Scent Detection Training Help Needed

[tigger000]

Hey everyone,

I am new here and thought this would be a great place to ask for some help!

I am currently doing a cert III in dog behaviour and training. As part of this course we are required to teach a dog to detect a particular scent (like you see them doing at the airport).

The dog i am using is our family dog - a 7 year old Dalmation and the odour i am teaching him to detect is tea (just normal earl grey tea bags). The containers i am using to hide the items are those black ciggarette butt bins.

The task we are being assessed on is as follows: There are to be 6 containers. No holes in them and they are not to be see-through. Only one container must contain the target odour, the other 5 must have other items in them (non-targets). The dog must successfully detect the target odour 4 out of 5 times.

I have started training our dog and am struggling with a few things.

1) He really lacks motivation. I have tried not feeding him in the morning and this seemed to help a little bit.

2) We can choose either a passive (e.g. sit) response or an active (e.g. scratching) response to the target odour. I tried doing the passive response, however my dog is still recovering from a torn crucit ligament and struggles to sit down. So we tried the active response. Problem is...i have been trying to teach him to scratch the containers...but he just doesnt get it. Instead, he picks them up in his mouth. Im not sure whether we are able to use this as a response...so may need to find another one to use!

3) I have worked the dog up from having 2 containers (1 target and 1 non-target) to 6 containers. I havent yet put the lids on them though as i dont think he is ready for that stage. The problem i am having is that he is picking up every container in his mouth.

I have tried just ignoring him and moving on when he indicates on a non-target, and praising him with pats/food when he indicates on the target...however he is still struggling with this.

I am worried that he is not associating the odour with picking the container up in his mouth and receiving a reward.

To help associate this i tried putting some food in with the target odour and slowly taking it out - seemed to help at the start...but after removing the food and contaminated tea bags and replacing them with fresh ones...it isnt working as well.

Anybody got any ideas on how to solve any of these problems?

I am considering finding another dog to do this part of the course...so if there is anyone in melbourne that lives around my area and wouldnt mind me borrowing their dog a few times a week in the afternoon, please pm me!

[Fourjays]

I think you have moved too fast. Go back to just 2 containers, 1 with nothing in it and the other with the target item in it. Do you use a NRM for him? I would be using that every time he picks up the wrong container, and would only ever reward for the correct one. If your notes don't specify what the active response should be, then I would think that the dog actively picking up the container, is a fine response especially given he currently has physical limitations. Don't forget - if he isn't food motivated, try rewarding with a toy or a game instead, if he is into those things already. You really need to find what turns him on for this sort of work - have you tried different foods? I use cabanossi/cheese, meatballs, chicken necks - anything that gets my dogs drooling and excited!

You could also start hiding teabags in long grass, or around the house in spots (under cushions etc) and make a game of having him find it in those areas, to really get him to twig to the idea - start really really simple with this though. Even something simple like holding a teabag in one hand and nothing in the other and getting him to respond to that. I would avoid using food to help him associate, as it is likely to confuse him. Use it only as a reward. Teach him to respond to the scent in other ways first, then move onto increasing the difficutly and having him find it in the containers.

Good luck!

[kathq]

I agree with gspmadhouse. Slow down - get him doing it consistently on the two containers before introducing more, and find his switch whether it is food or play. Scent work is hard work and the reward must be worth it for the dog..

[Kavik]

I agree you are trying to go too fast.

Before doing anything else I would decide on and work on his response.

I taught the active digging response by first putting food under something the dog can see and smell through but can't get to (I used a milk crate) and rewarding at first for any pawing at the crate, slowly increasing criteria til I was getting lots of pawing/digging at the crate. Then I put my target odour under the crate as well, then removed the food so the dog was only digging at the target odour.

Once I was getting a good response to the target odour I then started with the containers of scent outside the crate (just one to start with) and then added more containers etc. and hiding in different parts of a garage.

