Champion Class- Should We Have A Seperate Class?

[Rebanne]

It would be meaningless to me if I only titled my dog on 6 point challenges, given there's quite a lot of dogs being shown in my state. I have no idea if her breeder would think it's meaningless, it's not her dog and she doesn't show her.

Seeing as this is my first show dog, it would be my first title, but that wouldn't make it any less meaningless.

if it's so meaningless why are you even posting here? I don't understand why someone would bother talking about something that they clearly don't enjoy.

Who said I don't enjoy it? I drove 13 1/2 hours to show at 4 shows in SA over the Labour Day weekend, I'd hardly have done that if I didn't enjoy it.

And since when did you get to decide who discusses what on this forum?

Um where did I say I decide who posts or doesn't? I just don't understand why talk about something you hold in such contempt? Your posts are full of it. Certainly gave me the impression it's not something you enjoy.

[Gayle.]

Who said I don't enjoy it? I drove 13 1/2 hours to show at 4 shows in SA over the Labour Day weekend, I'd hardly have done that if I didn't enjoy it.

And since when did you get to decide who discusses what on this forum?

Honestly Gayle, If you do enjoy showng, I'd hate to see what you say about something you don't enjoy. I'm not sure I've ever read a positive statement about it from you.

Moving on.

Actually I debate photography in much the same manner and I absolutely love photography. Nothing wrong with a good healthy debate on all aspects of a subject. Just because I don't agree with some people, some statements, or some aspects of something, doesn't mean I don't enjoy it.

[whiskedaway]

Hell yes! My bitch has had competition the past 3 weeks (only 1 other bitch) but hey its better than nothing and even judges give you a startled look like wow 2 of you!

Halo's first show out the steward looked at her list and went "oh gosh, there's two of you!" Not that we're competing against Ella yet seeing as Halo is a baby.

[puglvr]

How about we have an optional "Champion Class" Once you are titled you can decide if you want to enter it. This would be a class for people aiming to obtain Grand Champion Status. Ch Dog V Ch bitch for Ch of Breed. This winner to compete for Ch in Group with points awarded accordingly. These points accrue towards Gr Ch Title Obviously the finer details would need to be hashed over, eg if there are Breed points ect./ age requirements.

Then if you have a dog that titles young, you can still opt to show in the normal classes as your dog matures. Maybe there is an automatic upgrade if you dog reaches a certain amount of points. So to obtain your Ch title you would/could still be competing against titled dogs.

This would also possibly keep titled dogs competing a bit longer. For instance I have/show a Black pug boy. He is titled with mostly 20-25 point BOB's (and mostly from Breed Specialists). I have no desire to try for Grand Ch but I don't want to take him out of the ring yet because there are not enough Black Pugs in the ring. How many people take their dogs out after they have titiled?

Here are some interesting figures. At our Ch show on the weekend we had 165 entries (30 Babies) We had a 20 dog Open Dog Class 15 Ch and 1 GrCh. Open bitch 8 bitches - 4 Ch and 4 Gr Ch 47 titled dogs overall 2 of them black from all over Australia. Not an easy breed to get a title in

[SwaY]

Who said I don't enjoy it? I drove 13 1/2 hours to show at 4 shows in SA over the Labour Day weekend, I'd hardly have done that if I didn't enjoy it.

You drove all that way yet you don't seem to show at KCC Park, which is only 2-2.5hours from you.

There is always competition there in your breed.

[SwaY]

Actually I debate photography in much the same manner and I absolutely love photography. Nothing wrong with a good healthy debate on all aspects of a subject. Just because I don't agree with some people, some statements, or some aspects of something, doesn't mean I don't enjoy it.

The day I met you at a show all you did was whinge about being at the show.

[Sayly]

Go Moo PC! I'm super excited about Terrier Club, we might have four Irish too!

Hell yes! My bitch has had competition the past 3 weeks (only 1 other bitch) but hey its better than nothing and even judges give you a startled look like wow 2 of you!

