Which Breed To Choose

[parrotpea]

I'm sorry to hear that you've had to re-home your dog :D

I wish you much luck in finding another companion for your daughter and your aussie bitch. You sound like a lovely, caring dog owner

[Swizzlestick]

Sorry you've found yourself in this situation equerry. I've never had to rehome a dog, but can imagine how heart-breaking it would be.

Please hang around. Don't let the likes of JulesP and other nasties run you off. Not all DOLers are horrible know it alls.

I don't know you from a bar of soap (just this thread) but you sound like an excellent owner. ;)

JulesP: Why have you been so horrible in this thread :D Perhaps you already have it in for the OP from another forum?

Did someone light the fuse on your tampon?

Good luck equerry with the male Aussie in the new home, and the new dog that you'll eventually welcome to the family.

[Beth.]

Just thought i'd let you know (if it hasn't already been said ) that there's a show on in Caboolture this weekend (North Brisbane) - I think Sat 20th/Sun21st! Anyone can correct me on that one though - as i'll be going on the Sunday, so lets hope there's a show on !!!

[corvus]

but not many dogs wouldn't go after a feral kitten if they saw one in their yard.

Really? Well, I must know a lot of the "not many". Chase, quite likely, but kill, not so much. My boys haven't grown up with cats. They will chase, but don't even try to grab.

[raz]

Would like to see some of the city slickers living in the country coping with their animals and snakes,

We 'city slickers' have a snake problem as well - speaking from experience.

Goodluck with whatever you decide. Seems like you and your husband have to come to a compromise on what breed to get first, and goodluck with first getting rid of the pesky feral cats.

[jacqui835]

Our dog is perefectly fine with our cat.

But she would kill a feral cat if she got hold of it. It normally ducks through the fence before she can get to it.

And I'd wish her luck too, as we have lost one of our own dom cats to that feral.

No way I'd re-home her for it. She would have been doing her job.

Same with mine, who is also a doberman. He is fine with our own cats, but, I think because when he was little he learned that our cats don't get along with any other cats (as cats generally don't), he is now protective of them, and if he hears the unmistakable yowls of an imminent cat fight, he will race around and try and catch the offending cat. Our cats do not leave our backyard, but 2 neighbour cats continually enter, and I do not expect my dog to leave a strange cat alone, even if it does belong to someone, that is trying to attack my cat in its own backyard.

Don't get too down about some of the comments in this thread, most of us will never be good enough dog owners to please everyone :s

[Robbi]

I live on 45 acres with dogs and previously on a broad acre farm, there were snakes everywhere then, my dogs are always within my sight when out in the feed sheds etc and any sign of snakes I put them straight back in the house. I always keep one trough overflowing out in the scrub paddock so that snakes dont need to come to the house looking for water, lawns kept short and bushes pruned so that they dont provide hiding spots for our slithery friends. Vigilance helps with snakes but it is a constant threat.

[poodlefan]

I live on 45 acres with dogs and previously on a broad acre farm, there were snakes everywhere then, my dogs are always within my sight when out in the feed sheds etc and any sign of snakes I put them straight back in the house. I always keep one trough overflowing out in the scrub paddock so that snakes dont need to come to the house looking for water, lawns kept short and bushes pruned so that they dont provide hiding spots for our slithery friends. Vigilance helps with snakes but it is a constant threat.

Its enough to make you want to emigrate to NZ. Equerry has the right idea.

[~Anne~]

Sorry, I haven't read all of the thread, but my two cents worth on the Pug is: they are loving, crazy little dogs who are not the smartest of breeds. They shed hair like there is no tomorrow. They shed BUCKETLOADS and BUCKETLOADS and I can't stress that enough. If you have wood and tile floors, enjoy vacuuming and sweeping, and train them not to get on the lounge, this won't be too bad.... but I can say I will never quite get used to finding Pug hairs even in my underwear! The hair gets everywhere.

They are also not the kind of dog that will live outside and be happy. They are house dogs and shouldn't be thought of as a dog that can withstand the great outdoors 24/7.

They could be nicknamed "velcro" easily as they will stick to you 24/7 to the point of frustration at times becuase everytime you move to turn around or change direction, you almost kill yourself on the snuffling little snorting and sneezing creature at your feet.

