westiemum Posted June 10, 2013 Author Share Posted June 10, 2013 Westiemum, how does Mac go at being in an enclosure ? Three of my dogs had dementia, and not one of them like being enclosed they would get frantic. Maybe with Mac, the portacot being round, might help. Thanks Marion - it's a good thought - which is why I'm thinking of the cheapest but still safest solution possibly to start with is the way to go, in case it doesn't work - I really don't need to get stuck with more new unusable dog paraphernalia at the moment. So a $20 Portacot, Steelcraft (which has good reviews) from Gumtree is winning at the moment. But I have to do something - the pacing is killing my sleep and I have to work... but I so don't want to banish him from the bedroom if I can find another solution... It's so hard, trying to think of ways to keep them safe and comfortable at the same time. Is there another med other than vivitonin that would help his pacing. You're right - it is hard to know what to do - maybe some sedation... but that has side effects - I think I'd rather try the portacot first... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marion 01 Posted June 10, 2013 Share Posted June 10, 2013 Westiemum, how does Mac go at being in an enclosure ? Three of my dogs had dementia, and not one of them like being enclosed they would get frantic. Maybe with Mac, the portacot being round, might help. Thanks Marion - it's a good thought - which is why I'm thinking of the cheapest but still safest solution possibly to start with is the way to go, in case it doesn't work - I really don't need to get stuck with more new unusable dog paraphernalia at the moment. So a $20 Portacot, Steelcraft (which has good reviews) from Gumtree is winning at the moment. But I have to do something - the pacing is killing my sleep and I have to work... but I so don't want to banish him from the bedroom if I can find another solution... It's so hard, trying to think of ways to keep them safe and comfortable at the same time. Is there another med other than vivitonin that would help his pacing. You're right - it is hard to know what to do - maybe some sedation... but that has side effects - I think I'd rather try the portacot first... Whatever you do I hope it's a good result for you and for Mac. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kayla1 Posted June 10, 2013 Share Posted June 10, 2013 Not sure if you've tried it already but apparently melatonin can help to regulate sleep cycles without the drowsiness caused by some sedatives. I don't have any experience with it though so not sure how effective it is or what the side effects may be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westiemum Posted June 10, 2013 Author Share Posted June 10, 2013 *- Not sure if you've tried it already but apparently melatonin can help to regulate sleep cycles without the drowsiness caused by some sedatives. I don't have any experience with it though so not sure how effective it is or what the side effects may be. That's a really interesting idea - can you use melatonin with dogs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PuddleDuck Posted June 10, 2013 Share Posted June 10, 2013 Why not get a kids portacot (stable mesh sides) and pad the corners with pillows or have some foam cut to make it more oval shaped? My toddler can stand up and shake the sides and its very stable. Hi Puddleduck - thanks for popping by - yes I like the idea of a portacot and I saw some on gumtree which were very reasonably priced - and I liked the idea of the floor in them and their height would be easier on my back - but having no experience with them whatsoever, I was unsure whether the mesh would stand up to him, the floor would be stable enough and whether or not it would be big enough? He doesn't need a paddock but needs to be able to take a step or two and turn around to 'nest'... and yes the pillows is a really good idea - and I have tons of those! So do you think they would be big enough, is the floor stable enough for him to walk on without falling over and do you think the mesh would be strong enough? Thanks tons PD... as I said I know absolutely nothing about them... My toddler is 14.5kg and couldn't knock it over. I know in the US they are often used as playpens so must be able to take some shoving. The floor is usually a lightly padded mattress but if you wanted something more stable (and it's going to be a 'permanent' type setup) you could get a piece of plywood cut to fit? I'd also have one side against the wall to add stability. For a little dog it would be plenty big enough, it would probably be larger than the appropriate crate for his size. To be honest you could probably even score one off freecycle if you put out a wanted post. It's one of those things everyone buys when they decide to go away for 2 nights then never gets used again...like so much other baby crap. :laugh: I'm thinking I'll have to join this thread soon for my old boy doofus.....he seems to be showing early signs of dementia with lots of barking, not good for a big dog in a unit block! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kayla1 Posted June 10, 2013 Share Posted June 10, 2013 *- Not sure if you've tried it already but apparently melatonin can help to regulate sleep cycles without the drowsiness caused by some sedatives. I don't have any experience with it though so not sure how effective it is or what the side effects may be. That's a really interesting idea - can you use melatonin with dogs? Apparently yes, it is used for some dogs with CCD that have the restlessness at night. I've been reading about it for Kayla, though her night wanderings are not too bad at this stage to warrant it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boronia Posted June 10, 2013 Share Posted June 10, 2013 (edited) Why not get a kids portacot (stable mesh sides) and pad the corners with pillows or have some foam cut to make it more oval shaped? My toddler can stand up and shake the sides and its very stable. Hi Puddleduck - thanks for popping by - yes I like the idea of a portacot and I saw some on gumtree which were very reasonably priced - and I liked the idea of the floor in them and their height would be easier on my back - but having no