Breeding

[gwenneth1]

I was torn between unlikely and never, ever and 99% sure it will be never, ever. The 'good' breeders spend an enormous amount of time, energy and money into getting the best possible outcome. Then there is the whole gestation, whelping and puppy placements-I'm mentally exhausted just thinking of it. I am however, extremely thankful to those good breeders who do so and have only ever had one unfortunate encounter with a 'breeder/kennel', the rest have been superb and I believe 100% with those individuals they would be lucky to break even money wise. I think they also must be slightly nuts (in the nicest possible way) because they expend so much effort into their dogs.

I have also over the last twenty six years, adopted about eight dogs of mixed and questionable parentage , who have turned out to exceed my wildest expectations in trainability, companionship and (bar one who died at age 8 1/2 from cancer) lived to a good age without health issues. I don't know if I've just picked well or been extremely lucky with them, but either way I am grateful to have (had) them.

[Clastic]

I don't and will most likely never will. I'm not interested in breeding at all and haven't even given it a thought, the time and effort that breeders put into their pack and litters is something which I would never be able to do. Everything about genetics is way over my head and confuses the heck out of me, I definitely won't be headed down the breeder path.

Edited March 3, 2011 by Clastic

[Quickasyoucan]

What other people have said re not having the temperament for it. I also don't think I am very motherly and actually prefer adult dogs to pups anyway, in that puppy cuteness doesn't really light my candle, I like to see the grown up product (if that makes sense).

I prefer to leave it to the experts

Edited March 3, 2011 by Quickasyoucan

[mita]

I prefer to leave it to the experts

Me, too. And there are plenty in my breed of interest who do it admirably. They manage to produce beautiful dogs & stay true to the fact that this breed is distinguished by a very special personality.

I've been fortunate that some of these breeders have retired ex-showdogs to me. I think it's a privilege as well as a delight to own them. And I love the way, such a breeder will always ask me, 'How are my girls?'. That speaks volumes for their expertise & care. The future of the breed is in good hands!

[JulesP]

I bred my first litter around 13 years ago. Why did I do it? Mainly for the experience. I had mentors helping me and had orders for puppies before they were born. I found the whole thing quite traumatic. My girl had to have an emergency c-section after the idiot vet didn't believe me that something was wrong. Dealing with the potential owners was interesting. The puppies were gorgeous though. A great experience. I am proud of my litter. 2 of the pups went on to be great pets and 1 went on to be the start of someone else's stud. I had a call when one of the pet pups died at 11yo asking if I still bred as they wanted another dog from me. One of my mentors considered that the mark of a successful breeder.

Would I breed a litter again. Yes under the right circumstances. Would I become a breeder? No. Mainly because I simply could not re-home dogs that didn't turn out good enough to breed from.

[Rysup]

Like Miss B it was a natural progression.

I ordered a puppy when I was still at school. In between ordering and getting, I was convinced I should show the puppy. Started showing and was well and truly hooked. This year marks my 19th year in the show ring, and 21st year in the breed I adore (Keeshonds), and I have had 8 litters in those 19 years.

I fell in love with Lhasa Apsos after I started showing. I bought a dog, and then a few years later, a bitch, then got another bitch as a stud fee. I've had 2 litters of Lhasas but found them much trickier to breed, and so have decided to leave that to those better at it than I. I am happy to buy in my show dogs, and send them back to the breeder for having litters.

The Amstaff is really my OH's choice of breed, and we're no where close to being breeders of them. Way too many around as it is!

[Lablover]

why do you want to breed?

I want to breed, as I have the resources- money and time. Spending, travelling and debating, towards improvement of my working lines.

Currently importing three dog's semen from the US.

Edited March 3, 2011 by Lablover

[lovemesideways]

I think I would only breed if there was some way I felt I could improve the breed. It may be a idea in 10+ years, never know really.

[Tay.]

I'm going to say never say never

One day, if I had the time/money/knowledge I might consider it. Basically I don't like the structure/appearance of quite a lot of pedigree (show/'pet' type) border collies in Australia and would love to improve it. But hey, I'm still in school so I'm talking years and years away.

[dancinbcs]

I bred my first litter around 13 years ago. Why did I do it? Mainly for the experience. I had mentors helping me and had orders for puppies before they were born. I found the whole thing quite traumatic. My girl had to have an emergency c-section after the idiot vet didn't believe me that something was wrong. Dealing with the potential owners was interesting. The puppies were gorgeous though. A great experience. I am proud of my litter. 2 of the pups went on to be great pets and 1 went on to be the start of someone else's stud. I had a call when one of the pet pups died at 11yo asking if I still bred as they wanted another dog from me. One of my mentors considered that the mark of a successful breeder.

Would I breed a litter again. Yes under the right circumstances. Would I become a breeder? No. Mainly because I simply could not re-home dogs that didn't turn out good enough to breed from.

I have never had to rehome a dog that didn't turn out. I don't breed very often and only keep dogs that are as good or better than I have in the yard. Sometimes they don't turn out as winning show prospects due to size or attitude but that does not mean they are not worth breeding from. They are still sound dogs of correct type. If you choose the right puppies, there shouldn't be any need to rehome anything.

In some breeds this doesn't apply due to things like mouths going off, but it is rare in BCs for anything to go seriously wrong, apart from size.