The problem I see with the dog picking it up as a response as it may not always be possible for the dog to pick up the item containing the scent (may be in a big box, bag, up high, in the wall, in furniture or below the floor).

[dasha]

Agreed. Slow down.

If he is toy motivated, wrap the tea bags into a cloth of some description. then play fetch with that toy. Then start hiding it so he cannot see it and let him use his nose to find it. After a while he will associate that smell with his toy. Then start placing the teabag in the containers. The containers you are using will be better for a passive response. He won't be ablt to dig on an unstable surfave especially in the learing phase. So that is setting him uo for a fail on the response to start with. If you want a dig response, you need something larger and flatter so he can learn to dig on it and that it also supports his weight when he first starts to lean on it to dig. In the learning phase you cannot correct for any incorrect responses, so picking up the container with the teabag or with a non target cannot be corrected. You are still trying to teach him the odour recognition first, then work on different presentations.

If he is food motivated it is best to teach a bridge (either a word or clicker). If you use a word make it a sharp friendly word like "Yes". Start be teaching him a bridge so that he is excited and then start introducing the odour. Hold the teabag and show it to him, the second he takes interes (either looking, nosing) bridge and feed.When he recognises that the teabag is what makes the bridge then move it around and put it places he can see it but NOT pick it up. Make it progrssivle harder. If you want to use those containers then you need to place them so he cannot pick them up. Maybe put them in a small box with the top of the box open at the start so he gets out of the habit of picking them up. Then start placing bag in 1st container. When he puts hi nose on it to sniff, bridge and feed and parise. When he then starts to look keen to get to container, you can then move it to the second container. Let him sniff the 1st one and then quickly get him to second container where odour is then when he sniffs that one bridge and feed. Have other containers empty at this stage. When you start to put non targets in put things of equal odour strength in as well. Put some bland ones in so as not to temp him to make a mistake. IE empty toilet roll, tissues, paddle pop sticks. Not food.

If you chose passive response which would be better for the design of container he doesn't have to sit. He can stand and stare at it like a pointer if needed. It just has to be a clear change of behaviour. If he freezes and stares then that is a response. As long as it is readable. Milling around the container is not a response. Looking back and forth is not one either. If when he recognises the odour he doesn't leave the container and keeps it focus on it, that would be a good enough response. Just explain why you have trained that as his reponse.

Edited January 3, 2011 by dasha

[Yesmaam]

Agreed. Slow down.

If he is toy motivated, wrap the tea bags into a cloth.

I would go one step further and place a number of dummies in a tub with a whole box of tea bags. Place lid on and let perm up for a min 1 month. Without good scent association you have nothing to work with.

I would also rethink how you intend on teaching this exercise.

[dasha]

Oh.and don't just put a teabag in the container. Stuff it full with as many as you can fit in. You want the odour to jump out and hit him as soon as he is near it. You want to make it so he can't miss it.

[tigger000]

Thanks for all your replies!

He does like some toys, but only soft toys and I have difficulty using them as once I reward him with the toy he becomes easily distracted and won't do anything till he gets the toy back. He is quite food motivated though so I will probably continue using this as his reward. I think I definately need to slow down and go back to step 1. I will be taking on all your advice and ll keep you updated!

[The Spotted Devil]

Just a note on the breed you are working with - Dallies are notoriously hard to motivate so you really need to find out what 'floats his boat' and put a lot of effort into training motivation. I constantly rotate the types of rewards I'm using - 3- 6 different types of yummy food plus multiple soft toys. Zig never ate from his bowl - the vast majority of his dinner was delivered through clicker training and the rest went in a 'puzzle cube' so he had to work for every scrap he ate. He's really fun to work with now - super enthusiastic but I still am very careful not to push too hard. If it's about 'handling' in agility I run the course 6 times on my own and he comes out on the last run through. So, try not to practice on him but be sure in your head about what you want to achieve. He's taught me to be very patient and very creative It's only now that I have a Gundog pup that I realise how difficult he was to motivate and how far we've come over the last 4 years.

