What's The Answer Number 4

[Steve]

Same here as the others.

Discuss what can be done without advocating for law changes.

The one single consistent thing I see on this forum and what most dog owners talk to me about is the fact

that they cant walk their dogs without fear that someone's dog which is not under control will put them or their dog at risk.

There is no doubt that irresponsible people have made it harder and harder for us to be able to take our dogs to more and more places and do the thing we used to take for granted.

Recently we saw a TV program which made much of people living in one shire targetting pit bulls and pit bull types - this led to more calls for more law changes.

When we first started the MDBA one of the things we wanted to do was encourage people to join us - build the numbers of pet owners - regardless of what breed they owned so we could approach councils and state government to show them we had lots of people who had proven they were more educated on responsible dog owners ship and who were owners with a voluntary code of ethics for dog ownership.

the idea back then was to be able to ask for our members to be given the right to do something and take their dogs some places which they have been locked out of and as the numbers grow that is still on the table. But Im growing impatient and when I see calls for dog ownership licences etc I think its time we really had a good look at this.

So if we want to have a fair go at turning this around what is the answer? No law changes

[raz]

So if we want to have a fair go at turning this around what is the answer? No law changes

More rangers to implement the laws we already have, and/or to place articles in local newspapers, give community talks etc? But then it comes down to council allocated money. Hard question. Will ponder a bit more.

[SpikesPuppy]

Introduce the Canine Good Citizen test and reward owners who's dogs pass with discounted or free registration?

More councils need to be open to obedience clubs and groups conducting classes in their shires (Maribyrnong for eg refuses to allow any club to train on any of it's grounds).

I guess these only really reward the good owners but it could be incentive for those who have a good heart but just don't *know* better. Make it more desirable to be a good owner rather than threatening people with fines etc.

It's a really tricky one.....

[~Anne~]

Encourage resposnibility through education and reward. Focus on the positive, not the negative.

[WreckitWhippet]

So if we want to have a fair go at turning this around what is the answer? No law changes

More rangers to implement the laws we already have, and/or to place articles in local newspapers, give community talks etc? But then it comes down to council allocated money. Hard question. Will ponder a bit more.

I'm not so sure if more are required. There is currently a mixture of those who don't do their jobs and hardly ever police and hand out fines and the over zealous.

I'll have a think about this during the day.

[~Anne~]

Personally I think you are better of removing some of the laws, which will in turn mean that resources that are currently spent policing them (yes, we know it isn't much but..) could be spent on educating, encouraging and rewarding good behaviour.

[Erny]

I don't think that it is just about getting more people to go to dog schools. That's great, of course, and I think it should be very much encouraged and certainly it is an avenue that would go towards being able to educate on various different levels (eg. training; park etiquette; courtesy; council laws; etc) but not everyone wants to take their dog to dog school. Not everyone can. Not everyone needs to.

I'm not sure the answer, but I have the (not so?) silly idea of the "Metre Maid" type thing rattling around in my head. Well, not really Meter Maid, but a campaign where people doing the right thing are randomly spotted, rewarded and publicly recognised for just this fact.

Does anyone remember the campaign that ran for a while where if you had a special sticker on your car and you were spotted driving courteously, you received a reward? I wonder how successful (or not?) that campaign was for the duration that it lasted. The point being that it would have helped get the word around and give people incentive to do the right thing.

These things could perhaps be Council sponsored and/or Media sponsored. And even could be a marketing strategy for other groups/orgs to sponsor and get their names/services advertised with every "Good Citizen" (to steal a label) reward publicised.

Just a loose idea. Not necessarily a great one and not necessarily an easy one without its own flaws.

Edited November 17, 2010 by Erny

[~Anne~]

Just for clarification, when I use the term 'education' I am not referring to dogs schools or schooling in general. I am referring primarily to social education and change.

Edited November 17, 2010 by ~Anne~

[Erny]

So if we want to have a fair go at turning this around what is the answer? No law changes

More rangers to implement the laws we already have, and/or to place articles in local newspapers, give community talks etc? But then it comes down to council allocated money. Hard question. Will ponder a bit more.

I wanted to give free "Community Talk/s" to people about doggy related (educational) topics, such as dogs and babies; early socialisation; and so on and contacted our local Council to see if they would permit me to conduct them via the Council Chambers, as I noted they often have people who would provide "self improvement" type seminars (eg. website building etc) there. But the Council informed me that my service would not be about self improvement for small businesses and that it might be seen as promoting myself (can't deny that ..... but so?) and consequently the answer was "no".

[Erny]

Just for clarification, when I use the term 'education' I am not referring to dogs schools or schooling in general. I am referring primarily to social education and change.

And also for clarification - wouldn't have mattered had it not been for the fact that my post came directly after yours, Anne. Sorry - didn't read your post before I posted mine. You mentioned "rewarding good behaviour" so it seems we are on a similar page.

Edited November 17, 2010 by Erny

[raz]

But the Council informed me that my service would not be about self improvement for small businesses and that it might be seen as promoting myself (can't deny that ..... but so?) and consequently the answer was "no".

Interesting. So what would stop them from doing it? In my area the rangers are really lovely but they cover a huge area and completely run off their feet so they'd either have to bring someone like yourself in to do it or spend the money on an education officer.

Need more to think about this some more

[WreckitWhippet]

For me these would be the most basic of basics for all dog owners

1. adequate fencing

2 shut your gates

3. walk you dog on leash, unless it's a designated off leash area.

