chellz Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 (edited) Hi I dont want a debate just curious, I know there has already been a thread on the pro's and cons and I already know them but I went into the vet today and I just wanted it to come from her opinion, instead of he said she said.. She said one of the pro's of desexing a dog before she comes into season is a 0% chance of breast cancer in females ( I have a 5 month old female lab 'ella' who is not desexed yet) and apparently there is a higher chance like 35% more after she came into season if you desex her after.. I told her I am not one of those bad dog owners who wouldnt be careful when ella was coming into season and I told her I heard that the bone intensity is not as good if you desex too early and even though I dont want to breed I want the option if I want to get her into agility sports. She told me that research has shown their is no difference in that reguards if you desex her now or early.. every vet advocate it, I mean I could be totally wrong but I cant help but think its just not right to do that when the pup isnt mature but in saying that I am NOT an expert, so I could be totally wrong!! so has anyone else heard this? would it change your mind if u thought there was a chance your dog could get breast cancer? Edited January 10, 2011 by chellz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChristineX Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Hi Chellz, working in the cancer area - no such thing as 0%risk. Desexing drastically lowers the risk of mammary cancer but I don't recall anything that said the earlier the better. I do remember reading articles that recommend desexing later for performance dogs though, for the reasons you have mentioned. Ella is your dog, you make this decision. I'd personally be really irritated if one of the vets at the surgery I take my two to tried to push me into somthing like this. I do recall a number of threads on this issue last year (I think). Have a play with the search function - a lot of it was really interesting - we have a lot of research minded people here who found all sorts of scientific papers to peruse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chellz Posted January 10, 2011 Author Share Posted January 10, 2011 Hi Chellz,working in the cancer area - no such thing as 0%risk. Desexing drastically lowers the risk of mammary cancer but I don't recall anything that said the earlier the better. I do remember reading articles that recommend desexing later for performance dogs though, for the reasons you have mentioned. Ella is your dog, you make this decision. I'd personally be really irritated if one of the vets at the surgery I take my two to tried to push me into somthing like this. I do recall a number of threads on this issue last year (I think). Have a play with the search function - a lot of it was really interesting - we have a lot of research minded people here who found all sorts of scientific papers to peruse. thanx christine, I have read about it on here before.. there is just so much information, it really is an overload.. my heart tells me to wait but when i hear cancer, it just freaks me out.. I know all dogs can get cancer of some sort.. i just dont want to put her at any risk.. she is just too precious Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nekhbet Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 you have a bitch, and considering you now have 2 females I would be desexing them both ASAP before they become hormonal. Two bitches so close in age dont need hormones unless you want problems Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poodlefan Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 There are pro's and cons for desexing bitches but no benefits I can see for desexing a bitch under age 6 months. Weighing up the issues of bone density, chances of hormonal incontinence etc, I'd be doing it at about 12 -14 months old IF you can manage seasons and around 7 months otherwise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
becks Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 you have a bitch, and considering you now have 2 females I would be desexing them both ASAP before they become hormonal. Two bitches so close in age dont need hormones unless you want problems Just because they are a similar age and entire doesn't mean there will be problems ahead if they are left to have a season! I have 2 litter sisters who have never been a problem and both still entire I have 2 younger girls who are a month apart in age and again get along just fine with each other and the rest of the entire girls here (and the speyed ones) Of all the entire bitches I have known over the years both from grooming and showing, I have only come across one who was rescued from a puppy farm, who had mammary cancer, so I would seriously be questioning where this '35%' comes from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandra777 Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 (edited) I have owned entire bitches in various numbers for over 30 years. None have been desexed prior to 5 or 6 years of age (some older, some never) I have had ONE develop mammary cancer, she was PTS at 14.5 years - 8 years after having some mammary tissue removed. Does your breed and the family your bitch comes from particularly, have a higher or lower cancer risk than other breeds and families within that breed? THAT is the information you should be concerned about! Bit like the statistic that tells you neutered dogs have 0% chance of testicular cancer - well duh! ;) Edited January 11, 2011 by Sandra777 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dancinbcs Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 you have a bitch, and considering you now have 2 females I would be desexing them both ASAP before they become hormonal. Two bitches so close in age dont need hormones unless you want problems Not all breeds have a problem with entire bitches running together. With my breed hardly anyone runs males over about 2 years together unsupervised, but they often have 4-6 entire bitches that get on fine running together for all their lives. You sometimes get a personality clash between two bitches and can never have those two together again, but they can usually be run with other bitches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nekhbet Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 The OP wants two pets. Why let them go through hormonal periods if they dont need to, or run the risk when both start cycling they dont get along. Its about harm minimisation, why chance it if you dont have to. Before their first season isnt the end of the world Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luvsdogs Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 I have read that the mammary cancer risk is only 8% after having one season, it then goes up considerably after that. When I 1st took my dog to the vets as a pup she agreed with me in letting her have only one season, she was spayed at 14 mths. With a large heavily boned dog I'd be waiting until after the 1st season to have her spayed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebanne Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 I had a bitch spayed at 3 yrs. Couple years later I found a pea size lump next to a teat. Had it removed, but not tested, she never had any more. Currently have a 4 1/2 yo entire bitch no lumps. I keep an eye on all my dogs, anybody gets a lump, it's spotted pretty quick and attended too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nekhbet Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 With a large heavily boned dog I'd be waiting until after the 1st season to have her spayed. I know of giant breed breeders who desex before sending puppy off to their new homes. Males need testosterone from the testes, it is what gives them their masculine feaures and muscle mass. In bitches the hormones for development are not exclusively in the ovaries which wont even be in use until season. Your bitches shape will be dictated by genetics, not exclusively oestrogen levels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wuffles Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Cancer wasn't a bit factor in my decision to desex my girl, but growth was, because I am planning on doing dog sports. She was done at 11 months, before her first season. If we had the facilities to manage her in season we would have waited longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rappie Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 The published statistics for the risk of mammary tumours are 0.05% if speyed before the first season, 8% after the first season but before the second and about 25% after the second. After this point there is no difference in risk between dogs that are desexed after having had 2 seasons and those that are not desexed. There is some evidence to suggest that speying at any point reduces the risk of benign mammary tumours but the risk of malignant ones is unchanged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luvsdogs Posted January 15, 2011 Share Posted January 15, 2011 I have read that the mammary cancer risk is only 8% after having one season, it then goes up considerably after that. When I 1st took my dog to the vets as a pup she agreed with me in letting her have only one season, she was spayed at 14 mths. With a large heavily boned dog I'd be waiting until after the 1st season to have her spayed. I know the op only wanted to know about the possibility of mammary cancer but my biggest concern was to let the pup grow to it's fullest potential after reading this. http://www.caninesports.com/SpayNeuter.html After making that decision to wait for her 1st season (& I only recommend it for ppl who can totally protect their pup from being mated) I found this article which goes into more detail. http://www.naiaonline.org/pdfs/LongTermHea...euterInDogs.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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