Dog Fight

[Tapferhund]

I'm very sorry for you, I hope your dog survives.

Dogs do sometimes squabble, however if one of them is getting this seriously hurt, it's more than a squabble. If your foxie survives (or even if he doesn't) I'd suggest you consider getting a behaviourist in to help find out what's going on with your Akita. Your partner might also be happier with you keeping the Akita if they can see you're doing something to make the Akita less likely to hurt another dog again.

Siks3,

I'm sorry about your fathers little Foxie and you are right about two male dogs..especially if they have not grown together...........but as soon as I saw Akita.....it didn't surprize me. Now before everyone pounces on me.......I have known dozens of Akita's in the past through friends having them as well as being at Akita shows when the breed was very popular.......and I have not met ONE I would trust. They are a big powerful breed with very few having good temperament with other dogs and sometimes with people.

I think it is very sad you have to give the Foxie away....especially as he is an old dog and has had the trauma of loosing his owner (your father).......and now he is about to lose you too in being re housed with someone else.

Sad situation all round.

I disagree with your male dog perspective Tapferhund, the males growing up together from pups are more likely to fight in my experience than an older/younger combination. Akitas are not a whole lot different to working line GSD's, Rottys, Malinois, Dutch Shepherds and some Bull breeds that have genetic fighting drive, more than likely you are comparing more classical Akita's with watered down pet versions of the breeds I mentioned. Any breed with genetic fighting drive if pushed too hard with bullying or being shoved around unfairly will defend themselves and make a good job of it, lets not put Akita's in the traditional Pit Bull charade with more unsubstantiated comments of negativity based on breed.

Well I disagree with your perspective 55C ! In my experience same litter males growing up together , same litter females growing up together are less likely to fight than bringing two older male or female dogs together and expect them to live happily together.......although I have this situation too.....with no problem.

I have had up to five entire males run together...even when I have had bitches in season ...and all with no problem. It comes down to leadership by the owner imo. The only time I would separate was when no one was at home. Other than that they all lived happily together.

The OP had an old small dog and a younger (I'm assuming) larger dog. So do you honestly believe an old dog would be annoying (bullying) the younger dog? Truth be known the poor old foxie didn't want to be bothered with the Akita continually annoying it .

As for your comments that Akitas are not a whole lot different to the working breeds you have mentioned......along with these breeds having genetic 'fighting drive'.......

.........what a load of codswallop !!!!!!!!!!! Akita's were bred to hunt bear as well as other large wild animals....whereas each and everyone of those working breeds were bred to herd!

Quote from an Akita website. Perhaps if the OP had done some research on his chosen breed the poor foxie might have been spared from being mauled.

The Akita Inu have a reputation for sometimes being aggressive towards smaller animals or other dogs, particularly those of the same sex.

Read post No. 9 The OP states that the foxie started it.

Read post No. 3 where OP says "Yea mate I heard the poor fella screaming I had to lift my akita off the ground and choke him to get him to let go."

So how would the OP know the foxie started it when he didn't SEE it but only 'heard' it???

[Skitch]

I'm very sorry for you, I hope your dog survives.

Dogs do sometimes squabble, however if one of them is getting this seriously hurt, it's more than a squabble. If your foxie survives (or even if he doesn't) I'd suggest you consider getting a behaviourist in to help find out what's going on with your Akita. Your partner might also be happier with you keeping the Akita if they can see you're doing something to make the Akita less likely to hurt another dog again.

Siks3,

I'm sorry about your fathers little Foxie and you are right about two male dogs..especially if they have not grown together...........but as soon as I saw Akita.....it didn't surprize me. Now before everyone pounces on me.......I have known dozens of Akita's in the past through friends having them as well as being at Akita shows when the breed was very popular.......and I have not met ONE I would trust. They are a big powerful breed with very few having good temperament with other dogs and sometimes with people.

I think it is very sad you have to give the Foxie away....especially as he is an old dog and has had the trauma of loosing his owner (your father).......and now he is about to lose you too in being re housed with someone else.

Sad situation all round.

I disagree with your male dog perspective Tapferhund, the males growing up together from pups are more likely to fight in my experience than an older/younger combination. Akitas are not a whole lot different to working line GSD's, Rottys, Malinois, Dutch Shepherds and some Bull breeds that have genetic fighting drive, more than likely you are comparing more classical Akita's with watered down pet versions of the breeds I mentioned. Any breed with genetic fighting drive if pushed too hard with bullying or being shoved around unfairly will defend themselves and make a good job of it, lets not put Akita's in the traditional Pit Bull charade with more unsubstantiated comments of negativity based on breed.