experience with them whatsoever, I was unsure whether the mesh would stand up to him, the floor would be stable enough and whether or not it would be big enough? He doesn't need a paddock but needs to be able to take a step or two and turn around to 'nest'... and yes the pillows is a really good idea - and I have tons of those! So do you think they would be big enough, is the floor stable enough for him to walk on without falling over and do you think the mesh would be strong enough? Thanks tons PD... as I said I know absolutely nothing about them... My toddler is 14.5kg and couldn't knock it over. I know in the US they are often used as playpens so must be able to take some shoving. The floor is usually a lightly padded mattress but if you wanted something more stable (and it's going to be a 'permanent' type setup) you could get a piece of plywood cut to fit? I'd also have one side against the wall to add stability. For a little dog it would be plenty big enough, it would probably be larger than the appropriate crate for his size. To be honest you could probably even score one off freecycle if you put out a wanted post. It's one of those things everyone buys when they decide to go away for 2 nights then never gets used again...like so much other baby crap. :laugh: I'm thinking I'll have to join this thread soon for my old boy doofus.....he seems to be showing early signs of dementia with lots of barking, not good for a big dog in a unit block! That is probably so true PD, in which case WM should head off to her local Tip Recycling Shop (I wrote that with capitals as it is an important place ) there are sure to be some useful pens or porta-cots there. Edited June 10, 2013 by Boronia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westiemum Posted June 10, 2013 Author Share Posted June 10, 2013 You guys are marvellous - thank you all so much - I really appreciate your help and advice. You know I have some melatonin so while I sort out the portacot or playpen issue I'm going to try him on it starting tonight - 1/2 a 3 mg tab three times a day - morning, late afternoon and 10.30 pm. Wish me luck. To be honest you could probably even score one off freecycle if you put out a wanted post. It's one of those things everyone buys when they decide to go away for 2 nights then never gets used again...like so much other baby crap. :laugh: I've been surprised how cheaply you can buy these things - and yes you're right PD - a lot of ads say only used two or three times - now I know why! And PD you're welcome to pop in anytime. There's so little around to help these dogs its been quite a journey of discovery for a number of us. Suggest one day when you have time, get a coffee and sit down and read the thread from the beginning - there's probably more ideas in the thread here that's actually useful than you'll find on the net generally 'cos its been going for such a long time now. And yes I'll also find out where the local tip shop is B - I have no idea!!! Thanks tons everyone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PuddleDuck Posted June 10, 2013 Share Posted June 10, 2013 Thanks westiemum, I sat down and had a look through it all last night. Doof is a kelpie x shepherd who is around 12 1/2 now. He has been barking more than usual lately and I'm not entirely sure what the cause is. Bit of background, he's always been fairly high strung and anxious. We live in a unit block and around 6 years ago caught some kids who were visiting on the 2nd floor above us sitting on the verandah and throwing rocks at him. Since then his anxiety has increased and he freaks out about things above his head. With the barking it's worse at night but I've caught him barking when I come home a few times. I took him to the vet this week and she said his arthritis is getting painful, and his eyes are getting cloudy and she agreed he might be struggling to see at night. He can still catch food or a ball though. I know having a toddler around seems to increase his worrying too (and mine lol!) I'm going to start him on petark calm and rose hip vital canine for his anxiety and arthritis. The vet did suggest anti anxiety meds but I want to try the calm first. The barking is stressing us all out because I am waiting for a letter in the mailbox from the strata about it. Unfortunately he hurt his leg last week so I can't walk him to exhaust him (and our toller is stuck at home too cos I don't want to leave him home alone at the moment!). So we are all a bit stressed at the moment and that just makes everything worse!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kayla1 Posted June 10, 2013 Share Posted June 10, 2013 You know I have some melatonin so while I sort out the portacot or playpen issue I'm going to try him on it starting tonight - 1/2 a 3 mg tab three times a day - morning, late afternoon and 10.30 pm. Wish me luck. Good luck! Hope it works for Mac. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westiemum Posted June 11, 2013 Author Share Posted June 11, 2013 PD the thing that characterises barking caused by dementia is that its usually purposeless - 'barking into thin air at nothing' so to speak. It was this purposeless which first alerted me to Mac's early dementia - he was in the dark in my bedroom growling at nothing. He still occasionally does it but I think he's marginally better - he tends to bark at Andy these days rather than at nothing. And he certainly wasn't anxious. I think the combination of the vivitonin, the herb robert and his raw diet helped - but which exactly was the one which worked I don't know (or a combination of all of them?). The night-time pacing is also characteristic of the disease - and that's certainly got worse of late - hence the melatonin I've started him on - but it's early days. According to the research, over 60% of dogs over 10 years of age will have at least one dementia symptom. The problem you have is 'Is it dementia?', or "Is it anxiety' or both? I suspect it will be a bit of trial and error to try and work it out with your vet. Hope that helps. Thanks westiemum, I sat down and had a look through it all last night. Doof is a kelpie x shepherd who is around 12 1/2 now. He has been barking more than usual lately and I'm not entirely sure