They are inquisitve and this would be a worry about snakes as I would guess they would walk up to have a sniff and say hello. They have the attitude that everyone and anything is their best bud, including the cats. This means they are prone to being attacked by other dogs and scratched a lot by cats that are not used to dogs coming up to say hello. They're slow to read the body language of other animals too.

Overall they are a great little dog and they will provide loads of love and laughter, especially for your daughter. Some airlines will not carry them so you might have problems on the transfer to NZ. They are also affected by heat moreso than other dogs and care must be taken to ensure they are not left in situations where they can overheat.

Edited November 16, 2010 by ~Anne~

[Greytmate]

but not many dogs wouldn't go after a feral kitten if they saw one in their yard.

Really? Well, I must know a lot of the "not many". Chase, quite likely, but kill, not so much. My boys haven't grown up with cats. They will chase, but don't even try to grab.

Chase quite likely. Yes. That is what "going after" is. Not a very difficult concept to understand fro most people.

Growing up with cats usually teaches a dog to treat those cats like family members.

Being kept in an environment where unknown cats are running through can actually heighten a dog's prey drive, and can encourage them to chase. This is a likely outcome for any dog.

Your dogs haven't grabbed a cat yet Corvus, but that doesn't mean they won't if they were continually exposed to feral cats intruding into their territory. The behaviour can escalate as the dog finds the chase rewarding. It can also turn deadly very quickly if one day a cat chooses fight instead of flight.

I wouldn't have thought an Aussie Shepherd would start off as a serious cat chaser. But the environment has turned it into one, and could turn nearly any dog into a serious cat chaser.

That is why I recommend that the OP does not buy another dog.

Maybe people should read the thread about solving the dumping issue, instead of encouraging people to bring dogs home into environments where a dog is likely to learn bad habits. This is an owner who we know will not tolerate the habit, or make any changes to put an end to it.

[~Anne~]

A Pug would most likely not go after a feral kitten. Only a small number of Pugs would chase a cat. IN having said that, if a Pug was living with a dog that was a cat chaser then the liklihood of the Pug chasing the cat would naturally increase. Still, it would again be a lower number than with most other breeds.

[aussielover]

I had an aussie shepherd when I fostered kittens.

So I would have a number of random kittens coming in and out of the house pretty regularly and running about and she never ever, "went for" any of them. If she had of i would blame myself not the dog though...

Though of course I did not leave her unsupervised with them at any time.

All dogs have the potential for some kind of prey drive, it would really depends on the personality and training of the dog as to whether it would become a cat killer (as you have experienced with one aussie killing them, and one not)

Realistically if you want a feral cat colony and dogs- build a cat proof dog run that you can put your dogs in when they are not under your direct supervision.

[Gayle.]

Trap the feral cats, have them humanely euthanased. They have no place in society, and should not be placed above the importance of a family pet.

[Greytmate]

I had an aussie shepherd when I fostered kittens.

So I would have a number of random kittens coming in and out of the house pretty regularly and running about and she never ever, "went for" any of them. If she had of i would blame myself not the dog though...

Though of course I did not leave her unsupervised with them at any time.

All dogs have the potential for some kind of prey drive, it would really depends on the personality and training of the dog as to whether it would become a cat killer (as you have experienced with one aussie killing them, and one not)

Realistically if you want a feral cat colony and dogs- build a cat proof dog run that you can put your dogs in when they are not under your direct supervision.

That is the key.

By supervising, a person can step in when the excitement/arousal level reaches a certain level.

Also by having them in the confines of the house, they are unlikely to reach the same arousal level as they are if they are outside running over a large area. The act of the run and the chase increases the arousal in a dog and the speed in the cat.

Kittens playing happily in a home are likely to display predatory type play, which is unlikely to arouse as much prey drive in a dog as much as a frightened kitten fleeing across a yard. The dog understands fully how a cat is feeling through its body language, and that can have a profound effect on the dog's behaviour.

I am sure many people here have dogs that are fine with their house cats, but chase strange cats in the yard.

