My Dog Is Not Agressive Some Advice Please

[Souff]

but runs very fast up to them

This in itself can be considered an offence. If any dog runs up fast to me or my dogs it gets my boot in it's face.

Even in an offlead dog park..?

Definitely in an offlead dog park.

Larger dogs rushing at smaller dogs are the reason that many owners of small dogs no longer frequent dog parks. Many smaller dogs have been injured at dog parks and when a larger dog rushes at them in a dog park on a later visit, it is terrifying for them and their owner.

Such owners know that they can only take their small dogs there when the bigger dogs are not there and that was not how dog parks were intended to be.

Even small older dogs are entitled to a bit of healthy exercise in a dog park, but often this can no longer happen because of a bad experience at a dog park.

Don't let your dog rush at smaller dogs in a dog park. It is simply not on.

Souff

[Keira&Phoenix]

but runs very fast up to them

This in itself can be considered an offence. If any dog runs up fast to me or my dogs it gets my boot in it's face.

Even in an offlead dog park..?

Definitely in an offlead dog park.

Larger dogs rushing at smaller dogs are the reason that many owners of small dogs no longer frequent dog parks. Many smaller dogs have been injured at dog parks and when a larger dog rushes at them in a dog park on a later visit, it is terrifying for them and their owner.

Such owners know that they can only take their small dogs there when the bigger dogs are not there and that was not how dog parks were intended to be.

Even small older dogs are entitled to a bit of healthy exercise in a dog park, but often this can no longer happen because of a bad experience at a dog park.

Don't let your dog rush at smaller dogs in a dog park. It is simply not on.

Souff

In my local areas the council actually provide separate big dog and small dog off leash areas. I think this is probably one of the best decisions our local council has made in relation to this. As sadly there are incidents where small dogs are sometimes injured or killed just by accident due to over exuberent play by larger dogs. I'm not sure if many other councils have adopted this idea though.

[raz]

In my local areas the council actually provide separate big dog and small dog off leash areas. I think this is probably one of the best decisions our local council has made in relation to this. As sadly there are incidents where small dogs are sometimes injured or killed just by accident due to over exuberent play by larger dogs. I'm not sure if many other councils have adopted this idea though.

This is such a great idea. I dont know why more councils dont implement it. (maybe because some dog owners are totally irresponsible and would just ignore the restrictions anyway???)

[poodlefan]

In my local areas the council actually provide separate big dog and small dog off leash areas. I think this is probably one of the best decisions our local council has made in relation to this. As sadly there are incidents where small dogs are sometimes injured or killed just by accident due to over exuberent play by larger dogs. I'm not sure if many other councils have adopted this idea though.

This is such a great idea. I dont know why more councils dont implement it. (maybe because some dog owners are totally irresponsible and would just ignore the restrictions anyway???)

We pushed hard for it locally but failed to achieve it. Perhaps we need to try again.

[SparkyTansy]

it certainly isn't fair to generalise about labs rushing etc... but one must acknowledge that part of the joy of purebred dogs is that their temperaments are predictable. Labs are friendly, outgoing dogs, and as a result, can occasionally be over-exuberant. it doesn't mean that all labs will rush, as this is always dependant on their owners and the level of training and manners that dog has been taught.

Just like the same issues we face with breeds that fall under BSL, we must blame the owner, not the dog. The dogs temperament is predictable, and as always, it is human error that contributes to the issues.

Part of owning any purebreed is being aware that not all dogs will always like their particular style of play or behaviours. An ongoing issue I have seen in owners of labs (and probably not the types of people that frequent DOL either), is that they see it as a personal insult that someones dog does not react happily to their friendly lab.

Just like in that fantastic article (of which I have sent the link on to several people i think might enjoy it or benefit from it ), put yourself in your dogs shoes... if this was a human behaviour, would it be acceptable?

[Staranais]

In my local areas the council actually provide separate big dog and small dog off leash areas. I think this is probably one of the best decisions our local council has made in relation to this. As sadly there are incidents where small dogs are sometimes injured or killed just by accident due to over exuberent play by larger dogs. I'm not sure if many other councils have adopted this idea though.

It is a good idea. Depends on the type of offleash space as to how practical it is, though.

The off-leash space I usually take my dog to is a river walk that is designated multi use - the signs indicate that you're allowed to walk your dog off leash, go jogging, ride your bike, or ride your horse there. So separating it isn't really practical, the whole idea is that lots of different sorts of users should be able to share the space.

