Toilet Training

[Miss B]

Ok so I have had pup for 2 weeks now and am starting to feel like a bit of a zombie from all the middle-of-the-night toilet breaks. I am the sort of person who doesn't cope very well without a full 8 hours of uninterrupted sleep and I'm wondering if there's a better way of tackling the toilet training.

Pup is 12 weeks old. She sleeps in a small crate in our bedroom, and I take her for a final toilet break around 11pm before I go to bed. Then I usually get up to take her for a toilet break at 2am and again at 4am. I get up at 6:20am for work, she has a toilet break and breakfast and then goes outside into her run for the day.

At the moment I am using puppy training pads, which I put on the floor in our ensuite bathroom. She is pretty good and most of the time will pee on the pads, although she still has the occasional accident in her crate. When she pees on the pads I give her lots of praise and a treat. Originally I was taking her outside for toilet breaks, but half the time she was more interested in playing and I got a bit sick of standing around outside in the cold at 2am waiting for her to pee. She is much better now that we're using the pee pads in the ensuite, there are less distractions and she will usually pee straight away. Although I do understand that this will probably make things a little bit more difficult in the long run.

So I'm just wondering how everyone else tackled toilet training, and whether your method worked well?

[aussielover]

I would keep her crate next to your bed or somewhere you can hear her wake up/ cry.

Only get up when she wakes.

If she is having accidents in her crate, it is possibly too large.

As soon as I moved my puppy into my room (3 months old) she never had an accident (overnight) again.

[W Sibs]

Emmy slept on the bed with me and each time she woke up, we go outside. She is pretty clever as in she goes to the toilet straight away when I take her outside. She wakes me up about 3 times a night for a few months. I had to escape for a weekend to have a proper 8 hours sleeps because I was getting very cranky

She was hell to toilet train and I never thought she would get it. But, she eventually did.

It's all about consistency.

[luvsdogs]

It's easy, just take her outside after eating, drinking, waking up, playing & every hour or 2 at other times. Wait until you see her go, praise & treat., Put it on cue, makes it easier in the long run.

Ditch the puppy pads, check the crate isn't too big. How big is she? a bigger breed wouldn't need to go out more than once a night, I woudn't give her the run of the house until she's reliable, watch her like a hawk & if you can't crate or put her in your bathroom or a room with an easy clean floor.

[wuffles]

Our pup came to us at 12 weeks so she had some foundation done by the breeder. I am a very, very light sleeper so I didn't set an alarm or anything at night, she was sleeping in the crate next to our bed and I took her outside if she stirred. We never had an accident in the crate.

I didn't take my eye off her for a second while she was inside. If I went to shower, OH watched her. We took her out at all the usual times, probably every hour or so. She was sleeping through the night most nights at 13 weeks and every night at 14 weeks.

[Miss B]

I would keep her crate next to your bed or somewhere you can hear her wake up/ cry.

Only get up when she wakes.

If she is having accidents in her crate, it is possibly too large.

Her crate is right next to my bed, but I am a fairly deep sleeper and I do not hear her wake up or cry. She sleeps in a PP20, and she only just fits when she is laying down - so I don't think it's too big.

Emmy slept on the bed with me and each time she woke up, we go outside. She is pretty clever as in she goes to the toilet straight away when I take her outside. She wakes me up about 3 times a night for a few months. I had to escape for a weekend to have a proper 8 hours sleeps because I was getting very cranky

She was hell to toilet train and I never thought she would get it. But, she eventually did.

It's all about consistency.

Did Emmy ever pee on the bed? Winter is allowed on the bed while we are watching tv, and I make sure she gets a toilet break every 45 minutes or so. But she still has the odd accident and pees on the doona, so for this reason I haven't been game to let her sleep on the bed overnight. Ever since she arrived I feel like all I ever do is laundry

I did Kyza's toilet training in the exact same way and he got the hang of it sooo much quicker. The transition from the puppy pee pads (indoors) to toileting outdoors on the grass went really smoothly aswell. All I had to do was say "potty time!" and he would pee straight away!

One of the trainers at puppy preschool recommended a square of astroturf instead of the puppy pee pads, to help prevent her from developing a 'surface preference' (ie wanting to pee on soft surfaces - carpet, doona, bedding etc). I am thinking of giving this a try, hopefully it will help with the transition to outdoor toilet breaks?

It's easy, just take her outside after eating, drinking, waking up, playing & every hour or 2 at other times. Wait until you see her go, praise & treat., Put it on cue, makes it easier in the long run.

I already do this, but the 2am/4am potty breaks are killing me!

Ditch the puppy pads, check the crate isn't too big. How big is she? a bigger breed wouldn't need to go out more than once a night, I woudn't give her the run of the house until she's reliable, watch her like a hawk & if you can't crate or put her in your bathroom or a room with an easy clean floor.

She's a 12 week old Jap Spitz, her crate is pretty much perfect size for her at the moment. She pees a lot ... small bladder I guess Last night she pee'd at 11pm, 12:30am, 2am, 4am and 6am. She is supervised or crated at all times when indoors, and during the day she is outdoors in her run.

