Which Breed To Choose

[kelpiekaye]

How do you stop your dog been bitten by a snake on a rural property? Unless you carry it everywhere and keep him, her inside, even then snakes can come inside. I think loosing your dog to a snake is mostly bad luck, not anyones fault. The other things are all to do with training and almost any breed if started as a pup can be trained to be good with all other animals. Get a Kelpie :D

What measures have you taken or will you take to ensure your next dog is not able to kill cats ? Chase the horses ? or be bitten by a snake

Depends on how your keep and maintain your property. You can also snake proof your kennels.

I live and work on a leased dairy farm with my Kelpie, Ruby. The property is not maintained by anyone, except me mowing the lawn when I have time, the house is on the edge of a river, there is no fencing to speak of. When Ruby is out working with me there is always the chance of her or me running into a snake in long grass, bush etc. Its all down to chance and it sometimes worries me sick if I let it. I often have her inside with me even though she is covered in cow dung and whatever other choice smells she picks up but at least I know she fairly safe inside. The house is a 100 years old and a lot of wild life can get in eg a bat the other night. I would imagine that a lot of people live in situations that they cant snake proof.

[poochmad]

Why did you delete your post poochmad?

thanks

Sorry, I deleted my post because I was going to add more information and then got side tracked.

Breeds that I would recommend for a 10 year old are breeds that she can handle, again, the Sheltie comes to mind purely from a temperament and size point of view, as well as a Beagle, lovely temperament (although can be stubborn and prone to wander, so maybe not the best choice for your property).

Regarding other people's comment about snakes, etc, I'm not going to lecture you about that as I'm sure you know what to do to prevent that from occuring and also don't wish for that to happen again.

If there was anything I've learnt (from our breeder) when I added another dog to our family was to match the temperament and excitement level so you don't end up with one dog being constantly harrassed, etc.

Oops. Just re-read your post that you won't be looking at getting another dog until you move back to NZ - so ignore the comment about the snakes and property (not sure what type of property you will be living on).

Considering you've had many breeds of dogs and have observed your daughter with them, perhaps look at it from that point of view, i.e. what you think she can handle?

Edited November 16, 2010 by poochmad

[sheree_e4]

OK I would probably go for a Cavalier for a childs pet :D

But if you were after a working breed I would get a Koolie

koolies are great all round dogs, happy to be with their family , you can get various lengths of coat and colours and they have an OFF switch.

I can recommend you breeders in your area if you are interested in meeting some.

CLICK for koolie info

[equerry]

To those that have given support and understanding I thankyou from the bottom of my heart, to the others, you are all entitled to your opinions , rehoming our dog has not been an easy decision, which is why it took us over a year of trying to manage the situation before the decision was made, twice I pulled out as I couldn't go through with it, whether its a feral or a domestic cat for me there is no difference and I don't believe for a minute a dog on the chase knows the difference, our burmese are completely house bound, no chance of them being chased and or killed. We have two remaining outside domestics, they have learnt not to run from the dogs, but still as a cat lover I am not prepared to let the ferals be killed by my dog either, my choice.

One of our domestics was killed by the second JRT, another roughed up by the Aussie, though I don't feel the need to justify my families decision to rehome as it is hard to cover all reasons on a forum, I hope in the long term it is the right thing for the dog in question.

Our Aussies are fantastic with our daughter, don't chase the horses, and although they bark at the snakes unlike the JRT's who feel they were put on this earth to defend all, the aussies bark and run backwards away from the snakes.

As I stated earlier I have owned many breeds, and all my dogs have died from old age or pts due to old age, the youngest any of my dogs have been when we have lost them is 11, my collie was 17 when he died in his sleep.

I am fairly capable of socialising my dogs and cats and until my Aussie was shown by the JRT how to chase and then kill, we lived in relative harmony, this year has been particulary bad for both ferals and snakes, nearly stood on one just on sunday, big awful brown.

We do have water outside the house yard, in several spots for the barn cats.