It usually works OK, most people are pretty polite - I guess the dogs have to be reasonably well behaved so that they don't chase cyclists or joggers, who would give you an earful if your dog harassed them (and rightly so).

[mrs tornsocks]

I just spoke to the council as well and I don't have anything to worry about in an off leash park as she has not actually done anything.

ummm i guess thanks!

Hmmm that's interesting - check your council website. If the woman is as upset as she comes across in your OP I'd suggest you watch your back and cover all bases (infact I'd be staying out of the park unless it's empty). This is what it says on my council website

Using off-leash areas

To ensure off-leash areas are safe and enjoyable for everyone, please consider other users.

Keep your dog in sight

Your dog must be under control by voice

Pick up and dispose of all waste correctly

Do not let your dog rush at or harass other dogs and people

Keep your dog on a lead until it is inside the fenced area and put it back on a lead before leaving

I reported a Lab which rushed me once in a park. I had my dogs on leash and the Lab barreled towards us and TBH scared the cr@p out of me. The owner refused to collect his dog saying 'he's friendly' but all he was, was out of control. It resulted in him getting a $500 fine!

I think Labs are getting a bit of raw deal as they are so popular. Joe Public loves them as family dogs and assumes that everyone else loves their bouncy dogs too. Most Labs I've come across have not been well trained and are more than the owner can handle. I've met only a small few Labs who are well trained and these dogs are owned by very dog savvy people. I think their popularity by non dog savvy people is doing no favours to the breed. A well trained Lab is one of the most gorgeous dogs there are, but they seem to be far and few between these days which is why I've been put off them in a general sense.

Since it's mostly dog-savvy people who use this purebred forum, you'd assume that the majority here who own labs have taken the time to train them properly. That's why the generalisations re lab behaviour are so irritating. Those who have put alot of effort into the breed get swept up with the others who haven't bothered. But guess what ?? The people that haven't bothered clearly aren't reading this forum !!

Let's look at it another way.

I have been put off staffies. I see and hear many generalisations about staffies, in fact I live within 2kms of Blacktown pound, where staffy and staffy crosses are in every second pen - and although I see aggressive tattoo-ed men walking aggressive staffies at our off leash reguarly (and yes, we have been bailed up by them), and signs with 'staffy pups for sale' scrawled on cardboard hanging up outside semi-derelict houses, I would never generalise about staffies here on DOL. That's because I know the staffy people who choose to spend their time on DOL are almost always people who care for and train their dogs properly - so I would never risk offending those responsible owners with generalisations about their chosen breed.

PS. I would never generalise about humans who live in Blacktown or its interstate equivalents either

I actually posted what I did above to make it clear that it's the owners not the breed so I am not sure what you mean by your post. I have no problem with people generalising about my chosen breeds as I am very aware of their shortfalls, I don't get offended by it at all. Each to their own with breeds. I know Dogmad on here doesn't like 'staffies' at all, infact she wasn't even keen on coming on to my property as I have a Rotti. I simply locked him up and accepted that not everybody has to like my breeds and I respected her reservations. People often have negative experiences with certain breeds which can deeply affect people. Maybe I don't get sensitive as I've always had nervous rescue SWF's so can see both sides of the coin, I don't know - maybe I'm just thick skinned

All I mean is, majority of folks here on DOL tend to make some effort with training their dogs - so generalising on DOL that labs 'rush' people (or pointing out any other breed's 'faults') is simply not going to be read by irresponsible owners that it's directed at. I don't know that being irritated / hurt by constant breed bashing necessarily makes me/us thin skinned (just ask my hubby!).

Or in other words - why can't we just be nice ???

(Cue various responses of not being able to hear criticism). BOOOOOORRRRRRING !!!

Merry Xmas !!!!!

[megan_]

I agree Corvus. Unfortunately some of us have dogs that have suffered years of abuse, or who have been attacked before, so teaching them this isn't simple.

But I agree, staying nice and friendly when you want to hit someone is much better for your dog - they do pick up on our stress and react accordingly.

[poodlefan]

Mrs Tornsocks:

Or in other words - why can't we just be nice ???

Had you considered that what was being observed wasn't intended to be nasty? A number of people have noted that the dog to dog behaviour of some Labradors can create issues. Where's the malice in that?

