Klee Kai In Aus

[shortstep]

Ah don't mind me, I must have mis understood something I'd read/

I thought the Klee Kai had to be AKC recognised to be recognised here

(where's the hit over head emoticon when I need it )

It is recognized here already, in the UKC registry.

ANKC is not the only registry in the world.

Dogs are not only recognized in ANKC.

[poodlefan]

Ah don't mind me, I must have mis understood something I'd read/

I thought the Klee Kai had to be AKC recognised to be recognised here

(where's the hit over head emoticon when I need it )

It is recognized here already, in the UKC registry.

ANKC is not the only registry in the world.

Dogs are not only recognized in ANKC.

Now I suppose we have to talk about what does it mean to be "recognised".

You won't be showing or getting ANKC papers for a Klee Kai in this country until the ANKC recognises the breed. For a dog of US origin, that means that the Registry the ANKC recognises as the American purebred register (the AKC) does.

Same deal for Silken Windhounds. They are recognised by some FCI countries but until the AKC does, they won't be shown here.

Edited March 30, 2011 by poodlefan

[raz]

Ah don't mind me, I must have mis understood something I'd read/

I thought the Klee Kai had to be AKC recognised to be recognised here

(where's the hit over head emoticon when I need it )

It does.

How is that, Poodie? Dogs get recognised as breeds without the say so from the country of origin. Disclaimer - is this woman even going for ANKC recognition - I didnt read the whole article

Edited March 30, 2011 by raz

[Sheridan]

I am merely enquiring about her use of the term miniature husky and whether she does health tests.

Surely, most people would agree with the importance of health testing in breeding dogs?

Are these dogs like the mimi aussie shepherd or north american shepherd in terms of recognition as a breed?

I think the use of the term miniature husky is simply descriptive.

Are you like this with every breed not recognised by the ANKC? Must be a lot of breeds you get up in arms about, if so.

[poodlefan]

Ah don't mind me, I must have mis understood something I'd read/

I thought the Klee Kai had to be AKC recognised to be recognised here

(where's the hit over head emoticon when I need it )

It does.

How is that, Poodie? Dogs get recognised as breeds without the say so from the country of origin. Disclaimer - is this woman even going for ANKC regodnition - I didnt read the whole article

See explanatory post above.

The dog must be recognised by the Registry the ANKC considers to be the registry in the country of origin.

This is starting to sound like something out of Monty Python or Yes Minister

[raz]

The dog must be recognised by the Registry the ANKC considers to be the registry in the country of origin.

But it's not recognised by the AKC so what is to stop her standardising the breed here? It's certainly happened before - BC and JRT come to mind. 2 breeds developed in Australia without the consent of the country of origin.

[RallyValley]

You don't need AKC recognition to get ANKC recignition - we recognise Large Munsterlander's as a registered breed here, they are a FCI and KC(UK) registered breed but not an AKC registered breed.

However the point people are making is that the country of orgin is the USA and until AKC or FCI accept a breed standard unless this woman wants to put in the hard yards and develop the breed here (just ask the Tenterfield Terrier people how easy it is to develop a recognised breed - not) the dogs will not likely get AKC papers in thier lifetime.

I must do some more reasearch on the UKC - to me they seem to have some pretty out there idea's - such as splitting up breeds with two types into different breeds, ect.

[poodlefan]

The dog must be recognised by the Registry the ANKC considers to be the registry in the country of origin.

But it's not recognised by the AKC so what is to stop her standardising the breed here? It's certainly happened before - BC and JRT come to mind. 2 breeds developed in Australia without the consent of the country of origin.

She'd then need to apply for "new breed" recognition. Then you get the five generations of breeding, establishment of a standard etc etc. Australia would then be the country of origin.

[poodlefan]

You don't need AKC recognition to get ANKC recignition - we recognise Large Munsterlander's as a registered breed here, they are a FCI and KC(UK) registered breed but not an AKC registered breed.

The Large Munsterlander's country of origin isn't the USA. We'd recognise the breed because the Registry in its country of origin (Germany?) does.

For any USA developed breed, AKC recognition is mandatory for ANKC recognition.

[shortstep]

Ah don't mind me, I must have mis understood something I'd read/

I thought the Klee Kai had to be AKC recognised to be recognised here

(where's the hit over head emoticon when I need it )

It is recognized here already, in the UKC registry.

ANKC is not the only registry in the world.

Dogs are not only recognized in ANKC.

Now I suppose we have to talk about what does it mean to be "recognised".

You won't be showing or getting ANKC papers for a Klee Kai in this country until the ANKC recognises the breed. For a dog of US origin, that means that the Registry the ANKC recognises as the American purebred register (the AKC) does.

Same deal for Silken Windhounds. They are recognised by some FCI countries but until the AKC does, they won't be shown here.

Yes but being recognised does not only mean a dog can be shown or for that matter can be shown in ANKC.

Some recognizing registries have no dog shows at all, such as WKC.

So here is a dog breed recognized in Australlia, by it's founding registry, there are no dog shows, and it certainly is a recognizing registry and is accepted around the world for export.

Edited to add, to the vast majority of dog owners in the world, showing dogs is not on their list of things they want to do with their dog nor is something they will consider when choosing their dog.

Edited March 30, 2011 by shortstep

[poodlefan]

For anyone interested in reading this for themselves rather than reading Poodlefanspeak:

Part 6 "The Register and Registration" of ANKC regulations addresses breed recognition. You can download that from the website and the relevant section of that document is Section 10.

Link to ANKC regulations here.

Recognition of overseas breeds and new breeds is covered. Section 10.3 has a stinger.

