Do Not Vote For Labour In Victoria

[Erny]

I am lost.

[Shazzapug]

What to do what to do?

[Erny]

What to do what to do?

Abandon ship?

[SpikesPuppy]

Liberal preferences Labor over Greens.

Just checked again and I only have the choice of Liberal, Labor, Greens, DLP and Family First. Now I don't know where to go. Am in a safe Labor seat.

[shortstep]

Ok so correct me if I'm wrong, but an ad I heard on the radio seemed to imply that Country Alliance are the ones who want to continue practices such as live export and there was something else I didn't agree with. While I understand it does create jobs, surely there's a better way.

Yes the greens and labor want to end the export and import of all live animals to and from Australia. They show same bad things that happen with sheep and cattle and use that to push the animal rights adgenda of a total ban on all live animals including dogs and cats.

However dogs travel first class by air under tight regualtions and control, dogs do not suffer. The flow of unrelated dogs (new genetics) is vital to maintain and improve the health and vitality of all dogs around the world. Read any of the latest research on dog breeding and increasing flow of dogs and increasing thereby genetic gene pools is stressed ovver and over again as vital and must be encouraged or even demanded in some cases. Also people move and want to take their pets with them, why should anyone comeing into or leaving Australia be made to leave their pets behind, that is really cruel to both the pet and the human.

There is only one section of animal export that can sometimes be a welfare concern and that is live export of sheep and cattle for food to countires that want to slaughter their own meat, such as islamic countries. Better enforcement of the current laws would prevent these bad occurances.

However do be aware that the import and export of breeding animals, cattle sheep and so forth, is also vital around the world to keep populations healthy just as it is in dogs. Our cattle and sheep breeding stock go around the world to imporve herds and help to feed the world. These animals are very well cared for and tavel in better comfort then I do when going over seas!

Please vote Liberal, National or Country no matter where you live in Australia, they will do the most to save the publics right to own a dog (pets) and save dog (pet) ownership in Australia.

Do not vote Green or Labor, they will support and attempt to put into law extreme animal rights beliefs, such as ending the right of dog (pet) ownership in Australia.

Please look up the difference between animal rights (Labor Greens) and animal welfare (Liberal, National, Country).

Edited November 25, 2010 by shortstep

[GeckoTree]

A dog breeder should run as independent? get the dol vote.

[shortstep]

Just wanted to add,

I do not think that the Liberals by nature would support any far left ideals be they about dogs or anything else. They are conservative, want less governement and less restraint of freedoms. So on princple they would not support giving the RSPCA more policing and intrusive powers, they would not support more governement laws to restrict dog ownership, dog breeding or dog rescue.

However they have to look at public opinion and in Victroia the call for severe policing of dog owners, breeders and even rescue folks has been pretty constant. I bet more than 2/3 of people at that rally recently had no idea what that rally was really calling for, the message they are giving to all parties of government is 'we want heaps of laws applied to anyone who has anything to do with a dog'.

So all parties have to listen to what the public demans and what the supporters of their party demands. If the only message being demanded is end pet ownership rights, put in place massive policing and regulating of dog breeder, dog owners and dog rescue, then that is what they must do. They must represent what the pubic wants.

Now if some folks in Victoria were to become vocal for the more conservative traditional values of dog ownership, breeding and small rescue efforts, then the Liberals, Nationals and Country parties are the parties that would naturally gravitate to that side of the issues. The Greens and Labor would naturally gravitate towards total government regualtion and control of anything to do with dogs.

So yes vote Liberal, National or Country, but also make your personal beliefs known to the party members so they can act on your behalf. If they do not hear your voice they can not represent your wishes.

Edited November 25, 2010 by shortstep

[SpikesPuppy]

I don't think I could vote Liberal and live with myself. As passionate about dog ownership rights as I am, there are other issues at hand.

Looks like I'm putting in an informal vote this year

Although, I recall reading that Mr Baillieu owns 3 dogs..... Anyone know what breed and their origins?

[SpikesPuppy]

Unfortunately, I am runnin late this morning and must be on this train, however our local Liberal candidate was at the entrance to the underpass handing put flyers etc. I quickly asked him what he thought about puppy farms and registered breeders and his response to Puppy Farms was 'heavy regulation' and his response to Registered breeders? "There are a lot of issues that need to be addressed".

