Shepherd 08 Posted April 6, 2011 Share Posted April 6, 2011 Right or wrong, if some idiot got up in my face like that, he would've copped a smack to the head at the least. Off leash dog - overreaction - yelling - overreaction - smack to the head. Are you for real? Well, depends on the situation. If he gave me the impression he would become violent, absolutely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shepherd 08 Posted April 6, 2011 Share Posted April 6, 2011 Right or wrong, if some idiot got up in my face like that, he would've copped a smack to the head at the least. Off leash dog - overreaction - yelling - overreaction - smack to the head. Are you for real? I have only got this far but I agree with hotfurball. Are you seriously for real? So I am walking my extremely dog agressive, oversize, very fit Sibe on lead, who incidently was attacked by an off lead terrier as a puppy and you approach me with your elderly Rotti off lead :p My dog feels threatened and snaps at your dog. Thankfully your dog because of his size only requires 23 stitches, abs and a few drains, thankfully it wasn't a swf. Then you recieve the five hundred buck bill for his treatment, you're the sort of person who doesn't follow rules so god knows you aren't taking ANY responsibility for that bill. You report my dog to the council. What then? Or I am walking my extremely dog agressive, oversize, very fit Sibe on lead, who incidently was attacked by an off lead terrier as a puppy and you approach me with your elderly Rotti off lead I start sceaming at you to keep your dog away from mine because I sure as hell never want my dog laying a tooth on yours or any other. You smack me in the head for sceaming at you, my Sibe who is extremely protective of 'her' family lunges at you. I am still recovering from being hit but luckily she isn't human agressive so only glances your arm with her teeth. What then? But of course what actually happens is I cross over to the other side of the road because I will protect my dogs at all costs but ............. why the hell should I have to, I aren't the one breaking the law, you are. Was that little rant directed at me? I am confused. If you are asking me "am I for real?" then yes, I am. You come up to me aggressively within striking distance - regardless of whether you have a right to be angry or not - and IF I perceive that as a threat, then yes, I will defend myself if I feel it's appropriate. Let's not get off topic though, hey? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hortfurball Posted April 6, 2011 Share Posted April 6, 2011 Was that little rant directed at me? I am confused. If you are asking me "am I for real?" then yes, I am. You come up to me aggressively within striking distance - regardless of whether you have a right to be angry or not - and IF I perceive that as a threat, then yes, I will defend myself if I feel it's appropriate. Let's not get off topic though, hey? Ummm, that argument only works if you are not the first to give a 'smack to the head', otherwise I hate to tell you this, but you are the antagonist, yelling or no yelling, which was kinda my point when I asked "Are you for real?" Escalating to physical violence just because someone yells at you is NOT ok. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaxx'sBuddy Posted April 7, 2011 Share Posted April 7, 2011 Was that little rant directed at me? I am confused. If you are asking me "am I for real?" then yes, I am. You come up to me aggressively within striking distance - regardless of whether you have a right to be angry or not - and IF I perceive that as a threat, then yes, I will defend myself if I feel it's appropriate. Let's not get off topic though, hey? You seem very aggressive and very quick to "defend" yourself. So what would your dog be doing as you beat someone off? Would your dog join in on the attack? Talk about making a situation worse than it needs to be...what happened to walking away and calling the appropriate authorities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shepherd 08 Posted April 7, 2011 Share Posted April 7, 2011 Was that little rant directed at me? I am confused. If you are asking me "am I for real?" then yes, I am. You come up to me aggressively within striking distance - regardless of whether you have a right to be angry or not - and IF I perceive that as a threat, then yes, I will defend myself if I feel it's appropriate. Let's not get off topic though, hey? Ummm, that argument only works if you are not the first to give a 'smack to the head', otherwise I hate to tell you this, but you are the antagonist, yelling or no yelling, which was kinda my point when I asked "Are you for real?" Escalating to physical violence just because someone yells at you is NOT ok. Look, I really don't want this thread to go off on a whole new tangent, but... If someone comes up to you and you have a genuine fear they will assault you, then you have every right to strike first in self-defence. You do not have to wait for someone to hit you first. Also, don't get confused with someone simply yelling abuse and someone coming right up into your face in an aggressive stance/posture and yelling abuse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poodlefan Posted April 7, 2011 Share Posted April 7, 2011 Was that little rant directed at me? I am confused. If