[Remarkabull]

Trap the feral cats, have them humanely euthanased. They have no place in society, and should not be placed above the importance of a family pet.

+1

I have 5 dogs of various breeds including a working line Dobermann and a JRT with high prey drive, I also have 2 cats that live happily in and outside with the dogs. We have just moved and the neighbours cat keeps coming over and trying to fight with ours, I have no doubt that if it went into my back yard it would probably end up dead. I would not blame my dogs for it and would not re-home or PTS.

I have had a situation in the past where my Bull Terrier was a cat killer. We had cats before her and she was fine with them until she reached about 12 months or so. One day we came home to find one of our cats dead in our back yard with her standing over it. It was upsetting and I was angry at her but she was just following her instinct. She ended up killing our other cat and 2 strange cats that stupidly came into our yard. We just decided that there would be no more cats in our family while we still had her. She was a great pet in every other way, very affectionate and great with the kids.

[SpotTheDog]

Cats & dogs - I wouldn't trust my 6mth bull arab puppy around a feral cat if you offered me a million dollars, and he LIVES with SIX CATS.

Even though my dog has been raised since 12 weeks with these cats, he has a REALLY strong insinct to chase when outside. I no longer allow him off-lead access to the yard when the cats are out there, and haven't for a few months. However, even recently I was throwing the ball for the dog in the yard and one of the cats, who was on the inside windowledge of an open window, raced for the thrown ball. The dog took off after the cat, who didn't see him coming, and rolled the cat in the grass. The cat was unhurt (and came up fighting!) but the dog is over 20kgs now so we were all just lucky really.

I'm not sure if my dog would try to kill a cat, but if you give him an old towel in the garden he shakes and wools it furiously. It isn't a massive stretch for me to, therefore, put that chasing behaviour, and that wooling behaviour, together if my dog were given the chance at an unfamiliar animal in his yard. ESPECIALLY if it ran, instead of standing its ground.

The upshot: what can I do about it? I segregate my animals outdoors and correct the pup every time he chases, but I can't legislate for a feral wandering into my yard. I had my cats first and then brought in this dog, who appears to be growing up, shall we say, 'cat mischevious' (if not quite cat aggressive!) There are plenty of cat-focused people who would say I'm an irresponsible cat owner and SHOULD rehome the dog. However, I believe that all I can do is recognise the ongoing situation, appreciate the potential for it to escalate, and manage it every day as a part of daily life.

On that basis, if I were the OP, the first thing I'd address is the feral cat problem. I would do a trap, neuter, release on the property. Don't wait for the cat welfare agencies - sadly they're overwhlemed. Buy a couple of cat traps (you can always sell them on, there are always people looking for cat traps) and set up a temporary cage on your property. Trap them until you have them all. Neuter the adults and re-release onto your property, where they will keep vermin down if you have a vermin problem. They will also occupy the territory and hopefully prevent further ferals coming in.

The kittens, surrender to a cat agency - they're still viable as family pets if caught young, they can be tamed and rehomed. Learn the cats on your property, and if you see strange cats, time to get the traps out again.

Until you have the feral cat problem under control, I would say there's no point bringing in another dog because you just can't guarantee, even if you select a breed that isn't supposed to chase small animals, that it WON'T chase them.

[Snoopy21]

My bull arab type girl is the same SpotTheDog. She will chase anything that runs from her (humans excepted) and seems to be very prey driven. She never chased our old cat, but then again Skip never ran from her either. I have no doubt she would chase (and probably kill) a cat in our yard, especially if it ran from her. She has caught a few rabbits (wild), birds (including a currjong!) and has even caught and killed some lizards ( ). Now at 40kgs she has a lot of weight and speed behind her and she could seriously hurt it just by rolling it, so we are very aware of her strength and speed, but have no idea how to curb her instincts in this direction.

I agree with the others - trap the ferals and have a safe space to separate the dogs to.

[SmoothieGirl]

Thinking about this, although not "small" a Smooth Collie might tick a lot of boxes for you. Add them to your show visiting list.

My girl LOVES cats, doesn't chase horses and has a beautiful temperament. She has never really had a lot of exposure to children, mostly because I'm allergic to them (relax people, they are ok in small doses), but I'm positive she would be good with them if she had some regular exposure.

