megan_ Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 I suspect they only tested the more common breeds - hence the malinois, kelpie, etc missing out.I agree with Koalathebear, I have heard people define intelligence in such a way that all dog breeds appear to be equally intelligent. I don't think this makes much sense. To me, intelligence is how quickly a dog can learn a new task to achieve a goal, or maybe how complex a problem a dog can solve to achieve a goal. This is how I define intelligence-the ability to problem solve. Give a dog some free shaping tasks and puzzles to help determine intelligence. I don't think training via luring and compulsion are good measures of intelligence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trojka Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 I suspect they only tested the more common breeds - hence the malinois, kelpie, etc missing out.I agree with Koalathebear, I have heard people define intelligence in such a way that all dog breeds appear to be equally intelligent. I don't think this makes much sense. To me, intelligence is how quickly a dog can learn a new task to achieve a goal, or maybe how complex a problem a dog can solve to achieve a goal. I agree with this. I used to have a book on dog intelligence (I think it was just called "The intelligence of dogs"), it was in German, but I'm not sure where it was from and unfortunately can't remember the author. There was a very similar list in there, but more importantly, it contained an "iq test" for dogs that really made a lot of sense and didn't seem to test for trainability, but problem solving skills (from memory). I wish I still had that book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perry's Mum Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 When it comes to problem solving skills it is hard to go past a koolie. My last rescue worked out how to remove the lock from her crate in less than 5 minutes and open the door and come and find me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabbath Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 This list is usually tempered with; Brightest Dogs Understanding of New Commands: Fewer than 5 repetitions. Obey First Command: 95% of the time or better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabbath Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Intelligence_of_Dogs As seen here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirty Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 No Greyhounds? LOL! My BC x is the smartest dog I've known, but my Lab x is a cunning bastard. My Pia has the dumb... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pixie_meg Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 Borzois are apparently 75th out of 79. apparently requiring 80+ repetitions. I agree that oeying commands is low for my borzoi but understanding the commands is high. he learns commands quickly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monah Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 We don't really know how to measure intelligence in humans. I think we're a long way off defining and measuring intelligence in dogs.I like dogs that can solve problems and pick up on stuff that we don't necessarily have to teach them. that just put my spinone at the top of the list My viz is the easiest and quickest (to do commands) that I have ever had. My nephew had a cattle dog who knew hundreds of words and had a great career as an actor.. I dont like 'lists' and believe most dogs of all breeds are 'intelligent' especially if they are heavily involved with their family or humans in some way (as we measure intelligence by what they understand in a human way). I've even found this with sheep! We've had many pet sheep and they've been treated the same as the dogs, even gone in the car etc. and I've found them extremely clever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poodlefan Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 Malinois?Seriously? Why is it missing. Flawed list is flawed. Have to agree - if there's one breed missing it's the Malinois Probably came in at No. 2 but the poodle refused to share billing with it. Maybe the list should be retitled. "Dogs most likely to cooperate with human demands". Anyone with hounds knows they ain't dumb. But you sure recognise that moment in training when they run up the "this isn't fun any more" flag. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henrietta Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 (edited) My staffy x is a wonderfully 'easy' dog to train. Very compliant and a great work ethic, will work for everything from a game of tug to a cuddle. And always in that happy mindset that lends itself well to fun. But I wouldn't describe her as a good problem solver or a 'quick learner'. My Chi x is 'clever' and her favourite games involve shaping and finding things. But I am often left looking like the dumbo when she has decided that some particular training endeavour is not on her agenda right now. It doesn't help that I'm not the best trainer in the world, but we are making progress! The difference between the two learning styles is remarkable. (Edit - and my approaches to training) Edited April 11, 2011 by Henrietta Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lovemesideways Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 I used to agree with lists like this...... and then I met dogs like Zero whos owned by Shell, and Jedi and Ashoka, Terraniks dogs. They make my labs look thick as! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aussielover Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 I think they mean easiest to train.... Which I pretty much agree with. The dogs listed are the more popular breeds that are commonly trained by people to do amazing things. When people say they want a smart dog, very few actually mean they want an intelligent dog that can problem solve and think for itself. Most people mean they want a dog that is easy to train. I've seen some disasters when novice owners actually do end up with a "smart" dog! Although I agree that terriers and spitzes are extremely smart, they require an understanding training approach in general. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