[Erny]

He does like some toys, but only soft toys and I have difficulty using them as once I reward him with the toy he becomes easily distracted and won't do anything till he gets the toy back. He is quite food motivated though so I will probably continue using this as his reward. I think I definately need to slow down and go back to step 1. I will be taking on all your advice and ll keep you updated!

If he is so motivated to his toy .... have you tried 'quitting the game' if he refuses to concentrate on his training? Keep it really easy and simple (like the others, it also sounds to me that the training has progressed too far too fast) even to the point of guiding him so that he gets to understand that it is possible for him to 'win' his toy for the first good number of repeats.

[tigger000]

Although he does love his soft toys I find that he is still more motivated by food. I am going to start from scratch with the training. I am going to teach him the active response of scratching and change the containers I am yang to something which is easier for him to scratch on. So today I got a clear Plastic lid and placed some food under it and within only a few repetitions he was scratching his heart out trying to get to the food. So i think I will continue this for another day or so and then work in associating tea bags into it.

I think I am unsure on which order to do things. Do I start incorporating in the tea bags now, or do I start to move to containers which are not see through (I'm thinking of using lunch boxes so I can wash them easily if any target odour gets on non target boxes) and get him scratching those and then slowly incorporate tea bags?

Also when it comes to incorporating tea bags I'm not sure what's the best way to go about it. Is it best to put a whole heap of tea bags with the food and slowly removing the food, or have the tea bags in one hand or on ground and when he is interested in them reward him? Then move to hiding them around the house/yard and when he finds them rewarding him?

Sorry about all the questions...just such a newbie to all this stuff

[Lablover]

Where do you live, you might be able to have a lend of one of my labs.

[Lablover]

Although he does love his soft toys I find that he is still more motivated by food. I am going to start from scratch with the training. I am going to teach him the active response of scratching and change the containers I am yang to something which is easier for him to scratch on. So today I got a clear Plastic lid and placed some food under it and within only a few repetitions he was scratching his heart out trying to get to the food. So i think I will continue this for another day or so and then work in associating tea bags into it.

I think I am unsure on which order to do things. Do I start incorporating in the tea bags now, or do I start to move to containers which are not see through (I'm thinking of using lunch boxes so I can wash them easily if any target odour gets on non target boxes) and get him scratching those and then slowly incorporate tea bags?

Also when it comes to incorporating tea bags I'm not sure what's the best way to go about it. Is it best to put a whole heap of tea bags with the food and slowly removing the food, or have the tea bags in one hand or on ground and when he is interested in them reward him? Then move to hiding them around the house/yard and when he finds them rewarding him?

Sorry about all the questions...just such a newbie to all this stuff

Just a thought, you are not contaminating the cold or hot containers are you?

Even, the least interest - an accident sniff - I would initially reward.

Will the test be around high level distractions, diversions etc. Sorry to read of his CCL injury.

[m-j]

Is it best to put a whole heap of tea bags with the food and slowly removing the food,

Just a suggestion if you have trouble fading the food, once you get the scatch response with the tea bag/s and food, and you go onto two + containers I would put food in the other container/s as well and mark when he scratches the tea bag container, so that he learns it is the tea bag he is looking for not the food, then ditch the food. Try to get about an 85% + correct response rate before moving on to the next stage.

Assuming he isn't scratching and being rewarded with the food he has scratched for I would also make the food you are rewarding him with more high powered than the food he is scratching for unless it is too distracting for him.

The more scent you can have initially the better.

Before you send him looking in a large search area I would be inclined to get the whole response correct and to search on cue first.

Hope this makes sense, as I said just suggestions.

[tigger000]

Where do you live, you might be able to have a lend of one of my labs.

I live in cheltenham, where abouts are you?

I have been trying to work on his association between the tea bags and getting a reward. Each time he sniffed them I rewarded him, he was so keen that he was picking them up in his mouth to be rewarded. So I started hiding them in easy places around my room and he was doing fine at locating them and being rewarded.