The problem I have with my girl is that she doesn't get that not all cats appreciate dogs. But, she's always supervised with strange cats and other cats can't get into our yard because I have a cat net fence.

Edited November 17, 2010 by SmoothieGirl

[Gayle.]

Cats & dogs - I wouldn't trust my 6mth bull arab puppy around a feral cat if you offered me a million dollars, and he LIVES with SIX CATS.

Even though my dog has been raised since 12 weeks with these cats, he has a REALLY strong insinct to chase when outside. I no longer allow him off-lead access to the yard when the cats are out there, and haven't for a few months. However, even recently I was throwing the ball for the dog in the yard and one of the cats, who was on the inside windowledge of an open window, raced for the thrown ball. The dog took off after the cat, who didn't see him coming, and rolled the cat in the grass. The cat was unhurt (and came up fighting!) but the dog is over 20kgs now so we were all just lucky really.

I'm not sure if my dog would try to kill a cat, but if you give him an old towel in the garden he shakes and wools it furiously. It isn't a massive stretch for me to, therefore, put that chasing behaviour, and that wooling behaviour, together if my dog were given the chance at an unfamiliar animal in his yard. ESPECIALLY if it ran, instead of standing its ground.

The upshot: what can I do about it? I segregate my animals outdoors and correct the pup every time he chases, but I can't legislate for a feral wandering into my yard. I had my cats first and then brought in this dog, who appears to be growing up, shall we say, 'cat mischevious' (if not quite cat aggressive!) There are plenty of cat-focused people who would say I'm an irresponsible cat owner and SHOULD rehome the dog. However, I believe that all I can do is recognise the ongoing situation, appreciate the potential for it to escalate, and manage it every day as a part of daily life.

On that basis, if I were the OP, the first thing I'd address is the feral cat problem. I would do a trap, neuter, release on the property. Don't wait for the cat welfare agencies - sadly they're overwhlemed. Buy a couple of cat traps (you can always sell them on, there are always people looking for cat traps) and set up a temporary cage on your property. Trap them until you have them all. Neuter the adults and re-release onto your property, where they will keep vermin down if you have a vermin problem. They will also occupy the territory and hopefully prevent further ferals coming in.

The kittens, surrender to a cat agency - they're still viable as family pets if caught young, they can be tamed and rehomed. Learn the cats on your property, and if you see strange cats, time to get the traps out again.

Until you have the feral cat problem under control, I would say there's no point bringing in another dog because you just can't guarantee, even if you select a breed that isn't supposed to chase small animals, that it WON'T chase them.

Nooooooooo!!!!!! Feral cats should never be neutered and released, cats do not belong outdoors in Australia unless they are confined to an area where they can't kill our beautiful wildlife. An enclosure, a cat-proof backyard or indoors.

Feral cats should be euthanased.

[SpotTheDog]

Nooooooooo!!!!!! Feral cats should never be neutered and released, cats do not belong outdoors in Australia unless they are confined to an area where they can't kill our beautiful wildlife. An enclosure, a cat-proof backyard or indoors.

Feral cats should be euthanased.

I know where you're coming from, but until Australia seriousy gets its act together in terms of neutering and control of cats, euthanising a feral colony buys you about six months before another feral colony moves into your attractive cat-habitat. If the OP's own barn cats aren't enough to ward off visiting ferals, then euthanising what's on her property just opens the way for more cats to move onto her property.

Arguably, having her property support a small colony of non-breeding ferals prevents intact ferals moving in and successfully breeding because the habitat supports them for long enough to have litters - or worse again the habitat has enough food and water to allow them to have larger litters (e.g. four kittens instead of two).

So her choices are:

Do nothing, and harbour feralpalooza

Euthanise the ferals... and euthanise the ferals again in six months (which may be a problem after a while if the OP is a cat-lover)

TNR the adults and rehome the kittens, hopefully establishing a small colony of neutered ferals and that's it for her property for two to three years (the average lifespan of a feral cat with someone looking out for it).

But yes, in a perfect world, I agree that there would be no roaming cats impacting on Australian wildlife.