huga Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 Pfffft, whatever. I know my dogs aren't the sharpest tools in the shed, but that make up for it in looks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leelaa17 Posted April 11, 2011 Author Share Posted April 11, 2011 my older GSD male Max is extremely stubborn - if I ask him to sit before I give him a pat on the head or before he can come inside he looks at me in a 'I don't think I need to sit right now, I'll sit when I want' look. He is EXTREMELY smart though. He learns things extremely quickly and ALWAYS gives people eye contact (which I think is cute). One thing he does that I love (we're still in training but hes very good with stay) is I ask him to stay at the back door when its open and I will go away and do something - when I eventually come back he is still waiting there. hes such a good boy and jenna - shes unbelievable. She learnt 'drop' after one go of showing her what to do - I couldnt believe it. Now she will do it all the time - shes extremely quick at learning but, again, also EXTREMELY stubborn - when we ask her to get out of the kitchen she goes out and then walks straight back in again - she doesnt seem to get the point. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aidan3 Posted April 12, 2011 Share Posted April 12, 2011 Malinois?Seriously? Why is it missing. Flawed list is flawed. Have to agree - if there's one breed missing it's the Malinois Probably came in at No. 2 but the poodle refused to share billing with it. Actually, my recollection is that they came in at ... number 78! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aidan3 Posted April 12, 2011 Share Posted April 12, 2011 We don't really know how to measure intelligence in humans. I think we're a long way off defining and measuring intelligence in dogs.I like dogs that can solve problems and pick up on stuff that we don't necessarily have to teach them. that just put my spinone at the top of the list Yes, I could believe that! I like most gundogs for that reason, and obviously herding dogs also have that in spades. It depends a lot on the sorts of tasks we give them or the sorts of behaviours we value the most. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benshiva Posted April 12, 2011 Share Posted April 12, 2011 Now THIS is the smartest dog in the world Lists be damned Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mita Posted April 12, 2011 Share Posted April 12, 2011 (edited) Maybe the list should be retitled. "Dogs most likely to cooperate with human demands". Agree entirely. Having owned a breed that's on the list, border collies, I couldn't agree more about their superb level of trainability. A lovely breed. But now I own a breed that is more self-referencing... tibbies. Their quality of 'intelligence' is quite different. The tibs continually appear to be running the context throught their heads...'And the point of all this is?'. If something has a point for them, OK then fine. And they'll never forget it. I've found this makes them superb alert dogs. They really can figure out from context what's going on & act accordingly. They have a list in their heads of OK visitors....even if the person hasn't been here for months. And they're super right when it's someone up to no good. So I can trust these little dogs' 'judgement'. I've found I have to train/manage tibs in a totally different way to the border collies. Which is fine, because we have different expectations/demands. Edited April 12, 2011 by mita Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W Sibs Posted April 12, 2011 Share Posted April 12, 2011 I don't agree with that list. They don't have Jap Spitz on the list... Emmy is really smart. Only have to teach her something once and she gets it. But, she's not easy to train due to no attention span... but once I've figure out how to get her attention, she is really amazing to work with. She works her fluffy bum off for you.. even if it's for 3 minutes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkySoaringMagpie Posted April 12, 2011 Share Posted April 12, 2011 There is a lot of variety within a breed as well. I have a boy, who is to put it kindly, a bit dim. He's rat cunning when he has sufficient incentive (girls in season) and he's much easier to train at all other times. The girls are very smart, but not all that biddable. Also, intelligence is over-rated in a canine companion, particularly for your average pet owner. I can admire a smart well trained border collie or GSD but I would never want to live with one. And to be honest, I don't think they do well with your average idiot either. Special dogs require special people, which is something those searching for a quick brag or ego-boost often forget. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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