Well I disagree with your perspective 55C ! In my experience same litter males growing up together , same litter females growing up together are less likely to fight than bringing two older male or female dogs together and expect them to live happily together.......although I have this situation too.....with no problem.

I have had up to five entire males run together...even when I have had bitches in season ...and all with no problem. It comes down to leadership by the owner imo. The only time I would separate was when no one was at home. Other than that they all lived happily together.

The OP had an old small dog and a younger (I'm assuming) larger dog. So do you honestly believe an old dog would be annoying (bullying) the younger dog? Truth be known the poor old foxie didn't want to be bothered with the Akita continually annoying it .

As for your comments that Akitas are not a whole lot different to the working breeds you have mentioned......along with these breeds having genetic 'fighting drive'.......

.........what a load of codswallop !!!!!!!!!!! Akita's were bred to hunt bear as well as other large wild animals....whereas each and everyone of those working breeds were bred to herd!

Quote from an Akita website. Perhaps if the OP had done some research on his chosen breed the poor foxie might have been spared from being mauled.

The Akita Inu have a reputation for sometimes being aggressive towards smaller animals or other dogs, particularly those of the same sex.

Read post No. 9 The OP states that the foxie started it.

Read post No. 3 where OP says "Yea mate I heard the poor fella screaming I had to lift my akita off the ground and choke him to get him to let go."

So how would the OP know the foxie started it when he didn't SEE it but only 'heard' it???

What the hell does it matter? The dogs had a huge fight that resulted in the foxie nearly dying and requiring some extensive vet work.. the owner has paid the vet bills, restored the foxie to good health and found it a new home where it will be much safer. What more could you ask for!? What would have you done in this situation?

[Tapferhund]

Tapferhund, How do you know the OP didn't fully research their breed ? they seem to have had a very happy family pet that suited them until this little dog came along.

You are making some very harsh judgements and assumptions here.

fifi

Well that's yours and some of the others opinion but the OP quite obviously 'had a problem' when that 'little dog' came along.........so why leave the two dogs unsupervised when there was clearly a problem?

Its also very easy for people to 'rehome' as the easiest solution and I am not against that solution as most of you think I am........but just remember this foxie is an OLD dog and unless another family member of the Op is willing to take the dog .......there are not many people out there who ARE willing to take an old dog.

[Erny]

Lol .... Maybe the OP needs to change the thread title to "Dol Fight".

[Tapferhund]

I'm very sorry for you, I hope your dog survives.

Dogs do sometimes squabble, however if one of them is getting this seriously hurt, it's more than a squabble. If your foxie survives (or even if he doesn't) I'd suggest you consider getting a behaviourist in to help find out what's going on with your Akita. Your partner might also be happier with you keeping the Akita if they can see you're doing something to make the Akita less likely to hurt another dog again.

Siks3,

I'm sorry about your fathers little Foxie and you are right about two male dogs..especially if they have not grown together...........but as soon as I saw Akita.....it didn't surprize me. Now before everyone pounces on me.......I have known dozens of Akita's in the past through friends having them as well as being at Akita shows when the breed was very popular.......and I have not met ONE I would trust. They are a big powerful breed with very few having good temperament with other dogs and sometimes with people.

I think it is very sad you have to give the Foxie away....especially as he is an old dog and has had the trauma of loosing his owner (your father).......and now he is about to lose you too in being re housed with someone else.

Sad situation all round.

I disagree with your male dog perspective Tapferhund, the males growing up together from pups are more likely to fight in my experience than an older/younger combination. Akitas are not a whole lot different to working line GSD's, Rottys, Malinois, Dutch Shepherds and some Bull breeds that have genetic fighting drive, more than likely you are comparing more classical Akita's with watered down pet versions of the breeds I mentioned. Any breed with genetic fighting drive if pushed too hard with bullying or being shoved around unfairly will defend themselves and make a good job of it, lets not put Akita's in the traditional Pit Bull charade with more unsubstantiated comments of negativity based on breed.

Well I disagree with your perspective 55C ! In my experience same litter males growing up together , same litter females growing up together are less likely to fight than bringing two older male or female dogs together and expect them to live happily together.......although I have this situation too.....with no problem.

I have had up to five entire males run together...even when I have had bitches in season ...and all with no problem. It comes down to leadership by the owner imo. The only time I would separate was when no one was at home. Other than that they all lived happily together.