Its the same as noting that sighthounds and Siberian Huskies' prey drive can create issues with small dogs, that SBTs aren't necessarily the best choice for someone who wants a dog park social butterfly or that some breeds tend to be very noisy.

Edited December 21, 2010 by poodlefan

[Keira&Phoenix]

In my local areas the council actually provide separate big dog and small dog off leash areas. I think this is probably one of the best decisions our local council has made in relation to this. As sadly there are incidents where small dogs are sometimes injured or killed just by accident due to over exuberent play by larger dogs. I'm not sure if many other councils have adopted this idea though.

This is such a great idea. I dont know why more councils dont implement it. (maybe because some dog owners are totally irresponsible and would just ignore the restrictions anyway???)

It is only a recent (maybe 2 years) development in our area, I am not sure what actually caused the council to start to build small dog parks but it was a very good idea. Hopefully as one council has done it more councils will follow the lead.

In my local areas the council actually provide separate big dog and small dog off leash areas. I think this is probably one of the best decisions our local council has made in relation to this. As sadly there are incidents where small dogs are sometimes injured or killed just by accident due to over exuberent play by larger dogs. I'm not sure if many other councils have adopted this idea though.

This is such a great idea. I dont know why more councils dont implement it. (maybe because some dog owners are totally irresponsible and would just ignore the restrictions anyway???)

We pushed hard for it locally but failed to achieve it. Perhaps we need to try again.

I would say try again! My local council is Logan City Council, Queensland. Its worth a try now someone has implemented it. And both parks get used regularly and people follow the regulations ie. only big dogs in the big dog park and small dogs in the small dogs park.

In my local areas the council actually provide separate big dog and small dog off leash areas. I think this is probably one of the best decisions our local council has made in relation to this. As sadly there are incidents where small dogs are sometimes injured or killed just by accident due to over exuberent play by larger dogs. I'm not sure if many other councils have adopted this idea though.

It is a good idea. Depends on the type of offleash space as to how practical it is, though.

The off-leash space I usually take my dog to is a river walk that is designated multi use - the signs indicate that you're allowed to walk your dog off leash, go jogging, ride your bike, or ride your horse there. So separating it isn't really practical, the whole idea is that lots of different sorts of users should be able to share the space.

It usually works OK, most people are pretty polite - I guess the dogs have to be reasonably well behaved so that they don't chase cyclists or joggers, who would give you an earful if your dog harassed them (and rightly so).

I think it is a good alternative for those people who own SWF's etc who do not feel comfortable with their dogs being around larger off leash dogs though. Its great that you have somewhere like that to take you dogs though! And that everyone is mostly polite.

[corvus]

I agree Corvus. Unfortunately some of us have dogs that have suffered years of abuse, or who have been attacked before, so teaching them this isn't simple.

I appreciate the predicament. Unfortunately there's nothing much that can be done. You can report every dog that rushes up to yours, but my guess is it won't do you a lot of good in the long run. I am always wary of making enemies.

[poodlefan]

I agree Corvus. Unfortunately some of us have dogs that have suffered years of abuse, or who have been attacked before, so teaching them this isn't simple.

I appreciate the predicament. Unfortunately there's nothing much that can be done. You can report every dog that rushes up to yours, but my guess is it won't do you a lot of good in the long run. I am always wary of making enemies.

I have opted for avoidance. Far less stressful for everyone.

[Souff]

In my local areas the council actually provide separate big dog and small dog off leash areas. I think this is probably one of the best decisions our local council has made in relation to this. As sadly there are incidents where small dogs are sometimes injured or killed just by accident due to over exuberent play by larger dogs. I'm not sure if many other councils have adopted this idea though.

That is a good move and hopefully more councils will do the same. It still takes dog owners to be aware that not all dogs love each other on sight though.

Souff

[megan_]

I agree Corvus. Unfortunately some of us have dogs that have suffered years of abuse, or who have been attacked before, so teaching them this isn't simple.

I appreciate the predicament. Unfortunately there's nothing much that can be done. You can report every dog that rushes up to yours, but my guess is it won't do you a lot of good in the long run. I am always wary of making enemies.

I have opted for avoidance. Far less stressful for everyone.

So have I, but we do need to get out of the house and people walk their dogs off leash on the street. Not much I can do but smile nicely and tell them to F$** off with a sacarin grin.

