Pitbull X Help

[Lindainfa]

My sisters friend recently bought a pitbull X staffy from a dodgy backyard breeder. He was wanting a puppy for a little while and my sister recommended he go to Lort Smith and find a dog suitable to his needs. Stupidly the next day, he heard a friend of his was selling puppies, went to have a look and fell in love. He is very naive about dogs and only found out Pitbulls are illegal in victoria when we both screamed at him. Firstly for buying off someone dodgy, secondly for buying on impulse.

Apparently the father dog is a full Pitbull, the mother is Pitbull x Staffy. He saw the parents first hand. The puppy is 7 weeks old.

His problem now is that he is worried that he won't be able to register the pup, take it to the vet etc. He actually rang the guy who sold the pup to him and told him he was having second thoughts because he didnt realise the dog was illegal, could he give the pup back to him, and the guy told him " Its your problem now."

He does not know if this dog is from fighting lines, totally ignorant about this stuff.

Besides reporting these people, which he wants to do. What do you think should happen with this puppy? Can it be taken to the vet and be treated as

a normal dog?

What do you think the temperament would be like? He is worried now that he is going to be vicious. Is it better off to get this puppy PTS now or taken to some kind of rescue???

I really don't know much about this breed so I dont know what to tell him.

[KKDD]

No doubt some will disagree, but I would register the dog as a staffy x (which it is) and raise it well so that it stays out of trouble. Desex it early too. There is no reason for this dog to grow up any more aggressive than if it was another breed equally well raised. There is also no reason that he wont be able to take the dog to a vet should it be necessary, and he should certainly take it to training and socialise it as much as possible. if he saw the parents and they seemed nice enough for him to want one of their pups, chances are the pup will grow up just as nice or nicer, if he puts the work in. Pitbulls are not another species, they are just a breed of dog that is often owned by deadsh*ts and attracts sesnationalist media attention. Please dont believe all the sensationalist stuff you can read about pitbulls - they can actually make lovely family pets.

[Staranais]

Will the council demand it be PTS, or does it just have to be muzzled in public/neutered etc? I'm not sure of the laws in your area, hopefully someone local could help you out.

If the pup would otherwise be seized or PTS, you could consider registering it with the council and at the vets as a crossbreed stafford dog. After all, so far as he knows, it is a crossbreed stafford dog. He possibly doesn't need to say what it's crossbred with unless the specifically ask?

If he keeps it he should make very damn sure it does nothing to come to the attention of the authorities - i.e., be a very responsible and conscientious dog owner, and make sure the pup is both very well socialised, and very well trained.

[poodlefan]

No doubt some will disagree, but I would register the dog as a staffy x (which it is) and raise it well so that it stays out of trouble. Desex it early too. There is no reason for this dog to grow up any more aggressive than if it was another breed equally well raised.

There is EVERY reason the dog will grow up to be more dog aggressive than if it was another breed equally well raised.

To deny that is to deny generations of selecting for precisely that trait. The up side it it should be far less people aggressive than many other breeds have the potential to be.

However, if heavily socialised, extensively trained and managed to prevent dog aggression this pup could make a great family pet. However to expect it to be the social butterfly of the dog park is to court disappointment.

The pup may not grow up to have a dog aggressive bone in its body. However the odds are against that.

Edited December 8, 2010 by poodlefan

[MissMaddy]

Given that it's illegal to sell, breed or rehome any pit bull or cross in most states, wouldn't that mean that the council would be able to seize the puppy if they believe it to be pitbul (or x) and pts, and the owner (and breeder if found) will then face fines, etc? So as your sister's friend can not prove otherwise, as it is 3/4 pitbull, he could himself get in trouble too. The fact that BSL laws are pointless and stupid makes no difference unfortunately.

I'm sure someone with better knowledge of BSL will come in here, but maybe also put this in the BSL subforum.

[halfthewords]

What colour is it, and its nose? If it is blue, black brindle, brindle, or any colour except tan/liver, it will be easy enough to register it as a staffy x. Half the dogs who wash up in pounds look pitbull but are not classed as such due to colour. Having a red nose with a tan/liver coat is almost an immediate death sentence.

I hate to say it, but if it's from a BYB situation, the dog may well be from fighting lines. However I think all life deserves a chance, and as long as the owner researches and does his homework, the pup can be raised correctly and be a normal canine citizen. I don't think it being a pitbull makes it more likely to be aggressive. I've met more aggressive Labradors and Huskies than I have staffies.