The OP had an old small dog and a younger (I'm assuming) larger dog. So do you honestly believe an old dog would be annoying (bullying) the younger dog? Truth be known the poor old foxie didn't want to be bothered with the Akita continually annoying it .

As for your comments that Akitas are not a whole lot different to the working breeds you have mentioned......along with these breeds having genetic 'fighting drive'.......

.........what a load of codswallop !!!!!!!!!!! Akita's were bred to hunt bear as well as other large wild animals....whereas each and everyone of those working breeds were bred to herd!

Quote from an Akita website. Perhaps if the OP had done some research on his chosen breed the poor foxie might have been spared from being mauled.

The Akita Inu have a reputation for sometimes being aggressive towards smaller animals or other dogs, particularly those of the same sex.

Read post No. 9 The OP states that the foxie started it.

Read post No. 3 where OP says "Yea mate I heard the poor fella screaming I had to lift my akita off the ground and choke him to get him to let go."

So how would the OP know the foxie started it when he didn't SEE it but only 'heard' it???

What the hell does it matter? The dogs had a huge fight that resulted in the foxie nearly dying and requiring some extensive vet work.. the owner has paid the vet bills, restored the foxie to good health and found it a new home where it will be much safer. What more could you ask for!? What would have you done in this situation?

Okay ..no need to get your knickers in a knot. I have obviously MISSED the post where it says the foxie has a new home. ?????

Sheez you people are not only pious but extremely touchy !

[Tapferhund]

Lol .... Maybe the OP needs to change the thread title to "Dol Fight".

You wish !

It would be a dull old DOL if everyone conformed to the one thinking. Its almost that way now ! So there has to be someone left with a different point of view. It keeps life interesting !

Edited November 28, 2010 by Tapferhund

[koalathebear]

It would be a dull old DOL if everyone conformed to the one thinking. Its almost that way now ! So there has to be someone left with a different point of view. It keeps life interesting !

Given the somewhat high number of posts that end in snotty argument or at least highly spirited debate on DOL, it's definitely not the case that DOL is even close to conforming to one way of thinking ... Dog-lovers aren't a homogeneous, monochromatic group of people who speak in one voice. There are plenty of people, myself included _{(yes I'm bad, I own a crossbreed as well as a purebred and sometimes I think labradoodleslabxpoodles are a bit cute)}, who don't necessarily agree with the views of everyone else on the forum - we just try to be a bit more civil about it. That doesn't make us pious.

Expressing yourself in the manner you did and in this post in a different thread would have been informative albeit provocative to some. In this post, in expressing what you call a 'different view', you weren't being a rebellious, revolutionary independent-minded thinker - you were simply being rude and insensitive. There's nothing revolutionary or special about that sort of behaviour - it just puts you in a class with millions, possibly billions of other humans on this planet ... Again, if you have a particular gripe about certain breeds like the Akita or if you believe that situations like this should be handled differently, you should certainly post your views - but in a different thread where people can have a proper discussion and debate. This thread should be left for the OP to receive support and guidance in what must be an extremely painful and sorrowful predicament.

You've certainly got a right to express your views in any way you want and in any thread you want - but the rest of us also have the right to voice our disapprobation of your manner of expression.

Edited November 28, 2010 by koalathebear

[Skye GSD]

We recently had family move to WA and they stayed with us while job and house hunting. Loved having them but they have a miniature foxie that absolutely hated my GSD on sight. Skye was only 12 months old, foxie was six years old and a spoilt lap dog. She was so ferocious that had it been my GSD that displayed this behaviour she would have been muzzled! Foxie attacked several times and came away with Skye's hair in her mouth and fortunately for the foxie, we were able to redirect Skye each time so there was no bad outcome. If Skye had reacted we would probably have had a seriously injured foxie but it annoys the hell out of me when the bigger dog is blamed for reacting. Skye is now much happier that she has her home back to normal as I am sure the Akita will be!

[OSoSwift]

It would be a dull old DOL if everyone conformed to the one thinking. Its almost that way now ! So there has to be someone left with a different point of view. It keeps life interesting !

Given the somewhat high number of posts that end in snotty argument or at least highly spirited debate on DOL, it's definitely not the case that DOL is even close to conforming to one way of thinking ... Dog-lovers aren't a homogeneous, monochromatic group of people who speak in one voice. There are plenty of people, myself included _{(yes I'm bad, I own a crossbreed as well as a purebred and sometimes I think labradoodleslabxpoodles are a bit cute)}, who don't necessarily agree with the views of everyone else on the forum - we just try to be a bit more civil about it. That doesn't make us pious.