Halo's first show out the steward looked at her list and went "oh gosh, there's two of you!" Not that we're competing against Ella yet seeing as Halo is a baby.

She's the best steward!

[whiskedaway]

Hell yes! My bitch has had competition the past 3 weeks (only 1 other bitch) but hey its better than nothing and even judges give you a startled look like wow 2 of you!

Halo's first show out the steward looked at her list and went "oh gosh, there's two of you!" Not that we're competing against Ella yet seeing as Halo is a baby.

She's the best steward!

She was lovely.

[Sayreovi]

Why wouldn't a rare breed get a look in for group? If they are of a good enough standard, they should have the same opportunity as every other dog in the lineup....unless some dogs there are clearly better examples of their breed than others.

Well clearly some breeds are better than others. I know my current dogs will probably never win a BIG, they are nice examples and as a recent judge said "deserve to be in the ring" but will they ever crack a big one? No....not because they are unworthy of their "meaningless" title or a bad example of their breed but the quality of the other breeds in Group 3 are extremely high.

ETA: Before anyone asks why I bother showing, it's too get my breed out there and remind the Pointer people there is a breed before them and I enjoy having a day doing nothing just relaxing with the dogs. I don't go to shows and then whinge and moan that I didn't win, because showing isn't a main focus for me, if it was I certainly wouldn't have gotten Tollers!

Edited March 29, 2011 by tollersowned

[Faolmor]

How about we have an optional "Champion Class" Once you are titled you can decide if you want to enter it. This would be a class for people aiming to obtain Grand Champion Status. Ch Dog V Ch bitch for Ch of Breed. This winner to compete for Ch in Group with points awarded accordingly. These points accrue towards Gr Ch Title Obviously the finer details would need to be hashed over, eg if there are Breed points ect./ age requirements.

Then if you have a dog that titles young, you can still opt to show in the normal classes as your dog matures. Maybe there is an automatic upgrade if you dog reaches a certain amount of points. So to obtain your Ch title you would/could still be competing against titled dogs.

This would also possibly keep titled dogs competing a bit longer. For instance I have/show a Black pug boy. He is titled with mostly 20-25 point BOB's (and mostly from Breed Specialists). I have no desire to try for Grand Ch but I don't want to take him out of the ring yet because there are not enough Black Pugs in the ring. How many people take their dogs out after they have titiled?

Here are some interesting figures. At our Ch show on the weekend we had 165 entries (30 Babies) We had a 20 dog Open Dog Class 15 Ch and 1 GrCh. Open bitch 8 bitches - 4 Ch and 4 Gr Ch 47 titled dogs overall 2 of them black from all over Australia. Not an easy breed to get a title in

Because unless you then excluded these dogs from competing from BOB, most judges would not bother walking past the head of the line for BOB...

"Hmmm....do I choose the titled champion...or should I go for this up-n-comer puppy??"

[Dogsfevr]

Usually in the US dogs are titled as puppies then the owners pull them out until 2/3 years & bring them back as a special because they are so immature & under done to compete in such a class,certainly in the case of slow maturing & coated breeds.

Many will re start there careers at smaller shows & then plan there yearly campaign once competitive .

[Gayle.]

Actually I debate photography in much the same manner and I absolutely love photography. Nothing wrong with a good healthy debate on all aspects of a subject. Just because I don't agree with some people, some statements, or some aspects of something, doesn't mean I don't enjoy it.

The day I met you at a show all you did was whinge about being at the show.

I have never met you at a show, ever.

[Gayle.]

Who said I don't enjoy it? I drove 13 1/2 hours to show at 4 shows in SA over the Labour Day weekend, I'd hardly have done that if I didn't enjoy it.

You drove all that way yet you don't seem to show at KCC Park, which is only 2-2.5hours from you.

There is always competition there in your breed.