I know of several people in the area to have lost their JRT's from snakes, a neighbour lost one of hers last year and she was a 12 yr old dog, living in the country unless you do keep them locked up 24 x 7 it is almost impossible to keep them completely safe, we thought we had done enough to keep Eddie in, he dug his way out.

I will continue my research into different breeds, being a big dog person normally I don't know a lot about small - med sized dogs hence why I asked the question.

Thankyou for the suggestions so far, I plan on visiting some shows and talking to breeders about the various ones suggested.

[poodlefan]

In your situation, what ever you choose, either get a baby puppy to teach it about appropriate behaviour around cats OR get a dog that's already cat friendly.

[poodlefan]

Thinking about this, although not "small" a Smooth Collie might tick a lot of boxes for you. Add them to your show visiting list.

[JulesP]

When the barn cat was found dead it was strongly suggested that you keep the cats and the dogs apart. If it is not safe for the animals to be roaming free then don't do it. You have a yard. It is not like the Aussie killed your pet cat in your house.

You don't actually know that the JRT killed the other cat either.

I like cats. Feral cats are however a major problem. Have you had that last lot of kittens desexed yet?

[SpikesPuppy]

Thinking about this, although not "small" a Smooth Collie might tick a lot of boxes for you. Add them to your show visiting list.

Ours thinks the cat is a great squeaky toy! She harasses her more than my terriers do. Smoothies are only medium sized.

A Border Terrier may suit your daughter- they are popular as a 'kid's' show dog with families who have other large breeds. And readily available in New Zealand.

Most dogs regardless of breed will give chase to a cat in an open paddock IMO. Especially when there is more than 1 dog. But that doesn't mean people don't have dogs and cats safely and happily.

We have 3 Borders and 1 smooth collie. Plus an old indoor (outdoors under supervision in her own yard) kitty. The dogs will play with the cat and I've no doubt would kill her if they got excited enough (they are dogs, living in a pack) but we manage it- she has the laundry to herself (with a baby gate), but wanders the house with no issues or worry.

[Parkeyre]

Why are you saying the male Aussie was rehomed and that you only have your bitch aussie, then in another sentence you say you did have an aussie bitch?

...

[equerry]

Jules we do keep the dogs and cats apart,they don't ROAM FREE AS YOU PUT IT, but the dogs cannot be locked up forever they only get let out when we feed up and for months now the male dog (who is the one we rehomed) was never allowed out unless on a leash, but my 10 year old left the gate open a couple of weeks ago and when I was feeding I came back to find the male aussie with a feral kitten dead at his feet. And if you read my previous posts the other feral was killed when it came into the back yard.

And yes it was the JRT who killed my domestic, how dare you say that I didn't know, the dog was there out of the yard, with Daisy roughed up and dead, who else could it have been, the bitch never goes near the cats (sorry for the confusion with so much accusation flying around and me in tears earlier due to it, my typing may have got muddled.) And her breeder emailed me to tell me her dogs have killed 6 cats which is why she offered to take her back. The Aussies are not able to get out of the yard, the JRT well it managed to find new holes or create them.

Jules why are you being so awful? what have I done to you, and no the rest of the kittens are not desexed yet as they are not old enough, the animal welfare group emailed me today about that and hopefully in a couple of weeks the vet will have a spot available.

Feral cats would not be a problem if dam farmers and the likes desexed their dam cats, people are the problem not the cats.

[angelsun]

Jules we do keep the dogs and cats apart,they don't ROAM FREE AS YOU PUT IT, but the dogs cannot be locked up forever they only get let out when we feed up and for months now the male dog (who is the one we rehomed) was never allowed out unless on a leash, but my 10 year old left the gate open a couple of weeks ago and when I was feeding I came back to find the male aussie with a feral kitten dead at his feet. And if you read my previous posts the other feral was killed when it came into the back yard.

And yes it was the JRT who killed my domestic, how dare you say that I didn't know, the dog was there out of the yard, with Daisy roughed up and dead, who else could it have been, the bitch never goes near the cats (sorry for the confusion with so much accusation flying around and me in tears earlier due to it, my typing may have got muddled.) And her breeder emailed me to tell me her dogs have killed 6 cats which is why she offered to take her back. The Aussies are not able to get out of the yard, the JRT well it managed to find new holes or create them.

