Dog's Whineing For Food

[Rainy]

Firstly, im confused i was reading the time thread and Im not trying to pick on anyone i just dont understand, When did dogs become the boss?

I was always tought that if you did nothing else with thier training you always had to train respect for food. I have never fed a whineing, wimpering, damanding dog. Im the pack leader and they eat when i say there for none of my dogs have ever "asked" to be fed wether it be by whineing barking or even a nuge of my hand or body.

Could anyone explain to me why it is expected that they behave in a manner that we choose yet at the same time some let thier dogs dictate when to be fed?

Sorry if this dosnt make sence

[anniek]

I think you will find in the "time" thead that although a lot of posters said that their dogs whined at certain times of the day when they expected food, very few if any actually fed the dogs because/when they whined - I sure don't. Like most posters in that thread they get fed when they get fed

[Bundyburger]

Mine whinge and whine, but they certainly do not 'dictate' when they are fed. Last night they started at 6.30.. and didn't get fed til 8pm.. they'd been quiet for well over half an hour at that stage. The more they whine the LONGER it takes for them to get fed. I didn't see anyone in that thread say that as soon as their dogs start to whine the owners jump up and feed them... it's the opposite in fact.. They get fed when they get fed, not when they demand it. When I said we know about it if they aren't fed on time.. that's just because they keep whinging after 7.30.. then when they're quiet for 15-20 mins sometimes longer they get fed.

Edited March 19, 2011 by Bundy's Mum

[Rainy]

I must of interprated some of the post's wrong (i dont want to quote them because i dont want to pick on anyone) my interpratation from some of the post's was that the dogs whined etc untill they were fed.

ETA : Can any one tell us if from a behaviourst point of view if there is any right and worng in this?

Edited March 19, 2011 by Rainy

[Henrietta]

My older dog is quite bad mannered in this way because we let it happen. She doesn't whine on constantly either, she stops when she realises it hasn't worked and finds something else to do. I will confess that sometimes it is just easier to feed her. I do try and wait until she is quiet and surprise her, but I'm not actively trying to change the behaviour. My reasoning? She is getting on and she is not pushy in other ways. Seriously, this is her worst behaviour issue... I can actually live with it quite ok.

Compare that to my younger dog...

She wouldn't dream of whinging for food, but that's because my experience with the older dog meant that I took steps to prevent the behaviour happening. She also had a very nice loose-lead walk almost from the beginning (something I had to re-teach the older dog because I fluffed it up to begin with). She has some wonderful polite behaviours with us, yet she is much more trouble than the older dog (aggression issues). So I spend a lot more time trying to deal with these issues and a little bit of a whinge from an older dog who is thinking it's past bedtime is not going to bother me so much.

[Isabel964]

Rainy, i am not an expert but I am pretty sure your understanding that we are the boss and we dictate when the dog gets fed is the right way to have things. Although some people may have dogs that whine and then get fed, most of those people will admit its not the correct way of doing things....its just the way it is with that dog. We are not all perfect in the way we train or behave with our dogs, we just do our best and choose our battles

I think the thing is with feeding dogs is that they have a great sense of timing. They know when its dinner time! Mine just sit side by side an look at me expectantly at dinner time. Its pretty cute.

[corvus]

If a dog whines until they get fed, all it means is they have learnt whining sometimes results in dinner. It doesn't mean they think they are the boss. It is completely natural for any animal to try to control the things that happen to them. Control is what brings them a sense of security. Every animal wants that.

Erik grumbles at me when I sit down with a bowl of ice cream. He adores ice cream, but almost never gets any. He can grumble all he likes, but it won't get him anywhere. I don't care what noises he wants to make. I like the grumbling. It makes me laugh. He tries it when he thinks we should get out of bed and take him for a walk as well. He often tries to dictate to us. That is fine. Doesn't mean we have to do what he wants.

[poodlefan]

God forbid we should feed an animal when its hungry!

My old boy stares at me when its approaching dinner time. If that doesn't work he barks at me. And I feed him because he's old and he wants his dinner.

Not everything an animal does is a quest for dominance. The sooner people start judging relationships holistically rather than looking at every behaviour as a potential sign of 'dominance' the better. You'll know soon enough if the boundaries of the dog/handler relationship are eroding.

Edited March 20, 2011 by poodlefan

[Janba]

God forbid we should feed an animal when its hungry!

I was thinking the same thing :D

Unlike their wild counterparts we condition our dogs to be fed around the same time each day then grumble because they get hungery and remind us that it is dinner time - a bit like kids

Mine don't whinge unless I am very late with their dinner but the moment I make dog food preparation moves they can get vocal.

[poodlefan]

Anyone who's had horses knows about how they 'demand' food. Throwing feed bins around tends to be a bit of a hint.

[Henrietta]

God forbid we should feed an animal when its hungry!

My old boy stares at me when its approaching dinner time. If that doesn't work he barks at me. And I feed him because he's old and he wants his dinner.

Not everything an animal does is a quest for dominance. The sooner people start judging relationships holistically rather than looking at every behaviour as a potential sign of 'dominance' the better. You'll know soon enough if the boundaries of the dog/handler relationship are eroding.

This is what I was trying to get at I think, by my description of my older dog. What she does is simply a learned behaviour that has certainly worked in the past and still does at times! It doesn't mean that she trying to take over the world, far from the truth actually.

My younger dog on the other hand, she needs quite clear cut boundaries to be at her best and this is what she is provided. Although, I originally just wanted to discourage whining at dinner time if I could, because I'm not a fan of whining lol. She likes barking instead, especially in play, but rarely uses this in a pushy fashion because I try not to let her be pushy. But anyway, as it turned out, she needs a stricter set of rules than my older girl, whose life is a lot simpler.

[Greytmate]

I must of interprated some of the post's wrong (i dont want to quote them because i dont want to pick on anyone) my interpratation from some of the post's was that the dogs whined etc untill they were fed.

ETA : Can any one tell us if from a behaviourst point of view if there is any right and worng in this?

No right and wrong from a behavioural point of view, just desirable or undesirable behaviour.

In zoos now they feed randomly, and not by the clock. This means that the animals behave more naturally.

Dogs learn to whine until they are fed, dogs learn to pull hard on leads, dogs learn to scratch and dig at a door until somebody opens it, they learn to snatch food out of babies' hands. They learn those things if they try them and they seem to work. All until they are either taught to obtain the desired resource through showing us more desirable behaviour, or until such behaviour starts to bring a negative consequence.

The dog is not trying to dominate, just doing what its always done in an attempt to get what it always gets.