Expressing yourself in the manner you did and in this post in a different thread would have been informative albeit provocative to some. In this post, in expressing what you call a 'different view', you weren't being a rebellious, revolutionary independent-minded thinker - you were simply being rude and insensitive. There's nothing revolutionary or special about that sort of behaviour - it just puts you in a class with millions, possibly billions of other humans on this planet ... Again, if you have a particular gripe about certain breeds like the Akita or if you believe that situations like this should be handled differently, you should certainly post your views - but in a different thread where people can have a proper discussion and debate. This thread should be left for the OP to receive support and guidance in what must be an extremely painful and sorrowful predicament.

You've certainly got a right to express your views in any way you want and in any thread you want - but the rest of us also have the right to voice our disapprobation of your manner of expression.

Just have to say I love reading your posts and you are extremely eloquent in you manner of speaking.

You get your point across without resorting to having a slanging match and rather remind me of a friends mum who was much the same and a telling off from her made you feel really bad without a raised voice or a distasteful word uttered!

What she said!!!!!!!!

[KumaAkita]

oh Siks3, I'm so sorry to hear about this. Hope you can find the little guy a safe place to live out his life, what a heartbreaking decision.

Have to admit this is my biggest fear and the reason we will be a one dog family... my boy won't start a fight, but it wouldn't take much for him to finish it.

And to the breed typists out there deep breath folks, the OP knew what they were getting into when they got an Akita, it's not a decision taken lightly. Thankfully it's still a fairly specialised breed and most come from good breeders who work hard on temperament and breed betterment - and as much as I'm aware, they're all pretty particular about what kind of person ends up with their animals.

[siks3]

Well It's been a hectic couple of days and the foxy has had 10cm of intestine removed and his bowl reattached but is doing fine.

Thank you to all the people that gave their support.

Now I have skim read through a few pages of posts and how come as soon as somebody mentions aggression or dog fight the horns come out.

Having these things happen is an unfortunate reality of owning dogs.

A dog simply cannot be punished for simply acting like a dog.

If give a certain set of circumstances ALL breeds of dog are capable of causing damage to other animals it is not fair to single out one particular breed of dog.

The little fox terrier I now have has never been socialized or had any real contact with other dogs. We have done a lot of work on socialisation and other issues like food guarding and snapping at the kids.

He was a rescue dog that my father saved because the dog was aggressive and had been abused.

The dog only trusted my dad.

The thing that simply triggered the fight was the foxy was sitting next to a wall guarding 3 little pieces of kibble (witch I didn't find till afterwards) and my akita followed me past the dog maybe the akita got to close.

I was about to walk inside then i heard a "yap yap" and then a scream from the foxy. It all happened so fast by the time I got to them (about 4 steps away)

they where well and truly fighting.

My akita was small puncture wounds on his leg, a cut on his nose and a tear in his lip.

My akita has been very patient with this little dog I guess this time the foxy connected and hurt him so he defended himself this time.

I have no issues with leadership in my house and my mother and father when I was younger ran an RSPCA shelter in Burnie Tasmania and they use to breed Working GSD not show pony GSD but protection dogs. They use to hire out dogs to businesses and mining sites during the holidays and week ends.

I have come across all types of dogs with a different temperaments.

Akitas are a beautiful dog but when larger breeds show signs of aggression towards other dogs for what ever reason most people get terrified.

The same behavior would most likely go unnoticed or be ignored in smaller breeds.

Now as for rehoming the foxy I have decided to build a small yard at the front of my house so he can still have a quality of life he can watch people walk buy and sit in the sun with out having to worry about the other dog.

They will be totally separate from each other.

I might even look into getting him a small female friend to share his final days with.

I forgot to mention the foxy after my father died lived with my brother for a couple of weeks and because he had small children and with him having problems with the dog I took him in.

By this time the akita was already owned by me so the akita did his absolute best in my book to try and be freinds.

as a puppy he left him alone and never bothered him it was the foxy that had the issues.

Edited November 28, 2010 by siks3

[persephone]

siks3- good post.

...Although it will be tricky managing the dogs back home, I am pleased the little foxy will be spending his time back with you .... and perhaps getting a companion .

[poodlefan]

I think most of us with a multiple dog household has seen their share of aggression incidents between dogs.

Those of us who've escaped an incident like this should count our blessings. The danger is always when dogs are very mismatched in terms of size and temperament.

Hope it all works out siks3. Very traumatic stuff for all involved.