Jules why are you being so awful? what have I done to you, and no the rest of the kittens are not desexed yet as they are not old enough, the animal welfare group emailed me today about that and hopefully in a couple of weeks the vet will have a spot available.

Feral cats would not be a problem if dam farmers and the likes desexed their dam cats, people are the problem not the cats.

equerry: Ignore the ones that seem to feel they have a right to twist your situation against you, as well as those that haven't had to live with the threat of snakes nor know how to lower the risk...I state..LOWER....you can't remove it if you live in a rural area....Besides...these ones are usually the ones that have no other life and can't help but leap on top of a new poster and rip them to shreds when a simple question has come into play...it reckons back to that age old question about 'how many forum members does it take to change a light bulb'....

[SpikesPuppy]

With regard to snakes, you cannot remove the risk 100 percent, even in urban areas.

We used to live within walking distance to Melbourne CBD and a dog was bitten by a snake whilst out on a walk - on lead and on the FOOTPATH.

[equerry]

Why are you saying the male Aussie was rehomed and that you only have your bitch aussie, then in another sentence you say you did have an aussie bitch?

...

Just re read all of my posts and at no stage did I say that I 'had' a bitch, to set things straight, we got the two Aussies from the same breeder, brother and sister, we got the male dog first when he was 5 months old and the bitch a month later when she was 6 months old, the male aussie has been rehomed, the bitch is still with us, the male aussie never touched a cat till we got the second JRT who was from a family of cat killers un beknown to us at the time.

And Jules it was a year ago that I made that post on Eques, so we have managed the situation for a year not made rash decisions and just got rid of the dog, and thankyou for breaching privacy and bringing another topic from other forums on to this one, that is something I would never do, hope you are happy with yourself, I am really disappointed that you felt the need to do this, and for everyones info, most of the people on that thread at the time did not suggest we keep the dogs and cats separate (they are anyway always have been apart from when the dogs come in at night to sit with us, and then totally supervised), but most suggestions was to to put the dog down.

Re the Kittens that Jules P felt the need to bring up, we are currently trying to rehome 7 feral kittens, yes we rescued 7 feral kittens and no it was not one of these that our male Aussie killed it was one that we were unable to catch from another litter, and yes we are getting them all desexed prior to rehoming, just incase some wanted to have a go at me about that, one has been rehomed undesexed on the weekend, we have pre paid her desexing.

If anyone else feels the need to have a go at me, fine hope it makes your night and that you are happily patting yourself on the back for it.

As I have said (and I really don't know why I am bothering) rehoming our dog was NOT an easy decision, took over 12 months to commit to doing it, and would you have preferred that I put him down? For the last year we have been trying our best to manage the situation, and apart from one hiccup we have, but at the end of the day he is our dog and if we feel he is better of elsewhere our decision.

I notice that a lot of mature dogs are advertised on this site by reputable breeders, their only crime, they are no longer wanted for breeding purposes, do I have a problem with this? no the breeders are trying to do the best for the dogs.

I have always said that I offer a 'forever' home to my dogs and till this last year with the introduction of the JRT, that has been the case, I am upset and not sleeping thinking of my lovely boy in another home, this was and still is not an easy decision for us, please have some respect.

[poochmad]

equerry, I hope that the comments on here don't chase you away. The mere fact that you've come on here and told everyone your story takes bravery and you obviously care about your pets to want to protect them and do the right thing.

I'm sure in fact that there are a great many people (who won't come forward) and admit that they too have rehomed dogs or whatever, I know I have. When my husband was in the Navy we rehomed a GSD and after that 3 dogs when he took up a 'once in a lifetime job opportunity in Sydney...now he's no longer in the Navy nor in a job where he has to move to a major city and I've told him, never, ever are the dogs we have leaving us (except for when they move on to doggy heaven). Thankfully those days are behind us and each day we kiss and cuddle our furry kids and look upon them as our family.