I didn't have time to clarify any further but he certainly didn't seem interested in my query, which was disappointing (although I understand that he is under pressure right now but he missed his chance with a troubled voter who is putting in an early vote today...).

[Guest Tess32]

There's slightly more to voting than just dog related stuff.

[shortstep]

but he missed his chance with a troubled voter who is putting in an early vote today...).

How the heck you do expect him to know the difference? How much time has anybody who is not on the far left animal rights/liberation spent educating him about the whole dog culture in this country? All he sees Animal Liberation leading rally's attended by every body and his dog, calling for massive legislation to stop nasty criminal dog breeders. You expect him to know what the difference is between registered breeder vs puppy farms? Besides the RSPCA has made that real easy so anyone can understand, there is no difference. All dog breeders are potential puppy famers and all need to be policed like the criminals they are. You expect him to know any different?

Victoria culture, politics and media have swung so far to the left that they see center as far right, and heaven help anyone who is conservative.

Reminds me of something that happend about 3 years ago.

I watched on TV, some Victorian socialite ladies all dressed up drinking wine at some social event. They had a well know carton artist there speaking. He then drew a picture of Sara Palin a lady who is on the conservative side of politics in the US. He drew her, with her pants pulled down and she was being ***** from behind by a moose.

Now bad enough that all these ladies were applauding the degrading of a female by using sex with animals to make the point that they did not like her conservative politics (BTW what ever happen to the women's rights, oh that is right, women only have rights if they are not on the conservative side of politics).

But this program was being shown in the middle of the afternoon on TV when kids could have seen it.

I wrote to the stations and there response was, it was political humor so was not really degrading to women. Then they explained to me that Sara Palin was a religions radical in USA politics, like that justified the whole thing and I must not have know that. They also said that children would not have understood exactly what the moose was doing to Sara Palin so it was alright to show it on TV. Hopeless, just hopeless.

Edited November 25, 2010 by shortstep

[whippets]

There's slightly more to voting than just dog related stuff.

That's right and labor still doesn't get my vote.

[Steve]

There's slightly more to voting than just dog related stuff.

Is there?

[shortstep]

There's slightly more to voting than just dog related stuff.

Is there?

I see the dog issues as a microcosm of the whole political debate.

More government, directing every part of your life vs. less government leaving as much a possible in the control of the people.

Edited November 25, 2010 by shortstep

[Erny]

There's slightly more to voting than just dog related stuff.

Yeah, there's MYKI.

And there's the insulation schemes.

And there's the school building schemes.

[Moselle]

Decisions....who does want vote for to ensure that the votes are not passed onto either the Labor or LIberal party???

Edited November 25, 2010 by Moselle

[Natsu chan]

The only party I got a positive response from over the dog issues was the Christan Democratic party....I actually heard some commonsense from them! I think we are doomed to have the puppy farm bill put through regardless however since the likelihood is who ever wins (Labour, liberal, greens) will back it. Our local Labour candidate even had the bad manners to tell me I can't have read the bill as the RSPCA wouldn't be policing it. I wonder if he's read it! I feel a bit lost too Erny.

[SpikesPuppy]

but he missed his chance with a troubled voter who is putting in an early vote today...).

How the heck you do expect him to know the difference? How much time has anybody who is not on the far left animal rights/liberation spent educating him about the whole dog culture in this country? All he sees Animal Liberation leading rally's attended by every body and his dog, calling for massive legislation to stop nasty criminal dog breeders. You expect him to know what the difference is between registered breeder vs puppy farms? Besides the RSPCA has made that real easy so anyone can understand, there is no difference. All dog breeders are potential puppy famers and all need to be policed like the criminals they are. You expect him to know any different?

Victoria culture, politics and media have swung so far to the left that they see center as far right, and heaven help anyone who is conservative.

Reminds me of something that happend about 3 years ago.

I watched on TV, some Victorian socialite ladies all dressed up drinking wine at some social event. They had a well know carton artist there speaking. He then drew a picture of Sara Palin a lady who is on the conservative side of politics in the US. He drew her, with her pants pulled down and she was being ***** from behind by a moose.

Now bad enough that all these ladies were applauding the degrading of a female by using sex with animals to make the point that they did not like her conservative politics (BTW what ever happen to the women's rights, oh that is right, women only have rights if they are not on the conservative side of politics).

But this program was being shown in the middle of the afternoon on TV when kids could have seen it.