[spitzbaby]

MissB I feel for you.. when I got Kairu I had almost 2 months of always interrupted sleep haha..

I stay in an apartment so his toilet area is outside on the balcony, I have fenced off an area for him to toilet in so as soon as he goes out the door, he's there.

Sometimes he gets distracted with sounds of people walking downstairs but generally when he was only 2 months, he will go straight away.

After 2 months of hard work, he is 100% reliable in peeing outside given that the door is open. If not then he will pee at the door..

Hang in there!! I got the flu from all that lack of sleep haha..

[dancinbcs]

For the heavy sleepers there is another way that works. I don't crate my puppies but put them in the laundry just inside the back door, with a baby gate across. Put their bed in the room furthest from the outside door and a patch of newspaper or pee pads just inside the door to outside(furthest away from their bed). Do the usual training during the day and take them out for a pee break last thing before bed. Do not leave water with them and only take them outside if you hear them cry.

I just use newspaper and my puppies have the hang of going on it if they can't get outside. I let them out first thing, first person to stir has to take the puppy out immediately and praise like mad if they go outside. Don't praise for using the newpaper, just ignore it so they know they are not in trouble for going there, but it doesn't get praise.

I have smart Border Collies and have had all my puppies trained to hang on all night by about 10 weeks. The boys can usually hang on all night at about 8 weeks, the girls a couple of weeks later. I know other breeds can be slower but the principle should be the same.

Also feed the last meal one hour before bed. This stops them needing to poop through the night.

With a puppy needing to pee more than once or twice through the night and peeing in crates and on beds, I would be getting a vet check done. She may have a UTI which is quite common in bitch puppies and makes training impossible.

[aussielover]

She's a 12 week old Jap Spitz, her crate is pretty much perfect size for her at the moment. She pees a lot ... small bladder I guess :D Last night she pee'd at 11pm, 12:30am, 2am, 4am and 6am. She is supervised or crated at all times when indoors, and during the day she is outdoors in her run.

that is abnormal.

I would take her to the vet and see if there is a medical reason.

Could it be stress?

You could try a DAP diffuser to something if you rule out medical causes

[B-Q]

I had a close eye on Quinn, took her out whenever she got up and started sniffing around, woke up, finished eating, got a drink, went near the door etc. It took me a while to get into routine and I lost a lst of sleep for the first 6 weeks but she's reliable now.

She's the first puppy I've trained without being harsh, previous dogs we rubbed their nose in it and they got in trouble. I didn't want to train this way and this time I was really gentle, took her out and set her up to do right, when she had accidents we quickly raced outside and she did catch on.

[Miss B]

I got the flu from all that lack of sleep haha..

Oh you poor thing! I am just wandering around like a zombie most of the time :D

Thanks for the tips dancinbcs.

With a puppy needing to pee more than once or twice through the night and peeing in crates and on beds, I would be getting a vet check done. She may have a UTI which is quite common in bitch puppies and makes training impossible.

that is abnormal.

I would take her to the vet and see if there is a medical reason.

Could it be stress?

You could try a DAP diffuser to something if you rule out medical causes

Yeah I was wondering the same thing but I took her to work on Thursday and had her checked out, all is ok.

I don't think it's stress, she's settled in really well and is a pretty content little puppy.

previous dogs we rubbed their nose in it and they got in trouble.

Yeah I had someone ask me if I'd tried rubbing her nose in it... ummm, NO! Lol.

[lady0421]

My JS is 10 weeks old. She is an inside dog and has a xlarge playpen with her crate inside it (kind of like a master suite) - this is located in the family room.

My OH has been sleeping on a mattress (besides the playpen) since her first arrival – we have been slowly increasing the distance between the playpen and mattress overtime. Puppy would wake up in the middle of the night, stand up to see my OH as if to check to make sure he is still there, then goes back to sleep. Her crying has also decreased overtime.

We use newspaper to cover 50% of the playpen and our puppy knows only to pee/poo on the newspaper. Otherwise we have a designated area (toilet pad using newspaper) just outside the playpen for her to do her deed (gets praise and lots of attention every time she pees there).

At 10 weeks, puppy has her last pee at 10pm at the designated area and would then sleep through the night until 4-5am in the morning – she wakes up to do a pee/poo inside the playpen and then wakes my OH up so that he knows to clean the newspaper for her – once cleaned, puppy has a quick play then goes straight back to sleep.

[Miss B]

At 10 weeks, puppy has her last pee at 10pm at the designated area and would then sleep through the night until 4-5am in the morning – she wakes up to do a pee/poo inside the playpen and then wakes my OH up so that he knows to clean the newspaper for her – once cleaned, puppy has a quick play then goes straight back to sleep.

Oh I wish Winter would last that long.

Your girl is a half-sister to mine, by the way

ETA: I am going to stop giving her access to water overnight and see if that helps. She has a bowl in the bathroom and has a big drink everytime she wakes up in the night for a pee, which probably isn't helping.

Edited December 11, 2010 by Miss B

[lady0421]

Your girl is a half-sister to mine, by the way

ETA: I am going to stop giving her access to water overnight and see if that helps. She has a bowl in the bathroom and has a big drink everytime she wakes up in the night for a pee, which probably isn't helping.