[Souff]

The Northern Beaches Ranger was terrific! I was hesitant reporting it as I had my Rotti with me and thought she would assume he was the instigator. The Rotti only started getting antsy when the Lab kept barreling my swf who started screaming in fright which got the Lab more excited and my Rotti more protective. The Lab owner then yelled at me that Rotties should be banned and my dog should be muzzled, my dogs didn't touch the Lab at all! The Ranger came straight out,the Lab crashed in to her and she couldn't get him off so it only confirmed to her that my dogs were under control and the Lab was not.

TBH I would not have bothered reporting it if the owner was not such a a-hole about it.

It makes me mad that some people think they can blame anything on the Rottis and excuse their own poor dogmanship.

Sending big Christmas hugs to all the gorgeous Rottis out there!

Souff

[Meea]

Lots of different people use dog parks and consideration for those users goes both ways. I do my best to keep my dogs from intimidating other dogs at the park. It doesn't matter that they are friendly and non-aggressive. Some dogs just see big black giant or little tank and get anxious. It is not fair on them to feel anxious in the park.

Conversely, I am tolerant of dogs rushing up to us. I have carefully socialised my boys so that they know what a friendly rush looks like and are not bothered by it, which helps a lot. There is no need for me to kick or scream. It would not help the situation if I did. My dogs are used to me being relaxed. I don't want to fly off the handle in front of them and possibly scare them myself. It is really not that hard to get along with other dog park users. Just yesterday someone's Great Dane puppy got too boisterous with my little Vallhund and he had a go at her. The GD's owners put her back on leash and apologised, I put my Vallhund back on leash and apologised, explaining that he was a bit intimidated by her size and that I understood it was difficult to manage a dog that was so big but still a puppy. My Vallhund recovered immediately and there was no indication of a lasting effect. Everyone was happy. It's just not that hard! I have never needed to shout, but you can bet that if anyone ever shouted at me I would apologise profusely and take measures to MAKE SURE my dog never bothered that person again. It doesn't matter what the rules are or whether my dogs are breaking them or not. It is just not fair for my dogs to have a negative impact on people or dogs I am sharing the park with.

x two

[poodlefan]

Lots of different people use dog parks and consideration for those users goes both ways. I do my best to keep my dogs from intimidating other dogs at the park. It doesn't matter that they are friendly and non-aggressive. Some dogs just see big black giant or little tank and get anxious. It is not fair on them to feel anxious in the park.

Conversely, I am tolerant of dogs rushing up to us. I have carefully socialised my boys so that they know what a friendly rush looks like and are not bothered by it, which helps a lot. There is no need for me to kick or scream. It would not help the situation if I did. My dogs are used to me being relaxed. I don't want to fly off the handle in front of them and possibly scare them myself. It is really not that hard to get along with other dog park users. Just yesterday someone's Great Dane puppy got too boisterous with my little Vallhund and he had a go at her. The GD's owners put her back on leash and apologised, I put my Vallhund back on leash and apologised, explaining that he was a bit intimidated by her size and that I understood it was difficult to manage a dog that was so big but still a puppy. My Vallhund recovered immediately and there was no indication of a lasting effect. Everyone was happy. It's just not that hard! I have never needed to shout, but you can bet that if anyone ever shouted at me I would apologise profusely and take measures to MAKE SURE my dog never bothered that person again. It doesn't matter what the rules are or whether my dogs are breaking them or not. It is just not fair for my dogs to have a negative impact on people or dogs I am sharing the park with.

;)

:D x two

Clearly those applauding haven't considered that no amount of socialisation is going to turn a timid dog into a confident one, a dog aggressive dog into a friendly one or a breed that wasn't developed to associate with strange dogs into one that seeks their company and welcomes rushed approaches from strangers. If all dog owners exercised the courtesy that Corvus does, they'd all be able to safely use a dog park.

Those of you who have no issues with strange dogs rushing up to yours can count your blessings but don't kid yourselves it's all down to your socialisation technique. Breed and temperament also matter. I've got dogs here that run the range of temperaments from "in your face, LETS PLAY" to "bugger off" with other dogs and they've all pretty much had the same experiences.