[dancinbcs]

I'm going to say never say never

One day, if I had the time/money/knowledge I might consider it. Basically I don't like the structure/appearance of quite a lot of pedigree (show/'pet' type) border collies in Australia and would love to improve it. But hey, I'm still in school so I'm talking years and years away.

Try to study photos and videos of BCs from the 80s, before CL decimated the breed. With DNA testing now available the breed is slowly getting some of the quality back that was lost but some of the lines have gone forever.

[shortstep]

Try to study photos and videos of BCs from the 80s, before CL decimated the breed. With DNA testing now available the breed is slowly getting some of the quality back that was lost but some of the lines have gone forever.

Why was there decimation/lines gone forever (I am assuming rigorose culling of lines that were known to have produced an affected dog?)? What exact method/s were used to select the dogs to cull or other methods used in attempting to control the disease prior to the DNA test?

Has anyone figured out what % of the lines and or the % of total dogs that were removed from the gene pool?

How did those number reflect/compare to the actual carrier rate of the disease once the test was found?

Once lines thought to carry the disease were removed , later were did more different lines produce the disease (which might be known by the # of carriers in different lines that were not being culled but now found with DNA tests for example).

BTW I am not asking you to answer these questions, they are ideas coming to mind.

However, I would like to know if you think there would be a way to get or estimate these numbers now from records/pedigree/limited registration records and so forth?

This might make a very good study, as we can look back on how we (breeders) attempted to control a disease, how effective it actually was and compare this to the long lasting affects those actions had on the breed as a whole. You could also look forward and see how long it takes for any areas of changes that have been noted (such as structure changes as you noted above, loss of bloodlines as you noted, decreased breed COI and what have you) to correct if at all. Might be very interesting.

Edited March 3, 2011 by shortstep

[espinay2]

I started out just wanting a dog as a pet. but I fell in love with the breed as well as the dog and it went from there.

Breeding does require a whole different way of thinking - another layer if you will.

On the one level there is a love for the individual dogs you own. While exhibiting the traits of their breed, each have their own personalities and traits and we love them as individuals. This is something all good dog owners will experience.

Breeding on the other hand requires another level to be added - a strategic, long term and critical view based on an overall knowledge and love of the breed (i.e. an ability to see the 'big picture').

Some people find it hard to separate these two levels - my other half is one of these people who can't totally understand how I can love each dog we own as individuals, but still sit back and look at their structure and contribution as an example of the breed in a critical way. He hates is when I 'pick on his dogs' It doesnt mean I love them any less as individuals though (as anyone who knows me and my dogs will know!!) - it just means I am looking at them in that moment on a different level, and have to put that love in another pigeon hole for a while.

[Vickie]

That is how you become a breeder. Find a really good knowledgable mentor and be guided by them in selection of a bitch puppy and the breeding of at least your first two litters. From there you start to form some of your own opinions but if you chose the right mentor, their opinion will always be something you take into consideration.

thanks for that. Still think it's not for me. If you are breeding for function, I think it's a little more complicated. If for instance I wanted to breed greyhounds, I think it would take a bit more than the above. I would have to learn all about racing and training and actually have to dedicate a significant amount of time actually racing dogs before I produced my own.

Same with a BC (for me). It would require a significant lifestyle change for me (moving, giving up agility, learning a he'll of a lot more about sheep, training a number of different dogs over a period of years, etc) to be as competant working dogs as I feel I'd need to be to earn the right to breed them. As I said before, luckily for me, there are other people already doing this & doing it well.

Edited March 3, 2011 by Vickie

[Rebanne]

thanks for that. Still think it's not for me. If you are breeding for function, I think it's a little more complicated. If for instance I wanted to breed greyhounds, I think it would take a bit more than the above. I would have to learn all about racing and training and actually have to dedicate a significant amount of time actually racing dogs before I produced my own.

you do know greyhounds were around for thousands of years before an oval track with a mechanical lure were even thought off

[Vickie]

Yes I do. I will adjust my statement to say "if I wanted to breed successful racing greyhounds"

actually, no I won't. I know very little about greyhounds. It was probably a bad example to choose.

[WoofnHoof]

I dont want to say no to breeding. I love my breed so much and tell everyone about just how versatile and wonderful a good one is.

If/when I do it, I will be definately keeping the pick.

Breeding the horses became a bit of an obsession, researching lines, families, finding sires/dams to complement conformation etc. Then the nutritional aspect of the mare etc etc.

The first foal I delivered, I have never been so excited before. Like unwrapping a christmas present to see the colour, sex, conformation and markings. My first attempt at breeding resulted in something really special. (thats him in the sig at 16months old). Maybe I fluked it, but I get excited at the thought of breeding really special animals.

My biggest hurdle I would need to prepare for is parting with the puppies. Horses are different...food, water, some company etc and they are relatively happy.

I can't ever see myself keeping multiple dogs in runs though. No more than 2 or 3 for me.

I'm the same, I couldn't breed dogs but I will probably breed more horses when I am in the position to do so, I don't know if I could ever sell any so it's just as well they only have one foal at a time

[espinay2]

When I was younger I was involved in breeding horses (Crabbet Arabians). Then came the dogs. Right now I am also becoming involved in breeding purebred chickens - after originally 'just wanting a small flock for home production' (Bantam Salmon Faverolles to be precise - just like the dogs they are French and have extra toes! ). Oh yes, and then there is our small registered flock of Wiltpoll sheep...... Funny how once you start to get the 'bug' and passion for breeding good examples of a breed (any breed or species) it kinda snowballs....... :D