Edited March 30, 2011 by poodlefan

[raz]

We'd recognise the breed because the Registry in its country of origin (Germany?) does.

Yeah so what about the Border Collie and the JRT? They werent recognised in the country of origin before the rest of the world took up the Australian Standard.

[poodlefan]

We'd recognise the breed because the Registry in its country of origin (Germany?) does.

Yeah so what about the Border Collie and the JRT? They werent recognised in the country of origin before the rest of the world took up the Australian Standard.

Then they must have been recognised here as a "new breed".

[cassie]

I don't breed.

Should I not have an opinion then?

No you can certainly have an opinion and in fact we can see that you do.

So how much did you pay for your Berner and Saint?

We can work out a real cost comparison.

Price x yrs life of dog x vet bills x food.

Might be her little dog is a real bargin.

I left the thread earlier so missed this. To answer your question, I paid $1200 for my Berner and $1500 for my Saint (who I no longer own, besides the point.) I don't select my breeds based on bargains.

[shortstep]

We'd recognise the breed because the Registry in its country of origin (Germany?) does.

Yeah so what about the Border Collie and the JRT? They werent recognised in the country of origin before the rest of the world took up the Australian Standard.

Border collie standard is different in different countries.

In FCI they us the UK. (though I did hear tell that Australian tried to get them to change the country of origin of the border collie to Australia (have no idea if that is true).

NZ had their own but close to the UK.

US AKC has their own but also much like UK.

Actaully the OZ standard stands out as very different to all the rest in many ways and the least used standard for border collie in the world.

Also remember that by far, and we are talking 100, 000's of thosands of dogs, by far and away most border collie are not registered in the show registries. They are in the working regisitries in their country or ISDS which is the founding registiry long before ANKC (1906 for ISDS mid 1950's for ANKC). Even some of the European kennel clubs and Canada have the main registry as working and a much smaller appendix withint the working registry for show dogs. So if we want to be true to the country of origin then we would be using the UK standard for show bred dogs and ISDS or it's offshoots for working bred dogs (and they have no physical standard).

When the truth is stranger then fantasy LOL

[shortstep]

We'd recognise the breed because the Registry in its country of origin (Germany?) does.

Yeah so what about the Border Collie and the JRT? They werent recognised in the country of origin before the rest of the world took up the Australian Standard.

Then they must have been recognised here as a "new breed".

JRT were and still are in their working registry in the US. I think they by far register the most JRTs in the US, with AKC being a secondary thought. Big legal fight over this breed being taken into the AKC. Don't know all the details. They also changed/added a name recently and divided the breed (in the show ring not in the working registries)???

Edited March 30, 2011 by shortstep

[benshiva]

We'd recognise the breed because the Registry in its country of origin (Germany?) does.

Yeah so what about the Border Collie and the JRT? They werent recognised in the country of origin before the rest of the world took up the Australian Standard.

Border collie standard is different in different countries.

In FCI they us the UK. (though I did hear tell that Australian tried to get them to change the country of origin of the border collie to Australia (have no idea if that is true).

NZ had their own but close to the UK.

US AKC has their own but also much like UK.

Actaully the OZ standard stands out as very different to all the rest in many ways and the least used standard for border collie in the world.

Also remember that by far, and we are talking 100, 000's of thosands of dogs, by far and away most border collie are not registered in the show registries. They are in the working regisitries in their country or ISDS which is the founding registiry long before ANKC (1906 for ISDS mid 1950's for ANKC). Even some of the European kennel clubs and Canada have the main registry as working and a much smaller appendix withint the working registry for show dogs. So if we want to be true to the country of origin then we would be using the UK standard for show bred dogs and ISDS or it's offshoots for working bred dogs (and they have no physical standard).

When the truth is stranger then fantasy LOL

Absolutely no truth to this whatsover. Just thought I'd point that out

[shortstep]

We'd recognise the breed because the Registry in its country of origin (Germany?) does.

Yeah so what about the Border Collie and the JRT? They werent recognised in the country of origin before the rest of the world took up the Australian Standard.

Border collie standard is different in different countries.

In FCI they us the UK. (though I did hear tell that Australian tried to get them to change the country of origin of the border collie to Australia (have no idea if that is true).

NZ had their own but close to the UK.

US AKC has their own but also much like UK.

Actaully the OZ standard stands out as very different to all the rest in many ways and the least used standard for border collie in the world.

Also remember that by far, and we are talking 100, 000's of thosands of dogs, by far and away most border collie are not registered in the show registries. They are in the working regisitries in their country or ISDS which is the founding registiry long before ANKC (1906 for ISDS mid 1950's for ANKC). Even some of the European kennel clubs and Canada have the main registry as working and a much smaller appendix withint the working registry for show dogs. So if we want to be true to the country of origin then we would be using the UK standard for show bred dogs and ISDS or it's offshoots for working bred dogs (and they have no physical standard).

When the truth is stranger then fantasy LOL

Absolutely no truth to this whatsover. Just thought I'd point that out

that is good to know as that rumor it was going around a few years ago.

[poodlefan]

Absolutely no truth to this whatsover. Just thought I'd point that out

that is good to know as that rumor it was going around a few years ago.

If the Border Collie was an Australian breed, wouldn't it sit on the verandah, telling the farmer it couldn't be buggered to herd today because it was too hot and asking for a cold one while it watched the cricket?

[shortstep]

If the Border Collie was an Australian breed, wouldn't it sit on the verandah, telling the farmer it couldn't be buggered to herd today because it was too hot and asking for a cold one while it watched the cricket?

Too true! LOL