Personally, if separation doesn't work out, I'd look at giving the old foxy his wings. Watch the stress levels on both your dogs carefully. I'd certainly not be adding another small dog to this mix for any reason other than the fact YOU would really like one. You may simply be providing another sparring partner or a target for bullying from the old boy - if he's not dog friendly he's probably better off on his own.

[siks3]

I think most of us with a multiple dog household has seen their share of aggression incidents between dogs.

Those of us who've escaped an incident like this should count our blessings. The danger is always when dogs are very mismatched in terms of size and temperament.

Hope it all works out siks3. Very traumatic stuff for all involved.

Personally, if separation doesn't work out, I'd look at giving the old foxy his wings. Watch the stress levels on both your dogs carefully. I'd certainly not be adding another small dog to this mix for any reason other than the fact YOU would really like one. You may simply be providing another sparring partner or a target for bullying from the old boy - if he's not dog friendly he's probably better off on his own.

I'm going to try to find one from the local shelter that he will hopefully like.

He will play with certain other small dogs but not others he is a difficult little fellow.

During the day the akita has run of the house inside and out while we are at work as it gets very hot here where I live.

The foxy likes to do his own thing and I hope by having a friend he won't get to lonely while we are at work.

I'm a bit of a softie and I don't have to have much of an excuse to bring in another poor little dog that needs a home.

[halfthewords]

Lol .... Maybe the OP needs to change the thread title to "Dol Fight".

To the OP, good on you for coming up with the best solution in a sticky situation.

Akitas are an amazing breed and just like every breed, of course they can be raised incorrectly, undersocialised, etc. I do not think that is the case with this one! My Min Pin copped it from our Bichon once after years of 'narking' at her. The old girl snapped at her once, clearly meant business, and that was it!

[asal]

Well It's been a hectic couple of days and the foxy has had 10cm of intestine removed and his bowl reattached but is doing fine.

Thank you to all the people that gave their support.

Now I have skim read through a few pages of posts and how come as soon as somebody mentions aggression or dog fight the horns come out.

Having these things happen is an unfortunate reality of owning dogs.

A dog simply cannot be punished for simply acting like a dog.

If give a certain set of circumstances ALL breeds of dog are capable of causing damage to other animals it is not fair to single out one particular breed of dog.

The little fox terrier I now have has never been socialized or had any real contact with other dogs. We have done a lot of work on socialisation and other issues like food guarding and snapping at the kids.

He was a rescue dog that my father saved because the dog was aggressive and had been abused.

The dog only trusted my dad.

The thing that simply triggered the fight was the foxy was sitting next to a wall guarding 3 little pieces of kibble (witch I didn't find till afterwards) and my akita followed me past the dog maybe the akita got to close.

I was about to walk inside then i heard a "yap yap" and then a scream from the foxy. It all happened so fast by the time I got to them (about 4 steps away)

they where well and truly fighting.

My akita was small puncture wounds on his leg, a cut on his nose and a tear in his lip.

My akita has been very patient with this little dog I guess this time the foxy connected and hurt him so he defended himself this time.

I have no issues with leadership in my house and my mother and father when I was younger ran an RSPCA shelter in Burnie Tasmania and they use to breed Working GSD not show pony GSD but protection dogs. They use to hire out dogs to businesses and mining sites during the holidays and week ends.

I have come across all types of dogs with a different temperaments.

Akitas are a beautiful dog but when larger breeds show signs of aggression towards other dogs for what ever reason most people get terrified.

The same behavior would most likely go unnoticed or be ignored in smaller breeds.

Now as for rehoming the foxy I have decided to build a small yard at the front of my house so he can still have a quality of life he can watch people walk buy and sit in the sun with out having to worry about the other dog.

They will be totally separate from each other.

I might even look into getting him a small female friend to share his final days with.

I forgot to mention the foxy after my father died lived with my brother for a couple of weeks and because he had small children and with him having problems with the dog I took him in.

By this time the akita was already owned by me so the akita did his absolute best in my book to try and be freinds.

as a puppy he left him alone and never bothered him it was the foxy that had the issues.

just remember he may not want a friend either.

i have looked after many dogs for friends while they went away or other emergencies and theres are some dogs that dont like other dogs. full stop.

i well recall two that to put another with them was asking for trouble.

one in particular springs to mind. loving and the sweetest to her owner and people.. would go for the kill the second another dog was in the same area.

should she have been put down?

her pensioner owner adored her and she her, great with the grandkids. tolerate another dog... no way.

[BubbaBelushi]

Siks you did everything right, and you've made the right decision to re-home the Foxxie.

Male dogs that haven't grown up together, food and such a huge size difference = a recipe for disaster.