Is she?!?!? Ohhhh!! I honestly didn't know that!! Do they share the same mother or father??

[Miss B]

Success!! We had a much better night last night I removed her water at bedtime, and I only had to get up once during the night to take her for a toilet break. She then slept through until 6am. She didn't have an accident in her crate either. Yay!!

Is she?!?!? Ohhhh!! I honestly didn't know that!! Do they share the same mother or father??

They have the same dad

[spitzbaby]

Success!! We had a much better night last night I removed her water at bedtime, and I only had to get up once during the night to take her for a toilet break. She then slept through until 6am. She didn't have an accident in her crate either. Yay!!

Is she?!?!? Ohhhh!! I honestly didn't know that!! Do they share the same mother or father??

They have the same dad

oh!! everybody is related here it's scary!

[Miss B]

oh!! everybody is related here it's scary!

It's a small world in JS Land

[lady0421]

Success!! We had a much better night last night I removed her water at bedtime, and I only had to get up once during the night to take her for a toilet break. She then slept through until 6am. She didn't have an accident in her crate either. Yay!!

Is she?!?!? Ohhhh!! I honestly didn't know that!! Do they share the same mother or father??

They have the same dad

oh!! everybody is related here it's scary!

So Winter and Monya share Maui as their daddy!!!

Wow, guess we're one big family!! Is Kairu related somewhere into the family too?!?!?!

[Miss B]

So Winter and Monya share Maui as their daddy!!!

Wow, guess we're one big family!! Is Kairu related somewhere into the family too?!?!?!

They certainly do!!

Winter and Monya are also distantly related to Kairu... their great-great-grandad is Kairu's dad

[sas]

We toilet train a few dogs having fosters so we don't crate train them as sometimes they're not with us long enough to do the training, so we do the following:

1) Do not give them full access to the house, close off bedrooms and bathrooms, anywhere the dog can sneak off and toilet.

2) Always have the dog with us when home so we can watch it.

3) After waking, playing and eating take the toilet down to the yard and say "Toilet" and then wait for the toileting to happen and give calm praise "Good Toilet" when they are going and then once they have finished we lay on the praise big time and then have a play in the yard to show to backyard is a good place to be.

4) Every hour we are home and awake we take the dog to the yard and repeat step #3, if the dog does not go within 5 minutes we go back inside and watch the dog.

5) After the first week the dog is usually getting a bit of a feel for the process so we move to taking the dog down every 2 hours and setting the kitchen timer to remind us if we're busy doing something.

6) Any inside toileting will get a firm "No", pick the dog up and flip it over to stop it toileting (if small or a puppy) and take down to the yard and do step #3. We do not go over board with the "No" because we want the dog to know it did the wrong thing rather than scare the dog into not toileting in front of us in the future.

7) The dog remains outside whilst we clean up with a special accident spray. We don't allow the dog to watch us clean up as it can become a game.

We believe if you want your dog to toilet in the yard you should never use toileting pads or newspaper as it is confusing to the dog.

With puppies we remove the water bowl an hour before bed and ensure the dog toilets before bed - that means sometimes standing in the yard for 10 minutes waiting.

When waiting for the puppy to toilet we don't play with it, we may walk around a bit if it's just sitting or standing there.

If you are crate training and the dog toilets in the crate then there are a few things to consider:

1) A crate for crate training should only be big enough for the dog to stand and turn around, this is because dogs do not like to toilet where they sleep.

2) You are not taking the dog out often enough. Overnight you may need to set your alarm clock twice per night and take your puppy out.

If you are doing the above and your dog is still toileting in its' crate it may have been raised in a dirty whelping area where it was forced to toilet where it ate and sleep such as Petshop windows and some puppy farm and backyard breeders. It can take a long time to re-train these dogs.

Originally I was taking her outside for toilet breaks, but half the time she was more interested in playing and I got a bit sick of standing around outside in the cold at 2am waiting for her to pee.

Tough....you're her teacher, you need to stand out there like other puppy owners at 2am and wait for the dog to toilet. Don't interact with her if she wants to play or put her on a lead and remove the toys from the yard before you go to bed.

I am using puppy training pads, which I put on the floor in our ensuite bathroom.

You're giving her free licence to make mistakes. I'd have her in a crate next to you bed, you can even raise the crate up so she is level beside you.

Although I do understand that this will probably make things a little bit more difficult in the long run.

Then give yourself a swift kick up the bum and stop being so slack. You're making things difficult and frustrating for your puppy, that's not very fair. If you want to build trust and respect with your dog then you need to set it up for success rather than create confusion and frustration.

a bigger breed wouldn't need to go out more than once a night

That's not correct. Puppies are puppies regardless of size, none of them have great bladder control early on. My Great Dane puppy needed to go out twice a night in the early stages.

ETA: I am going to stop giving her access to water overnight and see if that helps. She has a bowl in the bathroom and has a big drink everytime she wakes up in the night for a pee, which probably isn't helping.

That is definately part of your problem, pick up the water bowl an hour before bed.

Edited December 12, 2010 by sas