So I stopped training for a bit, and then thought I'd give him a go with two containers, one empty and one with tea bags underneath it. Of course, he still scratched on the non target (even though it wasn't as enthusiastic as with the target one). Ugh I guess he still hasn't got the association and I really need to work on it. I think I'm finding it hard to tell if he's made the association or not!

[Erny]

I have been trying to work on his association between the tea bags and getting a reward. Each time he sniffed them I rewarded him, he was so keen that he was picking them up in his mouth to be rewarded. So I started hiding them in easy places around my room and he was doing fine at locating them and being rewarded.

So I stopped training for a bit, and then thought I'd give him a go with two containers, one empty and one with tea bags underneath it. Of course, he still scratched on the non target (even though it wasn't as enthusiastic as with the target one). Ugh I guess he still hasn't got the association and I really need to work on it. I think I'm finding it hard to tell if he's made the association or not!

I think you're still going at it too far too fast. Let him become a bit more reliably successful at the first step before you proceed with the next.

[tigger000]

I agree. I guess I need to work on my patience a bit too while I'm at it!

[Erny]

Lol .... just remember that you'll get there faster if you take it slower and steadier.

[Yesmaam]

I have been trying to work on his association between the tea bags and getting a reward. Each time he sniffed them I rewarded him, he was so keen that he was picking them up in his mouth to be rewarded. So I started hiding them in easy places around my room and he was doing fine at locating them and being rewarded.

So I stopped training for a bit, and then thought I'd give him a go with two containers, one empty and one with tea bags underneath it. Of course, he still scratched on the non target (even though it wasn't as enthusiastic as with the target one). Ugh I guess he still hasn't got the association and I really need to work on it. I think I'm finding it hard to tell if he's made the association or not!

I think you're still going at it too far too fast. Let him become a bit more reliably successful at the first step before you proceed with the next.

I agree, you don't have good enough scent association yet.

You said your dog likes toys, so I am imagining that he has a good amount of prey drive etc.... why are you using another strong odour (food) as your reward???

Hint:

It is far easier to permeate rolled up hand towels (dummies) that are taped at each end, with tea bags (and I mean hundreds of them ie: a box of 500+). Once permed (at least a month) they should stink of tea. The initial rewards for the dog must stink of tea so that the connection is made between reward and odour. To help you with good scent association, I would get someone to tease up the dog with a scented dummy at the park to begin with while you are holding the lead then get him to throw the dummy and you let the dog run up to it, grab the dummy, and play a huge game with him. As you play with the dog, he is taking in odour at the same time, as the dummy stinks of tea.... Do this a few times before moving to tubs. Tubs must initially have dummy + 500 or so tea bags inside with lid on but good enough hole in top to allow access to odour without dog being able to get to it. You could have a line of tubs and get someone again to tease dog up pretending to hide dummy in multiple tubs (one of course holding the target odour). Give command to seek and let him run along line of tubs till he hits target. If your scent association is good he will smash it. Remember that wind and air currents play an enormous role in detection work so make sure your set up is in the dogs favour ie: pay attention to the wind direction when you line up your tubs etc..... you dont want the breeze blowing away from the dog. Even in buildings there can be wind and air currents, hint: a cigarette lighter works well...

Your other problem is working out how you want to teach your dog to respond. Whatever tickles your fancy really but be consistent. If this was to be an operational dog you would need to find something that will tell you, as a handler, exactly where or what the dog is focussing to (which is why most people now use a passive sit/ stare response). For the purpose of your cert 3, whatever you want really just don’t let him mouth your articles.

If you start to think down this road you will have better success.

Edited January 5, 2011 by Yesmaam

[Kavik]

If I was going to do scent detection again, I would probably teach a passive response (for one thing, it is much easier to demonstrate to friends, not nearly as destructive ) but at the time I did it I had not taught any kind of active response to anything and did it more for the challenge and to have something different to train than I had trained before.