you are asking me "am I for real?" then yes, I am. You come up to me aggressively within striking distance - regardless of whether you have a right to be angry or not - and IF I perceive that as a threat, then yes, I will defend myself if I feel it's appropriate. Let's not get off topic though, hey? Ummm, that argument only works if you are not the first to give a 'smack to the head', otherwise I hate to tell you this, but you are the antagonist, yelling or no yelling, which was kinda my point when I asked "Are you for real?" Escalating to physical violence just because someone yells at you is NOT ok. Look, I really don't want this thread to go off on a whole new tangent, but... If someone comes up to you and you have a genuine fear they will assault you, then you have every right to strike first in self-defence. You do not have to wait for someone to hit you first. Also, don't get confused with someone simply yelling abuse and someone coming right up into your face in an aggressive stance/posture and yelling abuse. Actually you don't. If leaving, or some other non-violent method of avoiding conflict is available, lawfully you are required to do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shepherd 08 Posted April 7, 2011 Share Posted April 7, 2011 Was that little rant directed at me? I am confused. If you are asking me "am I for real?" then yes, I am. You come up to me aggressively within striking distance - regardless of whether you have a right to be angry or not - and IF I perceive that as a threat, then yes, I will defend myself if I feel it's appropriate. Let's not get off topic though, hey? You seem very aggressive and very quick to "defend" yourself. So what would your dog be doing as you beat someone off? Would your dog join in on the attack? Talk about making a situation worse than it needs to be...what happened to walking away and calling the appropriate authorities. I seem very aggressive? And you're basing that off a single post? No, I'm not an aggressive person at all, in fact, if we ever met you'd see that I am a very pleasant person. "So what would your dog doing as you beat someone off?" Sorry, I realise that was probably unintentionally funny, but thanks for the laugh. I don't beat people off though lol. You seem to be misunderstanding the point I was making, which was this (repeating myself here). If someone approaches me in an aggressive manner and if I perceive that as a threat to my safety, then I will defend myself and the law tells me I have every right to. Would my dog join in the attack? Firstly, defending myself is not an attack and secondly, my dog would probably run away or try to hump something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shepherd 08 Posted April 7, 2011 Share Posted April 7, 2011 (edited) Was that little rant directed at me? I am confused. If you are asking me "am I for real?" then yes, I am. You come up to me aggressively within striking distance - regardless of whether you have a right to be angry or not - and IF I perceive that as a threat, then yes, I will defend myself if I feel it's appropriate. Let's not get off topic though, hey? Ummm, that argument only works if you are not the first to give a 'smack to the head', otherwise I hate to tell you this, but you are the antagonist, yelling or no yelling, which was kinda my point when I asked "Are you for real?" Escalating to physical violence just because someone yells at you is NOT ok. Look, I really don't want this thread to go off on a whole new tangent, but... If someone comes up to you and you have a genuine fear they will assault you, then you have every right to strike first in self-defence. You do not have to wait for someone to hit you first. Also, don't get confused with someone simply yelling abuse and someone coming right up into your face in an aggressive stance/posture and yelling abuse. Actually you don't. If leaving, or some other non-violent method of avoiding conflict is available, lawfully you are required to do that. Wrong. In the situation I'm talking about, I'd be well within my rights to defend myself. I have real life experience in this kind of situation. Edited April 7, 2011 by Shepherd 08 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poodlefan Posted April 7, 2011 Share Posted April 7, 2011 (edited) Wrong. And your proof is... ? Clocking someone for calling you a knob and telling your to put your effing dog on lead is going to be a hard argue as "self defence". And yes, I have read the Crimes Acts a few times. So Shepherd, this person yells those things at you.. at what point do you decide that a person standing within a two metre range calling your dog ownershp into question constitutes a "reasonable threat" to your safety. And at what point do you decide that clocking them is a "reasonable response" to that abuse? Edited April 7, 2011 by poodlefan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shepherd 08 Posted April 7, 2011 Share Posted April 7, 2011 Wrong. And your proof is... ? Quite a number of years charging people with various assaults. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~Anne~ Posted April 7, 2011 Share Posted April 7, 2011 Wrong. And your proof is... ? Quite a number of years charging people with various assaults. Poppycock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poodlefan Posted April 7, 2011 Share Posted April 7, 2011 (edited) Wrong. And your proof is... ? Quite a number of years charging people with various assaults. I'm not talking about charging. I'm talking about defending using the "sefl defence" defence. What happens to others doesn't alter the particular circumstances of this event unless its going to your state of mind. I'm talking about you justifying as "reasonable" physically assaulting someone calling you a useless pr*ck of a dog owner. Where's the threat? And under the circumstances, haven't you received training in non-violent conflict resolution? And haven't you had use of force training? Edited April 7, 2011 by poodlefan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leelaa17 Posted April 7, 2011 Share Posted April 7, 2011 Wrong. And your proof is... ? Quite a number of years charging people with various assaults. Poppycock. LOL!!!!!!! Im sorry but I love that response!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaxx'sBuddy Posted April 7, 2011 Share Posted April 7, 2011 Wrong. And your proof is... ? Quite a number of years charging people with various assaults. Rubbish, you are wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shepherd 08 Posted April 7, 2011 Share Posted April 7, 2011 Wrong. And your proof is... ? Quite a number of years charging people with various assaults. Rubbish, you are wrong. No champ, I'm not. How many assaults have you investigated and taken to court? Tell me how you'd prove beyond a reasonable doubt that in a one on one incident with no witnesses that it wasn't a case of self defence? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poodlefan Posted April 7, 2011 Share Posted April 7, 2011 (edited) No champ, I'm not. How many assaults have you investigated and taken to court? Tell me how you'd prove beyond a reasonable doubt that in a one on one incident with no witnesses that it wasn't a case of self defence? By cross examining you. I'd be looking to prove that as a use of force trained police officer with training in non-violent conflict resolution that when yelled at by an old guy than you reacted in anger rather than fear for your safety. I'd rate my chances. Edited April 7, 2011 by poodlefan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raz Posted April 7, 2011 Share Posted April 7, 2011 No champ, I'm not. How many assaults have you investigated and taken to court? Tell me how you'd prove beyond a reasonable doubt that in a one on one incident with no witnesses that it wasn't a case of self defence? I guess you could just call it dog walking rage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shepherd 08 Posted April 7, 2011 Share Posted April 7, 2011 Wrong. And your proof is... ? Quite a number of years charging people with various assaults. I'm not talking about charging. I'm talking about defending using the "sefl defence" defence. What happens to others doesn't alter the particular circumstances of this event unless its going to your state of mind. I'm talking about you justifying as "reasonable" physically assaulting someone calling you a useless pr*ck of a dog owner. Where's the threat? And under the circumstances, haven't you received training in non-violent conflict resolution? And haven't you had use of force training? I need to get used to the tone of this forum as I'm used to making fairly facetious remarks (like my original comment on this thread) on various forums without people taking it too seriously. To clarify, I would not hit someone simply for verbally abusing me (as described in the first remark). That was a flippant remark. My following comments in this thread relate to a situation in which I would consider defending myself. Again (I can't believe I have to repeat this again): If someone approaches me in an aggressive way and I genuinely fear he will assault me, I can defend myself. I'm no longer talking about the situation described in the OP - let's be clear about that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaxx'sBuddy Posted April 7, 2011 Share Posted April 7, 2011 No champ, I'm not. How many assaults have you investigated and taken to court? Tell me how you'd prove beyond a reasonable doubt that in a one on one incident with no witnesses that it wasn't a case of self defence? By cross examining you. I'd be looking to prove that as a use of force trained police officer with training in non-violent conflict resolution that when yelled at by an old guy than you reacted in anger rather than fear for your safety. I'd rate my chances. x2. Given the circumstances where a person has the ability to leave a scene but chooses to assault a person instead they would never be able to use self defense as a reason that has indeed been the case in the past in several cases Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raz Posted April 7, 2011 Share Posted April 7, 2011 I need to get used to the tone of this forum as I'm used to making fairly facetious remarks (like my original comment on this thread) on various forums without people taking it too seriously. That's interesting because you were given the chance to clarify earlier and you said this Was that little rant directed at me? I am confused. If you are asking me "am I for real?" then yes, I am. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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