I wrote to the stations and there response was, it was political humor so was not really degrading to women. Then they explained to me that Sara Palin was a religions radical in USA politics, like that justified the whole thing and I must not have know that. They also said that children would not have understood exactly what the moose was doing to Sara Palin so it was alright to show it on TV. Hopeless, just hopeless.

No need to be rude to me

I didn't expect him to know the difference but his whole attitude to me was unpleasant and uninterested. What I would have liked was to engage in a conversation with him but he looked right past me after answering and hopped over to the woman with the pram.

On other issues- I LOVE Myki. It's made my train & tram travel so much easier and cheaper. Just have an automatic direct debit each payday and I never have to worry. Yea it cost way more than it should have but that doesn't mean it's not going to be worth it in the end. I have hated Metcards since they were first introduced.

For me, as someone who will never have children, dogs are a HUGE issue for me as a citizen and a voter. They are my family and they play a huge role in my mental health and physical wellbeing.

[Erny]

Please vote Liberal, National or Country no matter where you live in Australia, they will do the most to save the publics right to own a dog (pets) and save dog (pet) ownership in Australia.

Do not vote Green or Labor, they will support and attempt to put into law extreme animal rights beliefs, such as ending the right of dog (pet) ownership in Australia.

Please look up the difference between animal rights (Labor Greens) and animal welfare (Liberal, National, Country).

I tend to agree with the above. I think for the time being it will be about voting for the best of what might be a bad lot. All I can tell anyone is that I have campaigned on a few issues over the years, and Labor, who has been in Government for that period (and who are the ones who have been bringing in all the laws from the outset and inbetween) essentially don't care, don't want to listen. I have found our Labor Candidate to pay lip service, but in reality he just follows the (read : his) leader and doesn't really care or agree as much as he might like you to think he does. He was of no help to me at any stage. The Minister for Agriculture hasn't wanted to listen to me or even receive submissions that seek the changes we ask for and which explain in full the reasons for those changes. He hasn't been interested. AND, the mere fact that they are giving an open door to almost whatever RSPCA wants in terms of certain laws, even when there is no evidence, rhyme or reason for those laws (ie breaches Natural Justice and Procedural Fairness), completely insults me and quite frankly, scares me.

I am disappointed to hear of the Libs' policy regards its intentions to give the RSPCA more power. But I guess it is now likely to happen regardless of which major party we vote for. I think I'd prefer to try the Libs and hope they can prove inside their first term that they are at least more willing to listen and reason than the Labor Party has in the past.

So I guess for me it is about getting rid of the one that has been tried and found to fail, and running with the slim hope that the next one might at least be a bit different, more amenable and aware of "people", their needs and concerns. IOW, I think Labor is the more dangerous of the two, so a vote for the Libs is the likely course for me.

Sue Pennicuik (Greens - Brighton) put up a really good argument against the recent Victorian Bill. She was the only Politician who did and she does IMO deserve some recognition for that. I'm really sorry though that the Greens are so allied to Labor and I'm also really sorry that the Greens represent "animal rights" (as opposed to animal welfare).

Edited November 25, 2010 by Erny

[Steve]

I dont want anyone being given more powers to police animal welfare laws until such time as there is at the very least and external accountability process.

When inspectors are given police powers they become accountable to the same system as the police because they are special constables. But its not that simple because the entire org isnt accountable to an outside independent authority.

If an animal is seized by an RSPCA inspector, taken to an RSPCA facility to be examined by an RSPCA vet who can make a determination and decision without the ability to allow the owner to seek a second opinion and destroy the evidence by cremating the animal before the owner even knows where they have taken the animal there is way too much potential for collusion and corruption - not that Im saying there is. Then add in they get to prosecute you rather than the usual court system which allows them definite advantages ,their own expert witnesses, the ability to with hold evidence ,fear that you will pay huge costs for boarding your animals with them even if you are found not guilty AND WHAT THEY WANT TO DO NOW. You are a sitting duck and told nothing can be done because the courts will decide and if the courts decide against you there is no use complaining because then you are a guilty person with an axe to grind.

Be very sure that I am not accusing the RSPCA of anything they shouldn't have done , however there are many many instances where they have been accused of corrupt behaviour. Google anti RSPCA

then read this

http://www.parliament.nsw.gov.au/Prod/parl...on%20No%202.pdf