Souff Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 (edited) Thanks for re-posting Souff - great advice (as usual :D) and something to seriously think about. Yes I have been acutely aware of the dogs velocity through the car on sudden stop or impact - hence trying to find a solution which maximises everyones chances of getting out of it relatively intact. My situation was made worse for me by my old guys propensity for falling down the footwell with his million dollar surgically repaired back legs. Which is why I like the back seat buddy - its hammock design, its well made, washes like a rag and is really robust. Must confess though I didn't think of crates - I tend not to go there I suppose because of a possibly irrational need (yes on my part!) to not crate/cage my two puppy farm survivors again - ever - having spent over half their lives in cages. But maybe for their safety and mine I should reconsider crating in the car. What configuration of hard-sided crates would suit three westies do you think? And are they better on the back seat or in the cargo area of a small wagon? Thanks again. Crates are actually safe havens for dogs, try to think of them that way. However, there are rules for crates. Do not use a crate that has clips - they will spring open on impact. Totally useless in an accident. Also, do not use metal folding crates. Use AIRLINE APPROVED PLASTIC CRATES - these are crates that are screwed together and cannot spring open on impact. If you have a wagon, the best place for crates is behind the back seat. If you have a sedan, the best place is being placed across the rear seat. Never place a crate with the door at the front, i.e. do not have the crate door facing the same way as the car is going. The dog or puppy can be smashed against a steel door! On the back seat the usual seat belts hold the crates in place well, but do not thread the belts through the handles of the crates. Crates come in many sizes and 2 smallish westies should be quite OK in the correct sized crate. Practice at home first with toys and food and practice sleeps. I suspect that the main reason that crates are safer than harnesses on impact is because the dogs are lying down and relaxed and literally roll off the sides of the crate after impact. They are not restrained with great force, and as most dogs usually have a nice comfy mattress in their crate, and/or blankies, the impact is absorbed better. The dogs joints, particularly shoulders, and ribs, neck, spine, etc , is not taking a great shock. Harnesses have their place and many of the bigger dogs simply wont fit in a crate, a crate that will fit in a small sedan anyway. I was in the UK recently and was very impressed with the snazzy"boxes" that fit in to the back of wagons. I think they are called "Trans K9" or something like that. Come in many sizes and they can be very roomy for the bigger dogs. btw, you are talking to somebody who used to drive with small dog on lap (!!!!!!) :D Sooooooo bad, and of course it is now illegal. And with very good reason! After seeing first hand the damage done to dogs by impact injuries, and having seen for myself what a determined dog can do to a harness with a set of teeth (while all the time I was blissfully listening to music as I drove) I can only recommend crates for safety. They can save your dogs life, and save him/her from serious injury. As that article points out, there is another very good reason for having your dog in a crate in the vehicle. When the ambos need to help you or injured passengers, an angry dog (who does not understand that ambos are there to help) is far better to be in a crate than lashing out at them from a harness. I sincerely hope that nobody and their dogs are involved in an accident, but it is best to plan to avoid/minimise disaster whenever you can. Please don't add them to the list of casualties. Souff Edited January 3, 2011 by Souff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldenGirl85 Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 I have the Running Dog BAck seat cover and that protects the doors as well - although the windows are still covered in drool regularly. I am planning to get the anchor point tethers for mine to attach to their harnesses as the seatbelts are covered No complaints about it? do you think the material will deteriorate at all if its constantly installed in the car? my last one was good at first but the waterproof lining on the bottom has deteriorated and crumbled after only a few months use Mine seems to be pretty tough plastic and has held up well - I have left it up in the car for a while and it doesn't seem to show any deterioration - but the lack of holes for tethers - while I can see the reasons - is a pain. My Bloodhound loves it though and will happily lie down on it while travelling - but am looking for ways to restrain him more securely - bit paranoid now :D Does it have zips on both sides of the 'door'? its a bit hard to tell how its secured by the photos It has a zip on both sides of the door that allow the 'flap' on that side to be pulled down to let the dogs in - it is secured by straps around the back seat headrests and the front seat headrests - these are adjustable Hmm, so the only way to secure the dogs would be by the anchor points right? because you cant access the seatbelts or latch bars? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westiemum Posted January 3, 2011 Author Share Posted January 3, 2011 Thanks tons Souff - thats really helpful. And you know when you see something and you intrinsically know its right? Well here it is - and these are fantastic and the perfect solution. Do you know of anything similar in Australia? Thanks for re-posting Souff - great advice (as usual ) and something to seriously think about. Yes I have been acutely aware of the dogs velocity through the car on sudden stop or impact - hence trying to find a solution which maximises everyones chances of getting out of it relatively intact. My situation was made worse for me by my old guys propensity for falling down the footwell with his million dollar surgically repaired back legs. Which is why I like the back seat buddy - its hammock design, its well made, washes like a rag and is really robust. Must confess though I didn't think of crates - I tend not to go there I suppose because of a possibly irrational need (yes on my part!) to not crate/cage my two puppy farm survivors again - ever - having spent over half their lives in cages. But maybe for their safety and mine I should reconsider crating in the car. What configuration of hard-sided crates would suit three westies do you think? And are they better on the back seat or in the cargo area of a small wagon? Thanks again. Crates are actually safe havens for dogs, try to think of them that way. However, there are rules for crates. Do not use a crate that has clips - they will spring open on impact. Totally useless in an accident. Also, do not use metal folding crates. Use AIRLINE APPROVED PLASTIC CRATES - these are crates that are screwed together and cannot spring open on impact. If you have a wagon, the best place for crates is behind the back seat. If you have a sedan, the best place is being placed across the rear seat. Never place a crate with the door at the front, i.e. do not have the crate door facing the same way as the car is going. The dog or puppy can be smashed against a steel door! On the back seat the usual seat belts hold the crates in place well, but do not thread the belts through the handles of the crates. Crates come in many sizes and 2 smallish westies should be quite OK in the correct sized crate. Practice at home first with toys and food and practice sleeps. I suspect that the main reason that crates are safer than harnesses on impact is because the dogs are lying down and relaxed and literally roll off the sides of the crate after impact. They are not restrained with great force, and as most dogs usually have a nice comfy mattress in their crate, and/or blankies, the impact is absorbed better. The dogs joints, particularly shoulders, and ribs, neck, spine, etc , is not taking a great shock. Harnesses have their place and many of the bigger dogs simply wont fit in a crate, a crate that will fit in a small sedan anyway. I was in the UK recently and was very impressed with the snazzy"boxes" that fit in to the back of wagons. I think they are called "Trans K9" or something like that. Come in many sizes and they can be very roomy for the bigger dogs. btw, you are talking to somebody who used to drive with small dog on lap (!!!!!!) :D :D Sooooooo bad, and of course it is now illegal. And with very good reason! After seeing first hand the damage done to dogs by impact injuries, and having seen for myself what a determined dog can do to a harness with a set of teeth (while all the time I was blissfully listening to music as I drove) I can only recommend crates for safety. They can save your dogs life, and save him/her from serious injury. As that article points out, there is another very good reason for having your dog in a crate in the vehicle. When the ambos need to help you or injured passengers, an angry dog (who does not understand that ambos are there to help) is far better to be in a crate than lashing out at them from a harness. I sincerely hope that nobody and their dogs are involved in an accident, but it is best to plan to avoid/minimise disaster whenever you can. Please don't add them to the list of casualties. Souff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Souff Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 Thanks tons Souff - thats really helpful. And you know when you see something and you intrinsically know its right? Well here it is - and these are fantastic and the perfect solution. Do you know of anything similar in Australia? That is them! :D The ones I saw up close were hard moulded plastic and fitted very snugly into the back of a wagon. Very stylish too. They do not move anywhere, cannot tip, and best of all the dogs LOVE them! The Brits are the best with their dogs, and no, I have not seen anything like them in Australia yet, but must say that I havent been specifically looking either. I would