" Off The Chain"

[Aidan]

Does anyone know the extent of dog fighting in Australia?

http://www.abc.net.au/4corners/content/2008/s2252948.htm

[W Sibs]

I've watched this. I cried from start to end, and the anger and rage I felt for those f!@#wits after watching is scared the crap out of me.

There are no words to describe on what i think of those f!@#wits.

Those dogs...

[Keira&Phoenix]

Glad to see that people are watching this. The OP did not post it because she condones dog fighting but because we live in a world where these atrocities happen everyday and pretending they don't is not going to help those poor dogs, or put those sickos in prison. This video does not condone dog fighting but instead covers the background of the Pit Bull, the background of dog fighting, interviews "dog men" and gives you an insight into what is actually happening and why is can't be stopped, it also speaks about the ineffectiveness of BSL in the United States and gives you informative stats, it also has caring owners talking about their family pit bulls. A disturbing, heartwrenching but worthwhile watch.

Just finished watching all six parts and bawled my eyes out. The poor little bastard that couldn't fight anymore and they electrocuted to kill her. Assholes. Sick twisted assholes.

That was one of the hardest bits for me to watch also. Heartbreaking.

[Zhou Xuanyao]

I don't know who the greater enemy of the Pitbull is, the fighters or the government. Hypocrites have got some nerve lecturing every one else while they are indiscriminately killing and taking innocent dogs from their families to put to death every day.

I don't think there will be progress here until the government gets on the side of the dogs. I'd like to see people directing strong criticism toward them, far from any support.

The various parts toward the end showing the dogs with their families was beautiful.

These dogs have got a lot of supporters, I think in time BSL will fizzle out. I don't think fighting is going to end any time soon, but like I said, if the authorities get on the right side, then maybe they will be able to reduce it.

[J.H.M]

The various parts toward the end showing the dogs with their families was beautiful.

I can't watch the vid because my connection has been shaped, but is this the people who are fighting the dogs or just a family that owns pitbulls? I am just curious because I just cannot reconcile in my mind that you could put a family pet into a pit and then go home and treat it with love and kindness

Edited December 22, 2010 by Ma Meeshka Mow Skwoz

[Zhou Xuanyao]

No they are regular families and individuals who are talking about their dogs, playing with them, ect. These sections are in parts 5 and 6.

[DerRottweiler]

I watched this a while back.

It is pretty depressing to watch, but, that's reality. It needs to be stopped.

[J.H.M]

No they are regular families and individuals who are talking about their dogs, playing with them, ect. These sections are in parts 5 and 6.

ahh cool thanks. Hopefully once my internet is back to normal I will be able to watch it

[Guest]

It made me want to vomit for more reasons that one.

[shekhina]

The poor little bastard that couldn't fight anymore and they electrocuted to kill her.

WTF?! My god

[Jed]

So many evil people in the world, thinking there is some justification for what they do. The wickness of people still manages to surprise me.

I note that dog fighter Tuscan's Black Dog was euthed by the authorities 4 days after he was arrested. He was free on parole, but the dog is dead. Maybe she is better off dead? He had no regard for anything except his own fat guts.

[Winterpaws]

Which part of it was balanced?

[Skruffy n Flea]

Dog fighters telling you how much they love and admire their dogs is like paedophiles telling you how much they love kids. Sickening, criminal behaviour that's morally reprehensible and utterly inexcusable IMO.

x 2

X3

I am not going to watch it as there is nothing anyone can tell me will that will change my mind at all on the fact Dog fighting is very very wrong!

X4

[Zhou Xuanyao]

They are not evil, nor are they sociopaths. Generally speaking that is. I'm sure sociopaths are among them. It is an indifferent attitude to an animals welfare, we see it all over the world in the present day and of course right through history in just about every culture, including our own.

The short portion on Italy, for example, was interesting. They have not changed in two thousand years. It used to be lions, tigers, elephants, peasants, Christians, ect, now its dogs. The crowd was much different to the American scene, you could see they looked like regular, dare I say sophisticated people. It is just cultural conditioning and nothing else.

I once saw some documentary where a class of young primary school children in Chicago were asked about dog fighting. They were all familiar with it, and all seemed indifferent. These kids have been raised in an environment in which dog fighting is not considered wrong, how are they to know ? As far as they are concerned, some babbling women on the tv says it is wrong, but their common experience and conditioning says it is right. Then they grow up, they fight dogs as well, their kids are raised desensitized to it, and so forth.

The solution lies in gradual social reform and an understanding of the true nature of the issue.

[Jed]

Oh course they are evil. People don't need someone to tell them something is wrong, they intrinsically KNOW it is wrong ... unless they are evil.

There can be NO justification for this type of behaviour. None. Never.

[Zhou Xuanyao]

People do not intrinsically think it wrong, far from it. Right and wrong is cultural, learned and conditioned, not necessarily directly. The only reason we regard dogs as pets and are affectionate toward them is because our environment facilitated it.

It is not a matter of justifying, it's just putting the emotive accusations aside and looking at the problem realistically. The best way to change something is to understand the causes.

[Jed]

Well,I don't see it like that. I see that the people involved have no interest in dogs/animals, except to bolster their own egos, and make some money. You may think this is a learned attude, and it may well be, but the basic evil nature has to be there for the attitude to take root. Even someone steeped in the culture would not continue with it when he saw dogs being maimed and killed and badly damaged, without being evil. No one who was not evil could electrocute his dog for losing a fight.

None of the behaviour of the people in the film was "normal" imho.

But that's only my opinion. You are entitled to yours as well

[Zhou Xuanyao]

Sure I am, we both are

The behavior is not normal only insofar as it is deviates from the behavior and beliefs of the majority of people, but that doesn't show anyone is evil. If you consider that their behavior conforms with the normal standard within their certain group or subculture, then by that measure it is normal.

Here is something to reflect on if you choose to. The children I mentioned earlier, are they all evil for being indifferent to dog fighting ? Would children from an area where dog fighting was rare or non existent, an area with a strong culture of pet ownership and affection, react the same way to questions about dog fighting ?

I think the answer is obviously no. The least plausible explanation is that all the children in the neighborhood where dog fighting is prominent just so happen to be evil. The most reasonable explanation is that the children are a product of their conditioning. It follows then, that when they grow, if they participate in this activity, they do so (for the most part) because they have a conditional predisposition to it. If the same children were taken from place A and raised in place B, their outlook on life would be completely different.

This hypothesis also, incidentally, provides the most opportunity for optimism. Under my world view, dog fighting can potentially be all but eliminated over a generation or two with social reform initiatives. This includes, but is far from limited to, punitive measures. Under the view that these people are inherently evil, the pursuit to liberate these dogs from fighting is in vain, and the general improvements in attitude toward animal welfare globally in the past 150 + years would defy any reasonable explanation.

Edited December 26, 2010 by Lo Pan

[brightonrock]

Isn't it just like cock fighting ? Use the animals to win the money/bets ?

The bottom line is the animals are the property that gives status and income to the people who can't make it other ways.

[dogbesotted]

The dog fighters give their brutal savage twisted psychological mindset away when the dog is unable or unwilling to fight they are killed in a most painful and tortured way. Nothing humane or normal about these bastards at all.. for all their fine talk about the traditions etc. etc. they are scum and a disgrace to humanity.

For 6 years I had the honour and pleasure of the company of Jake a pitbull who had been a fighter for the first years of his life. After he had been with me for a while I took him with me to a friends place as i was collecting some hens.. when we turned onto the bushytrack to their property jake crawled across the front seat and laid his head in my lap whimpering quietly...... It was with horror that i realised that maybe he thought i too was taking him to fight....

H