I show at KCC Park, not recently though, and for other reasons than not wanting to go to dog shows (house sale, moving, renovating). And I went to SA because the dogs breeder lives there and I wanted to spend time with her. If she lived near KCC Park, I'd have driven there to see her and gone to a few shows.

[Gemelo]

Lol thats me - there are 4 Fields on Saturday...4 How excitement!

it is exciting isn't it, even if you get beat

Hell yes! My bitch has had competition the past 3 weeks (only 1 other bitch) but hey its better than nothing and even judges give you a startled look like wow 2 of you!

Plus its good practice for the Royal as well. I love having competition.

I've only once had no other Aussies for Flynn to go against - I was shocked - and I didn't go to the show expecting it!

Ive had the same with Peach. I almost died when I realised I had to go in for BIG for the first time :D

For what its worth, Im against having a ch. class as well.

[SwaY]

Actually I debate photography in much the same manner and I absolutely love photography. Nothing wrong with a good healthy debate on all aspects of a subject. Just because I don't agree with some people, some statements, or some aspects of something, doesn't mean I don't enjoy it.

The day I met you at a show all you did was whinge about being at the show.

I have never met you at a show, ever.

Oh yes you did, Sale/Maffra shows would be at least 2 years ago now. :D

You were set up between the gap in the main ring area.

[Gayle.]

Actually I debate photography in much the same manner and I absolutely love photography. Nothing wrong with a good healthy debate on all aspects of a subject. Just because I don't agree with some people, some statements, or some aspects of something, doesn't mean I don't enjoy it.

The day I met you at a show all you did was whinge about being at the show.

I have never met you at a show, ever.

Oh yes you did, Sale/Maffra shows would be at least 2 years ago now. :D

You were set up between the gap in the main ring area.

no, definitely wasn't me. The first time I showed at maffra I was with the Ellagant crew in one of the stalls right near the group 5 ring. the only other time I showed there I was there for about 45 minutes for the baby puppy class, then left. I didn't even set up. I wouldn't have a clue who you are as I have never met you.

[SwaY]

Actually I debate photography in much the same manner and I absolutely love photography. Nothing wrong with a good healthy debate on all aspects of a subject. Just because I don't agree with some people, some statements, or some aspects of something, doesn't mean I don't enjoy it.

The day I met you at a show all you did was whinge about being at the show.

I have never met you at a show, ever.

Oh yes you did, Sale/Maffra shows would be at least 2 years ago now. :D

You were set up between the gap in the main ring area.

no, definitely wasn't me. The first time I showed at maffra I was with the Ellagant crew in one of the stalls right near the group 5 ring. the only other time I showed there I was there for about 45 minutes for the baby puppy class, then left. I didn't even set up. I wouldn't have a clue who you are as I have never met you.

You have, another DOLer who lives up that way introduced me to you.

[Gayle.]

Well it definitely wasn't me. That rings no bells with me at all, as I said the first time I was there I was sitting with a particular group, none of whom are on DOL.

[AshleyB]

I have the same opinion on Champions and Grand Champions or those showing towards those titles.

Earn it!

Beat the best to be the best.

I totally agree with this!

I am not a breeder, nor do I have the time or space to continually have new younger dogs coming out to be shown hence why my Grand Champion (currently out of the ring due to being out of coat) is continually shown. He achieved his Grand at just 2 years old in a very competitive breed beating other Grands to do so.

In regards to breeds with higher numbers and Ch/Grand Ch dogs, I have a young (9 month old) Border Collie at the moment who at just 9 months old is well over 1/2 way to his title. Judges will award young dogs if they see the quality there. I promise you in Border Collies he has NOT had any 6 point Ch/BOB's. This is also my very first Border Collie so I am not known in the Border Collie breed.

It is possible be in rare breeds or not!

[SwaY]

Well it definitely wasn't me. That rings no bells with me at all, as I said the first time I was there I was sitting with a particular group, none of whom are on DOL.

I didn't say you were sitting with someone from DOL, I said someone from DOL introduced me to you.