not suggest that they are cheap but hey, they would be a lot cheaper than vet bills for impact injuries and without the trauma and pain! Souff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westiemum Posted January 3, 2011 Author Share Posted January 3, 2011 No they aren't cheap - but compared with the vet bills I've paid this last 12 months and the old boys rebuilt million dollar back end they are cheap at half the price!! And with a double in the back of the wagon and the centre divider removed I could get three westies in it without any bother - and they could all have some comfy bedding as well!! Now to get my hands on one or something similar... Thanks tons Souff - thats really helpful. And you know when you see something and you intrinsically know its right? Well here it is - and these are fantastic and the perfect solution. Do you know of anything similar in Australia? That is them! :D The ones I saw up close were hard moulded plastic and fitted very snugly into the back of a wagon. Very stylish too. They do not move anywhere, cannot tip, and best of all the dogs LOVE them! The Brits are the best with their dogs, and no, I have not seen anything like them in Australia yet, but must say that I havent been specifically looking either. I would not suggest that they are cheap but hey, they would be a lot cheaper than vet bills for impact injuries and without the trauma and pain! Souff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Souff Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 (edited) No they aren't cheap - but compared with the vet bills I've paid this last 12 months and the old boys rebuilt million dollar back end they are cheap at half the price!! And with a double in the back of the wagon and the centre divider removed I could get three westies in it without any bother - and they could all have some comfy bedding as well!! Now to get my hands on one or something similar... Send them an email. They might have an Australian distributor. Edited January 3, 2011 by Souff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MsKatie Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 I have the Running Dog BAck seat cover and that protects the doors as well - although the windows are still covered in drool regularly. I am planning to get the anchor point tethers for mine to attach to their harnesses as the seatbelts are covered No complaints about it? do you think the material will deteriorate at all if its constantly installed in the car? my last one was good at first but the waterproof lining on the bottom has deteriorated and crumbled after only a few months use Mine seems to be pretty tough plastic and has held up well - I have left it up in the car for a while and it doesn't seem to show any deterioration - but the lack of holes for tethers - while I can see the reasons - is a pain. My Bloodhound loves it though and will happily lie down on it while travelling - but am looking for ways to restrain him more securely - bit paranoid now Does it have zips on both sides of the 'door'? its a bit hard to tell how its secured by the photos It has a zip on both sides of the door that allow the 'flap' on that side to be pulled down to let the dogs in - it is secured by straps around the back seat headrests and the front seat headrests - these are adjustable :D Hmm, so the only way to secure the dogs would be by the anchor points right? because you cant access the seatbelts or latch bars? That's right - so in my MAzda 6 hatch I would have to use the anchor points at the bottom of the back of the back seat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westiemum Posted January 3, 2011 Author Share Posted January 3, 2011 OK - I've just sent TransK9 an enquiry about an Australian distributor... a long shot I know but lets see what comes back... No they aren't cheap - but compared with the vet bills I've paid this last 12 months and the old boys rebuilt million dollar back end they are cheap at half the price!! And with a double in the back of the wagon and the centre divider removed I could get three westies in it without any bother - and they could all have some comfy bedding as well!! Now to get my hands on one or something similar... Thanks tons Souff - thats really helpful. And you know when you see something and you intrinsically know its right? Well here it is - and these are fantastic and the perfect solution. Do you know of anything similar in Australia? That is them! :D The ones I saw up close were hard moulded plastic and fitted very snugly into the back of a wagon. Very stylish too. They do not move anywhere, cannot tip, and best of all the dogs LOVE them! The Brits are the best with their dogs, and no, I have not seen anything like them in Australia yet, but must say that I havent been specifically looking either. I would not suggest that they are cheap but hey, they would be a lot cheaper than vet bills for impact injuries and without the trauma and pain! Souff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JulesP Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 No they aren't cheap - but