[raz]

For me these would be the most basic of basics for all dog owners

1. adequate fencing

2 shut your gates

3. walk you dog on leash, unless it's a designated off leash area.

I'll add to that

4. clean up dog poo (I mean seriously...how many times do you have to pick up another dog's shit. Unbelievable and it really pisses off non dog owners

5. barking dogs disrupting neighbours (major cause for neighbourhood disputes)

6. vet treatment when required (seems like basic stuff)

[Quickasyoucan]

So if we want to have a fair go at turning this around what is the answer? No law changes

More rangers to implement the laws we already have, and/or to place articles in local newspapers, give community talks etc? But then it comes down to council allocated money. Hard question. Will ponder a bit more.

Agreed.

Warringah Council recently held a Responsible Pet Owner night and had Kirsti Seksel as a speaker (well I remember it was someone I had heard of and I am pretty sure it was her). I thought that was definitely as step in the right direction.

As I have said before, I think we could go a long way by just seeing basic leash, microchipping laws enforced. It shouldn't be up to responsible owners to have to cop abuse when they tell people to put their dog on a lead.

[Natsu chan]

All the points mentioned are already law, it's just in most cases they aren't policed. My local council won't even provide bins! Oh wait they do but they're locked up in a roofed cage so no one can use them, then they scream blue murder about all the rubbish!

Basic things like providing bins would be a start. Free or discounted education, puppy socialisation would be nice too. I've approached our council a few times saying dogs with obedience titles should be given a secondary discount on registration. They bleat and moan about people with untrained dogs but you only have one discount level that applies if the dog is chipped (which is compulsory anyway), desexed, ANKC registered and owned by a financial Vic dogs member or obedience trained. It's actually demovitating. Why bother with training, why bother trying to raise the bar if there's no incentive too? Now I know that's not exactly a level playing field type of suggestion but it would actually show the public (especially if it was advertised) that a well trained, well mannered dog is valued. At the moment they just aren't.

A lot of the problems boil down to lack of education, even just a list of obedience clubs included in with the tag for all new registrations would be a start. There needs to be more, councils need to encourage and reward people for doing a good job. If they did the ones who aren't doing so well might see it as something positive to aim for. At the moment the average dog owner thinks people who train their dogs are nuts. You're never going to get the hard core few who just don't care to change but the large number who love their dogs and mean well but have no idea would certainly take notice.

[Erny]

Basic things like providing bins would be a start.

This thought has tinkled an idea .....

Although in my area Council supplied and maintained dog poo bag dispensers are not provided in many places (only one that I could name), I do know that the Council supplied dog poo bags have writing on them. What about if these could be used as a source of advertising for responsible dog ownership, providing different short messages on each one? Eg. "Observe on-leash area requirements" or some such.

Edited November 18, 2010 by Erny

[Moselle]

This may sound silly but when referring to parks....maybe a park could be divided with one section for small dogs and the other section for larger dogs ??? that way owners with small dogs needn't fear a large dog approaching their smaller dog ???

If on the street, my firm belief is that ALL dogs should be on a leash and that a hefty fine be introduced when someone is seen walking their dog off leash; I cringe at the sight of an unleashed dog being walked in a busy street aside from other factors.

[BCPuppy]

Educate the children. Teach them about reponsible pet ownership. Done correctly what they learn at school is taken home and put into practice, I have heard kids that have been taught about littering and environment nagging parents to make sure they dispose of litter appropriately and make use of recycling.

[dee lee]

If on the street, my firm belief is that ALL dogs should be on a leash and that a hefty fine be introduced when someone is seen walking their dog off leash; I cringe at the sight of an unleashed dog being walked in a busy street aside from other factors.

I agree with this. Increase offlead fines and have a 3 strikes system that incurs a much larger fine. Having extra Rangers wont help IMO, they are never available when you need one, no matter how many there are.

Also, if an area attracts over a certain amount of calls over offlead dogs, then clear signage should be erected by council- ie "Offlead dogs will be fined" etc, outlining the fines. We have "no dogs offlead" at many parks, obviously this needs to be reinforced on the street.

Poo pag dispensers are fabulous too. I am on the border or 2 councils- one that uses them and one that doesn't. Guess which one has more on street poo? (mind you, there are always the knobs who wont pick it up regardless... but what can you do about them aside from a good slap?)

[SpikesPuppy]

This may sound silly but when referring to parks....maybe a park could be divided with one section for small dogs and the other section for larger dogs ??? that way owners with small dogs needn't fear a large dog approaching their smaller dog ???

If on the street, my firm belief is that ALL dogs should be on a leash and that a hefty fine be introduced when someone is seen walking their dog off leash; I cringe at the sight of an unleashed dog being walked in a busy street aside from other factors.

I would like to see paid leash free parks in all councils. Buy a card (like a credit card) and keep it topped up, it charges a fee per 10 minutes or so. One park could have several runs, perhaps different fees for different sizes. I would be more than happy to pay this and I know many others who would, too.

Kind of like Kepala I guess but less extravagant and easy access.

I don't like split size sections- what if you own multiple breeds or walk with friends (our group consists of Border Terriers, a smooth collie, Afghans and a Lowchen!!).

When I mentioned dog training etc I meant reward those who put the effort in, be it formal classes or just good ownership, the well behaved dogs and their owners should be rewarded and encouraged.