[Staranais]

If it's from fighting lines, it's more likely to be DA than your average dog. That's what fighting lines means - it will have been bred specifically to fight other dogs, sometimes to the death.

But as Poodlefan says, DA doesn't translate into HA - I've met many pitbulls that were lovely and extremely stable around people.

I'd call the council if I were you, and enquire about the laws surrounding pitbulls in your area. You don't need to tell them who you are, or why you're calling.

[WreckitWhippet]

No doubt some will disagree, but I would register the dog as a staffy x (which it is) and raise it well so that it stays out of trouble. Desex it early too. There is no reason for this dog to grow up any more aggressive than if it was another breed equally well raised. There is also no reason that he wont be able to take the dog to a vet should it be necessary, and he should certainly take it to training and socialise it as much as possible. if he saw the parents and they seemed nice enough for him to want one of their pups, chances are the pup will grow up just as nice or nicer, if he puts the work in. Pitbulls are not another species, they are just a breed of dog that is often owned by deadsh*ts and attracts sesnationalist media attention. Please dont believe all the sensationalist stuff you can read about pitbulls - they can actually make lovely family pets.

Given the ancestory, there is every chance that the dog will be more dog aggressive. It goes with the territory and whilst many of them ( PB's & SBT's ) are a "gentleman unless set upon" there are plenty that aren't and very few who will not finish what someone else started.

If the dog is 3/4 PB, then it should be registered as a PB cross.

Tell him to take the puppy back to it's breeder and get a refund. Either buy himself a pedigree Amstaff or SBT with papers or adopt a puppy/adult from a reputable rescue , to ensure that his new best friend is not in any danger of being delcared a 'restricted" breed.

[Her Majesty Dogmad]

Report the bybs to the council, that's the first responsible thing to do.

As for being deceitful about the breed of puppy, I have nothing to say except I don't believe that is the right thing to do.

[Alyosha]

You can't give it to a rescue as it's illegal to give them away.

Although it is a stafford cross, it doesn't matter the percentage, so I can't see the issue with registering it as that. It's not lying.

I have met a great many lovely pitbulls through working in the ACT (where there is no BSL) and have little but praise for them. The people that own them are usually not anywhere near as nice. I am not a bull breed person but make an exception for pits, I just adore them and would be tempted to own one if I didn't live in NSW.

I agree with the sentiments on colour, a tan / red pit cross with a red nose is far more likely to be pulled up than a dark one. And yes, early dog socialisation, and sticking with it, is vital.

[Danois]

Lots of socialisation and chipping it is not going to help it if it comes to the attention of the council for some reason. Your friend will have a losing battle on his hands to show it is not a PB.

Chip it what he will but be prepared that his dog could be taken from him at any time and possibly destroyed.

IMO though - if it is a cross breed dog then you chip with the most predominant breed and this one is 3/4 PB. Also remember chipping is used to identify the animal if lost - staffy x chip is not going to help in those circumstances.

[Tim'sMum]

People I know had a full Pitbull. The daughter of the family was living in Qld at the time and 'rescued' this pup from ferals who wanted a fighting dog, and had bought it from a BYB....somehow talking them into giving it to her. The pup was only 6 weeks old at the time. She drove all the way back to Sydney and then back to Brisbane over a weekend, so she could deliver the pup to her mum to care for....as she was well educated on bull breeds, having always had them.

This dog was the most amazing dog.....she was perfectly trained, fully socialised with other dogs, loved kids, loved anyone who would give her attention. She went to work with the son of the family quite often. He is a gardener and has a lot of old ladies as customers. Some of them had a special water bowl bought just for the dog and kept treats for her. She would keep the little old ladies company while their gardens were being looked after.

She was chipped and registered as a Ridgeback X due to her coat colour.

The mum did worry that someone might tag her as a Pitbull...(which I did straight away), but as her nature was so placid we all hoped that it would never happen, and it didn't.

The mum's care with training and socialisation from day one paid off and this dog responded beautifully.

I would suggest that this fellow work extremely hard at socialisation and training from today if he wants to keep the dog. If the dog is from fighting lines and unless he is prepared to put in the hard work now...he is better off not having it.

[Robbi]

Personally I would never mention the "P" word any where near the pup-at vets, obedience, registration, all that needs to be said is that pup is a bull breed x.

There is no doubting or denying that Pit Bulls can be dog aggressive but there are many ways of turning a Pit Bull type dog into a canine good citizen. There is a Pit Bull rescue group on the internet called bad rap, they give many hints and training advice for bull breeds.