You might also consider how you'd feel the first time you see your dog in another dog's mouth being shaken. No amount of socialisation prepares a dog for that. Maybe some small dog owners are a tad paranoid for good reason. ;)

There's a rule in fish keeping that suggests that you not keep fish together if any are small enough to fit in another fish's mouth. Maybe dog parks should apply that rule to their spaces and allow for a range of enclosures.

Although I do recall an indignant owner posting here about being booted out of the small dog enclosure with her puppies. 10 month old Labrador pups I think they were.

Edited December 21, 2010 by poodlefan

[mrs tornsocks]

Mrs Tornsocks:

Or in other words - why can't we just be nice ???

Had you considered that what was being observed wasn't intended to be nasty? A number of people have noted that the dog to dog behaviour of some Labradors can create issues. Where's the malice in that?

Its the same as noting that sighthounds and Siberian Huskies' prey drive can create issues with small dogs, that SBTs aren't necessarily the best choice for someone who wants a dog park social butterfly or that some breeds tend to be very noisy.

I didn't actually say it was nasty - the spectrum between 'nice' and 'nasty' is pretty broad; I just reckon knowing that caring lab (or any other breed) owners are here and contributing means it's just "nicer" not to generalise.

"They barrel up and get right in other dog's faces.. "

It just doesn't sound especially nice does it ???

SWFs: "They are snappy and yappy as soon as another dog goes up to them"

SBTS: "They approach my dog with aggression and want a fight"

BULLBREEDS: "They have attacked children"

POODLES: "They bite"

Semantics I guess.

Edited December 21, 2010 by mrs tornsocks

[poodlefan]

Mrs Tornsocks:

Or in other words - why can't we just be nice ???

Had you considered that what was being observed wasn't intended to be nasty? A number of people have noted that the dog to dog behaviour of some Labradors can create issues. Where's the malice in that?

Its the same as noting that sighthounds and Siberian Huskies' prey drive can create issues with small dogs, that SBTs aren't necessarily the best choice for someone who wants a dog park social butterfly or that some breeds tend to be very noisy.

I didn't actually say it was nasty - the spectrum between 'nice' and 'nasty' is pretty broad; I just reckon knowing that caring lab (or any other breed) owners are here and contributing means it's just "nicer" not to generalise.

"They barrel up and get right in other dog's faces.. "

But here's the thing. That's my experience. If not called off by their owners, that's what they tend to do. If you asked me to name the breed that in my experience is the least likely to respect another dog's personal space I'd name yours.

It's not a singular experience and I'm not the only person who has experienced it. I got called an effwit (amongst other things) for relating my experience. I was told my dogs were neurotic if they couldn't cope with a dog 6 times larger than them pushing them over as a greeting. How is that "nice"?

Let's hark back to the OP's first post:

Anyhow this morning she ran up to two little black toy poodles and the owner went crazy at me and tried to scare my dog away telling me she is aggressive and growls at her dogs and get her shackles up ( i assmue this is the hair on the back of her neck???) and its the 7th time this has happened

OP was told that not all dogs enjoy what some of us consider to be a typical Lab "greeting". For remarking on what appears to be reasonably typical breed behaviour, we copped a shower. According to at least one owner, the poodle owners dogs are neurotic, she can't possibly enjoy life and the OP's dog isn't doing anything she needs to correct. Hardly very helpful I'd say.

Edited December 21, 2010 by poodlefan

[Adza]

Appropriate behaviour in an offleash area is to have your dog recall, put back on a leash and wait for others to enter the area. Take your dog on a leash, introduce the dogs and then let them offleash.

By allowing the dogs to meet on the leash, under absolute control you are allowing the dogs and the other owners control of the situation. You then ask the owner if their dogs want to play, is it ok for them to run around and if all is ok, then let your dogs off.

It is unfair to assume that all dogs in an offleash area want to play, or will react kindly to a dog running up to them - friendly or not. A dog that runs up to another dog is assuming an attacking behaviour (even if they are fun) and the other dogs must go on the defensive from the outset.

Best thing is to put your dog on a lead every time it is to meet a dog in the offlead area.

I agree, would work in a perfect world but no one does it. I can stand there like a fool and no one would do it but it wont turn me away from the dog park because others might not agree to it (mind you I don't go very often, I prefer the local dogs we know). I'd love for dogs to meet that way but just doesn't happen. Locally, we all meet through the fence first, then in the park, ask how the dog is etc and you can usually tell whether they will get on or not then let them off leash.