shantiah Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 I have a bitch with 4 day old pups. At approx 4pm every day ( when it gets hotter in my house) she grabs one of her pups and holds him in her mouth. She doesnt hurt him but he does cry. I am pretty sure it is the same pup every time (there are two with almost identical markings). As soon as I go to her pen she immediately puts the pup down. She then settles and 15 mins later the same thing happens. This goes on for about 2 hrs. The first day she did this I turned a fan on for her and gave her some sandoz calcium. She settled but it did take a while. I read HERE that there has been success using injectable calcium. I have calcium glutonate. Is this the reccommended type of calcium ? Will this last any longer than the sandoz. I am returning to work tomorrow as is OH. I only have a half day at work tomorrow so will be home early to top her up with sandoz if necessary but after that she will be on her own. She doesnt touch any of the other 4 pups and in all other ways has been a fantastic mum. She also has very little milk but pups are putting on weight so it is obviously enough to go around for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 She is possibly just HOT ..and instinct is telling her move her babies somewhere cooler. Unfortunately in these modern times, bitches can not usually choose the best spot/bedding for their litters... we do it for them.Sometimes we can be a bit off Please make sure there is no supplemental heating... that puppies can lie on a cool floor -or put in a couple of large wrapped ice bottles to keep things cool. Hot/very warm puppies tend to not spend as much time cuddling up to the bitch/feeding ..as they are lying away to stay cool... What is the temperature on the bed in their box? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alyosha Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 Maybe she is just hot, and maybe that pup is also getting hot and may be letting her know more than the others? So she is trying to do something for it? Will she drink divetelact or biolac? That could cool, increase her milk and give her some extra minerals as a boost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fifi Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 (edited) Calcium gluconate is designed for IV injection, IM or Sub cut can cause ulceration or sloughing. Its meant to be administered by vets only. Oral is the safest way at home if you are going that way. And it could be temperature based too. is she drinking enough fluids to keep her milk up ? chicken broth is great for keeping them drinking. eta; and yes, as Aloysha said, milk drinks too. fifi Edited January 16, 2011 by fifi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shantiah Posted January 16, 2011 Author Share Posted January 16, 2011 (edited) Havent got a thermometer but I would guess it is between 27-30 max. BOM says current temp is 28 and its roughly the same inside as outside. In the moning it is noticably cooler inside the house but by around 4 the temp is about the same. She is drinking but has not had much milk the whole time. She looks like I could show her tomorrow she is so lacking. I have another bitch due Thurs who has had milk for 2 weeks and is just about dripping I was going to put the pups on her if necessary but so far they are gaining weight so havent yet. The pups are all sitting with mum, not spread out all over the box so I dont think they are uncomfortably hot. No noise from them either. No external heat source. Mum is happier now she has a second fan on. It is just that it is always the same pup ( there are 5 in the litter) Have cold packs I can put in for them tomorrow while at work. Will go and buy a chook now to make broth for her Edited spelling Edited January 16, 2011 by shantiah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alyosha Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 Fingers crossed all goes well for you all tomorrow - it could be a bit harrowing for you being away from them! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fifi Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 Agree, Shantiah, to you have anyone who can puppysit ? for me personally they would be too young to leave unsupervised. fifi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shantiah Posted January 16, 2011 Author Share Posted January 16, 2011 Fingers crossed all goes well for you all tomorrow - it could be a bit harrowing for you being away from them! Thanks Alyosha. I will be home by 2pm at the latest but have to go out again about 5. Can see how she goes with the ice packs while I am home. Hopefully she will be more settled. IF she isnt I can take her in to work but think she will be a stresshead there as its a bit busy so dont want to take her unless absolutely necessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shantiah Posted January 16, 2011 Author Share Posted January 16, 2011 Unfortunately no one that can puppysit. Everyone that I know that is familiar with the breed and lives close enough is also back at work. I can take her to work if necessary but think she is going to be more settled at home Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jed Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 It's difficult to know what to say without seeing the bitch, pups and whelping box. the general temperaturre is too high - but I'll bet the temperature in the whelping box is not 28 degrees. If the pups are cold, they will lie in a heap, if they are hot, they will spread out. I would be reluctant to do much because of this behaviour because you may make the pups too hot/too cold. Make sure they are not in a draft - get down where the whelping box is to see. Maybe the bitch is a bit stressed. You could put a texta mark inside the pup's ear to see if it is the same one all the time. I've owned a couple of bitches who will carry pups, but usually on only the first day and I have always believed it was stress. the other thing is that she may want to move them somewhere else, and you being there is stopping her. the only real way to know whether bitches have milk is to weigh the pups twice daily. Often bitches which look dry have heaps of milk. If you squeeze a teat, milk will probably come out. Oats and honey increase the milk supply, and I feed my bitches that mixed with with milk instead of a meat meal when the pups are small. the other bitch seems to have more, but perhaps she will have dribbled away all the colustrum by the time she whelps? Have you got someone more experienced who can come to see the set up, and check the girl and the pups? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shantiah Posted January 16, 2011 Author Share Posted January 16, 2011 It's difficult to know what to say without seeing the bitch, pups and whelping box. the general temperaturre is too high - but I'll bet the temperature in the whelping box is not 28 degrees. If the pups are cold, they will lie in a heap, if they are hot, they will spread out. I would be reluctant to do much because of this behaviour because you may make the pups too hot/too cold.Make sure they are not in a draft - get down where the whelping box is to see. Maybe the bitch is a bit stressed. You could put a texta mark inside the pup's ear to see if it is the same one all the time. I've owned a couple of bitches who will carry pups, but usually on only the first day and I have always believed it was stress. the other thing is that she may want to move them somewhere else, and you being there is stopping her. the only real way to know whether bitches have milk is to weigh the pups twice daily. Often bitches which look dry have heaps of milk. If you squeeze a teat, milk will probably come out. Oats and honey increase the milk supply, and I feed my bitches that mixed with with milk instead of a meat meal when the pups are small. the other bitch seems to have more, but perhaps she will have dribbled away all the colustrum by the time she whelps? Have you got someone more experienced who can come to see the set up, and check the girl and the pups? Pups are definately not in a draft. Mum is quite settled all day until about 4pm when it gets hotter in the house. I have had this breed for 22 yrs and been breeding for 19. This is the first time I have had a bitch continue to carry the pups around longer than the first couple of hours. The set up is the same that I have used for the last 5 yrs since moving into this house. I have contacted a few other people with my breed including the sire's owner and they are at a loss except to also suggest it may be that she is getting a bit too hot in the afternoon. She appears to have a little more milk today. Will try the cold packs today and see if they help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebanne Posted January 17, 2011 Share Posted January 17, 2011 How did things go today? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shantiah Posted January 17, 2011 Author Share Posted January 17, 2011 How did things go today? A little better yesterday. She is settling with them. One pup (not the one she carries around) was a bit dehydrated when I got home so have started tube feeding it and gave it some fluids under the skin. Its looking much better this morning. Yesterday was terribly hot and I was home early. Cooler today but I have a full day at work so am going to take them with me. I can keep topping baby up during the day as well. Mum didnt like the cold pack (typical IG) but the baby did sit on it for a little while. The other babies didnt go near it either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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