what the cause is. Bit of background, he's always been fairly high strung and anxious. We live in a unit block and around 6 years ago caught some kids who were visiting on the 2nd floor above us sitting on the verandah and throwing rocks at him. Since then his anxiety has increased and he freaks out about things above his head. With the barking it's worse at night but I've caught him barking when I come home a few times. I took him to the vet this week and she said his arthritis is getting painful, and his eyes are getting cloudy and she agreed he might be struggling to see at night. He can still catch food or a ball though. I know having a toddler around seems to increase his worrying too (and mine lol!) I'm going to start him on petark calm and rose hip vital canine for his anxiety and arthritis. The vet did suggest anti anxiety meds but I want to try the calm first. The barking is stressing us all out because I am waiting for a letter in the mailbox from the strata about it. Unfortunately he hurt his leg last week so I can't walk him to exhaust him (and our toller is stuck at home too cos I don't want to leave him home alone at the moment!). So we are all a bit stressed at the moment and that just makes everything worse!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PuddleDuck Posted June 11, 2013 Share Posted June 11, 2013 One thing he's started more of this week is randomly licking his bed. My old girl, Kerry (lab x border who lived to 20 years 11 months) did the same thing. I think he is getting a lot of anxiety from his failing vision and also gets stressed with us getting loud when we play with the toddlersaurus. I wonder if he isnt barking as a startle reaction. He's on Euk senior at the moment and the vet was very impressed with his overall condition, he has some muscle wastage but he's pretty good all up. He can't tolerate raw unfortunately. I'm just stressed by the barking really. I'm constantly aware of the neighbours, there is 15 units in our building and probably 20-30 in the one next door, and quite a few people who dislike the dogs (who we have plenty of permission for, but it's still a concern). There are a few who say they didn't realise we have dogs which I take as a backwards compliment! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westiemum Posted June 11, 2013 Author Share Posted June 11, 2013 Thanks kayla1 - its only day 2 on the melatonin so I'll give it some time to kick in and report back late next week - by then I should have a better idea if its helping. You know I have some melatonin so while I sort out the portacot or playpen issue I'm going to try him on it starting tonight - 1/2 a 3 mg tab three times a day - morning, late afternoon and 10.30 pm. Wish me luck. Good luck! Hope it works for Mac. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rosetta Posted June 11, 2013 Share Posted June 11, 2013 (edited) *- Not sure if you've tried it already but apparently melatonin can help to regulate sleep cycles without the drowsiness caused by some sedatives. I don't have any experience with it though so not sure how effective it is or what the side effects may be. That's a really interesting idea - can you use melatonin with dogs? WM - just be careful with the Melatonin. If it is the prescription type for humans you get from your doctor it is not suitable for dogs. The homeopathic one is apparently OK. I tried Melatonin with my little boy for his separation anxiety - it had no effect. Edited to add - you could try Valerian. Edited June 11, 2013 by Rosetta Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westiemum Posted June 11, 2013 Author Share Posted June 11, 2013 Thanks for the warning Rosetta - its the Bioglan over-the-counter herbal one. I'll see how it goes over the next week and go from there - maybe try the valerain next (although that didn't work for me! ). Like everything with these dogs - its all trial and error! Thanks for your post. *- Not sure if you've tried it already but apparently melatonin can help to regulate sleep cycles without the drowsiness caused by some sedatives. I don't have any experience with it though so not sure how effective it is or what the side effects may be. That's a really interesting idea - can you use melatonin with dogs? WM - just be careful with the Melatonin. If it is the prescription type for humans you get from your doctor it is not suitable for dogs. The homeopathic one is apparently OK. I tried Melatonin with my little boy for his separation anxiety - it had no effect. Edited to add - you could try Valerian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westiemum Posted June 13, 2013 Author Share Posted June 13, 2013 Something funny's happened here. About 10.30 last night Mac started coughing intermittently. Luckily I had some strong Manuka honey in the cupboard, so I gave him a teaspoon full, another at about 4 am and another before I left for work this morning. I've come home to a different dog - his cough appears to be gone (touch wood), he's alert, playful and seems very happy in himself. I'm guessing its the honey but maybe its the melatonin... oh who knows - but I've come home to a happy bouncy boy! Go figure.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rosetta Posted June 13, 2013 Share Posted June 13, 2013 I'm sure you are thankful no matter what the reason :) If it continues without the honey then must be the other - glad to hear he is having some happy moods! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bianca.a Posted June 13, 2013 Share Posted June 13, 2013 Glad to hear he is happy! That is lovely to read! I tried the same brand of melatonin with Molly to no avail so I hope that is one of the combination of things that help Mac. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kayla1 Posted June 16, 2013 Share Posted June 16, 2013 Glad to hear something is working! I can see how the manuka honey would help the cough, but I didn't know it could affect alertness. I might try it with Kayla actually. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted June 16, 2013 Share Posted June 16, 2013 :) His blood sugar might have had a needed boost? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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