks old when I have had people waiting on a litter.(I never take deposits before birth, as you never know when something wont pan out) Mostly, it just weeds out the timewasters. I also state on my website that the deposit is non-refundable, which basically stops people from stuffing me around, but if there is a genuine reason for someone deciding to not take the puppy, I do actually refund the deposit. It takes a lot of effort to give pictures and updates to people who aren't going to follow through when you factor in that you still have kids, other dogs and a household to take care of. As an aside to the deposits, I am happy to provide lengthy, informative emails to anyone who happens to email me. I don't mind if they are not specifically interested in one of my pups, just as long as they don't pretend they are just to get info. I'm happy to help, I'm just sick of B.S. artists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prydenjoy Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 GN, I like your thinking! I'm assuming the deposit is something small, just enough to "weed out the timewasters". And if they're getting regular updates etc then it is money well spent (plus it would be taken off the price of a pup?). This thread has been very helpful to me, thanks all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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