compared with the vet bills I've paid this last 12 months and the old boys rebuilt million dollar back end they are cheap at half the price!! And with a double in the back of the wagon and the centre divider removed I could get three westies in it without any bother - and they could all have some comfy bedding as well!! Now to get my hands on one or something similar... Thanks tons Souff - thats really helpful. And you know when you see something and you intrinsically know its right? Well here it is - and these are fantastic and the perfect solution. Do you know of anything similar in Australia? That is them! :D The ones I saw up close were hard moulded plastic and fitted very snugly into the back of a wagon. Very stylish too. They do not move anywhere, cannot tip, and best of all the dogs LOVE them! The Brits are the best with their dogs, and no, I have not seen anything like them in Australia yet, but must say that I havent been specifically looking either. I would not suggest that they are cheap but hey, they would be a lot cheaper than vet bills for impact injuries and without the trauma and pain! Souff You could give Puppybars a call. They might be able to make up something. I have seen something similar on Ebay before too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westiemum Posted January 3, 2011 Author Share Posted January 3, 2011 (edited) JulesP You could give Puppybars a call. They might be able to make up something.I have seen something similar on Ebay before too. Thanks Jules P for the info - on their website they seem to only work in metal - do you know if thats right? Cos for safety and lightness of handling I think if I can find a hard plastic solution that would be ideal... I don't think I could handle a double transit box in metal on my own... but could be wrong! Edited January 3, 2011 by westiemum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staff'n'Toller Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 JulesPYou could give Puppybars a call. They might be able to make up something.I have seen something similar on Ebay before too. Thanks Jules P for the info - on their website they seem to only work in metal - do you know if thats right? Cos for safety and lightness of handling I think if I can find a hard plastic solution that would be ideal... I don't think I could handle a double transit box in metal on my own... but could be wrong! He said he was experimenting with poly-resin (or some such) false flooring for ease of cleaning when he did mine, this was a couple of years ago now. Flick him an email. If you have a wagon he might be able to do something awesome in the back for little dogs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westiemum Posted January 3, 2011 Author Share Posted January 3, 2011 Thanks tons SnT - that sounds much more promising - will do. JulesPYou could give Puppybars a call. They might be able to make up something.I have seen something similar on Ebay before too. Thanks Jules P for the info - on their website they seem to only work in metal - do you know if thats right? Cos for safety and lightness of handling I think if I can find a hard plastic solution that would be ideal... I don't think I could handle a double transit box in metal on my own... but could be wrong! He said he was experimenting with poly-resin (or some such) false flooring for ease of cleaning when he did mine, this was a couple of years ago now. Flick him an email. If you have a wagon he might be able to do something awesome in the back for little dogs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheridan Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 Thanks tons Souff - thats really helpful. And you know when you see something and you intrinsically know its right? Well here it is - and these are fantastic and the perfect solution. Do you know of anything similar in Australia? That is them! :D The ones I saw up close were hard moulded plastic and fitted very snugly into the back of a wagon. Very stylish too. They do not move anywhere, cannot tip, and best of all the dogs LOVE them! The Brits are the best with their dogs, and no, I have not seen anything like them in Australia yet, but must say that I havent been specifically looking either. I would not suggest that they are cheap but hey, they would be a lot cheaper than vet bills for impact injuries and without the trauma and pain! Souff I'm not seeing anything on that website that's useful for a hatchback. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westiemum Posted January 3, 2011 Author Share Posted January 3, 2011 (edited) Hi Sheridan, My car was listed on their drop down menu - and I think it says on the Trans K9 website that if your make and model isn't there to contact them as they are adding new designs all the time... but it all might be moot anyway if they reply to me and say they don't have an Australian Distributor (which I suspect is the case) and freight would be hellishly expensive I think even if they would do it... will post what they say when I hear from them... hope that helps :D Thanks tons Souff - thats really helpful. And you know when you see something and you intrinsically know its right? Well here it is - and these are fantastic and the perfect solution. Do you know of anything similar in Australia? That is them! The ones I saw up close were hard moulded plastic and fitted very snugly into the back of a wagon. Very stylish too. They do not move anywhere, cannot tip, and best of all the dogs LOVE them! The Brits are the best with their dogs, and no, I have not seen anything like them in Australia yet, but must say that I havent been specifically looking either. I would not suggest that they are cheap but hey, they would be a lot cheaper than vet bills for impact injuries and without the trauma and pain! Souff I'm not seeing anything on that website that's useful for a hatchback. Edited January 3, 2011 by westiemum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gretel Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 Interesting thread - thank you I had a feeling wire crates weren't ideal for the car. Thanks Souff. Now looking at some bigger plastic crates cause Vienna is pretty snug in the one my Cavaliers fit well in and the only bigger ones I have are wire. Can anyone recommend somewhere to buy bigger plastic crates? They are so dear! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Souff Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 I am waiting for somebody to set up a website that is about the recycling of used dog carriers. Many people who get a crate with the puppy, then the crate spends most of its time in the garage or the shed gathering dust because the pup has outgrown it, and finally gets tossed out .... and I find out later ... grrrrrr The puppy crates for medium and large breeds are ideal travel crates for the smaller dogs and the top quality ones (Vari) have a long life and it is almost criminal seeing them gathering dust or used for the wrong things. Some get donated to orgs, but many get tossed out, or are lying around the farm being used for something else .... sigh. Many have only been used a couple of times. Souff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheridan Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Hi Sheridan,My car was listed on their drop down menu - and I think it says on the Trans K9 website that if your make and model isn't there to contact them as they are adding new designs all the time... but it all might be moot anyway if they reply to me and say they don't have an Australian Distributor (which I suspect is the case) and freight would be hellishly expensive I think even if they would do it... will post what they say when I hear from them... hope that helps I'll be interested to hear what they say. They have a VW Golf Plus, which seems to me to be a larger hatchback (?). I have a VW Polo. I think, though, unless the rear seat is put down, there wouldn't be room for two dogs and with the Grumpy man I'd still have the same issue of him being unmuzzled in the back. The thing about the crate is that his teeth are out of reach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpotTheDog Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 The PetHaven site is just giving me SQL errors when I try to load it up. Same with the car size guides for the backseat buddy. Definitely want one of these - anyone any idea what'd fit in the back seats of a Holden Captiva? I'll measure it when I get home, but if anyone knows off the top that'd be useful... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
megan_ Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Aren't the back seat buddies about $300? And they don't come with a hole so the seat belt can be clipped in? I have a $40 seat cover that I bought from the pet shop that is water proof etc, and my dogs can have their restraints clipped in. What is so great about the back seat buddy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staff'n'Toller Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 (edited) Aren't the back seat buddies about $300? And they don't come with a hole so the seat belt can be clipped in? I have a $40 seat cover that I bought from the pet shop that is water proof etc, and my dogs can have their restraints clipped in. What is so great about the back seat buddy? If there are holes in the cover for the restraints- then it's not waterproof. Dirt and sand also feeds through those slots, I know because I used to have one. Comes with a range of straps and clips to fasten in different car configurations. 2 top sections unzip from the waterproof part, fully machine washable, for many washes. Can halve it so you can put one of your seats up in the back. High density zips and stitching. No need for blankets or mats as they come with synthetic lambswool that is blanket stitched. No noise from the dogs when moving around as their nails don't scratch the material. Mine is 8+ years old now and still looks fab. No signs of stitching, zip or clip damage or wear. Edited January 4, 2011 by Staff'n'Toller Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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