Dont buy into the theory that all Pit Bulls are bad this is simply not true, what is true that owning some sorts of dog require the owner to step up and be more pro-active when it comes to training and obedience,never let this type of dog off leash in public, accpet that these dogs are never going to be dog park butterflies and pre-empt volatile situations with other dogs, a Pit Bull may not start the fight but it sure as heck will finish it and its first fight in public is a signed death warrent.

Goodluck with this pup and dont judge it too harshly, like all pups it needs guidance, training and most importantly love and kindness( the two things too many pittie pups never recieve)

[poodlefan]

You can't give it to a rescue as it's illegal to give them away.

Although it is a stafford cross, it doesn't matter the percentage, so I can't see the issue with registering it as that. It's not lying.

I have met a great many lovely pitbulls through working in the ACT (where there is no BSL) and have little but praise for them. The people that own them are usually not anywhere near as nice. I am not a bull breed person but make an exception for pits, I just adore them and would be tempted to own one if I didn't live in NSW.

I agree with the sentiments on colour, a tan / red pit cross with a red nose is far more likely to be pulled up than a dark one. And yes, early dog socialisation, and sticking with it, is vital.

I like them too Aloysha. Rock solid dogs with kids if they've been raised right.

Is there a breed ID called "unknown"?

[Aussienot]

I am making an assumption that the new owner is a youngish man who knows little about dogs. He will have to make a big step into socialising, training and responsible dog handler. It's a big ask if you didn't know what you were in for.

Was he aware that he was choosing a lifestyle, and not just a pet?

[persephone]

He is very naive about dogs

May I suggest he has NOT purchased a pup suitable for his (lack of) knowledge/ability.

I fear this will end in tears .

poor little pup.

Silly, impulsive man.

[poodlefan]

He is very naive about dogs

May I suggest he has NOT purchased a pup suitable for his (lack of) knowledge/ability.

I fear this will end in tears .

poor little pup.

Silly, impulsive man.

Well he can either start learning and start doing right by the dog or become one of the kind of owners that saw APBTs banned in the first place.

His choice.

[megan_]

I am making an assumption that the new owner is a youngish man who knows little about dogs. He will have to make a big step into socialising, training and responsible dog handler. It's a big ask if you didn't know what you were in for.

Was he aware that he was choosing a lifestyle, and not just a pet?

I recommend he gets professional help NOW. Most people (and some dodgy trainers) think socialisation = playing with lots of dogs at the park.

If this guy doesn't have a clue then he needs help now.

[Quickasyoucan]

What is the law in Victoria on pitbull x's can they get a NOI and have the pup temperament tested, ie take the initiative?

Or is does it not matter in Vic whether it is full pittbull or x?

Hopefully someone will know.

I know some people here in NSW have had sucess with getting rescues temp tested under a NOI and that then removes the fear of being declared restricted. However, I do not know what the law in Vic is.

Edited December 8, 2010 by Quickasyoucan

[RR-Melbourne]

Hi

The dog that your friend has may not even be remotely close to a Pit Bull. The BYB is by no means a responsible person by the sounds of it and may describe his dogs as Pit Bulls beacuse he wants to portray that image. The dog could be classified as a cross bred Bull Breed, Staffy X or Bull Arab etc. However assuming the pup may be identified as a Pit Bull read on.

I live in Victoria on the fringe of the Melbourne CBD. The City of Melbourne is our local council. A dog that my dog socialises with is a Pit Bull a classic full PB that is tan coloured and easily identified, her name is Sascha. Sascha is adorbale and her female owner has put a lot of work care and love into her. Sascha is chipped and registerd with the council as a restricted breed and the restriction for Sascha is that if she is off lead in the appropriate designated area she must be muzzled. If she shows agression DA or HA (without any attack happening) and is reported then she will be declared a dangerous dog and must wear a red and yellow collar and be muzzled off and on leash in public and must have an escape proof pen at home. If she ever is involved in any type of attack or even rushing and reported it will be her death sentence.

Sascha has been heavily socialised purposely with a cross section of different people form children to the elderly and across many nationalities. She has greetd and been exposed to literally hundreds of people and dogs, especially being inner suburbs. If anyone is ever around the Victoria Market on weekends keep a look out for Sacha as she calmly walks amongst the large crowds and eagerly greets children.

Lots of training has gone into Sascha and a trainer/ behaviourist constantly consulted. Your friend must be willing to put a lot of time effort and expense into this dog including a lot of educatin into himself and always have an awarenes of his dog and keep a step ahead of the dogs triggers and impulses.

Good Luck, give the pup a chance and with effort your friend will have a loyal and devoted companion.

Marc