Sorry for stealing your thread, I just wanted you to know that I understand and can empathise.

[Parkeyre]

Why are you saying the male Aussie was rehomed and that you only have your bitch aussie, then in another sentence you say you did have an aussie bitch?

...

Just re read all of my posts and at no stage did I say that I 'had' a bitch,

My apologies.

I read "The Aussie bitch was not interested in the cats, the dog was," and assumed because she wasn't interested, that you no longer had her.

Again, my apologies.

Edited November 16, 2010 by Parkeyre

[Earthdog]

I have Terriers and cats and have never had a drama with them. The JRT and the two Mini Foxies came here as adult dogs. They happily co-exist with our cats (and our chooks who wander the yard in daylight).

Snakes are a huge problem here. We had one curled around our hot water heater on our semi enclosed back verandah. It covered a fair bit of open ground to get there.

I rehomed a Border Collie whom I'd had since a pup. He was 2 years old and killed my 18 year old cat. They had previously lived together no dramas (with 2 other cats). I understand how you feel.

[Ons]

I'm sorry you had to rehome your dog

as for snakes, good luck to people who think they can keep them out. I have no idea how one would, yes you can minimise risks but as for keeping them out totally :D

another one to suggest a coolie ;) awesome dogs, so obedient and wanting to please. My coolie was about 2 years old before a cat came into our home and he and the cat are now best of friends I have added two other cats to my household, two he doesn't chase, one he does occassionally (yes I have posted a post tonight about thinking he scared her today) but a pup can be trained and coolies are so willing especially if they are not left unsupervised with the cat around.

[JulesP]

You have rehomed 2 dogs for IMO fairly dodgy reasons and haven't fixed the issue that got them rehomed, so no I don't think you should be getting more dogs.

What breach of privacy? Eques is an open forum. Talking about breaches of privacy I hope the breeder of the JRT doesn't read what you have written here. That they are a 'family of cat killers' has certainly not been written before on an open forum.

[Greytmate]

Tend to agree with not getting more dogs if you are still having feral cat problems.

Many dogs live with pet cats with no problems, but not many dogs wouldn't go after a feral kitten if they saw one in their yard. You could get a new dog and have the same problem happen again in a few months time.

I can understand being upset about the dead cat, but it isn't the dog's fault it is living in an environment that is heightening its prey or defence drive by the random animals coming on to your property.

Some people make a choice between keeping dogs and certain wildlife safe on their property, because the two cannot coexist in harmony. In your case you may have to choose between keeping dogs or providing a sanctuary for ferals.

Get a dog when you live in an environment that doesn't have feral or stray cats, if it is important to you that your dog gets along well with cats. :D

[equerry]

Jules I have not rehomed two dogs, the breeder of the JRT suggested she come home, I have not named the breeder, nor will I, I have the utmost respect for the breeder, she is one of the kindest people I have had the privilege of dealing with, in no way do I blame her, I have never come across such a feral cat problem before, am trying to do the best I can in the situation.

What do you suggest I do Jules, still have no idea why you are being so vicious.

I am glad it makes you all feel so good making me feel more miserable than I already am, I leaving this forum, thankyou to those that have been understanding, sadly I have to deal with the likes of Jules on other forums, wanna bet she alerts the JRT breeder....... hope that makes her feel she has done a good dead for the day.

I am bewildered at the viciousness on this thread, I am trying really trying to do the right thing by all, I love my dogs dearly, was I sad to see the JRT go, of course I was, she was my daughters dog, am I destraught over placing Dudley in a new home, well I guess Jules thinks I can miraculously get rid of all feral cats, shouldn't ever have dogs, even though my GSD died in my arms at 14yrs, my two boxers were in their teens, my collie was 17 when he died in his sleep, my cattle dogs were in their teens, sorry one was 11, my border collie kelpie was 12, and in all that time I always had cats as well, not one lost till the JRT, who then taught the male aussie.

But as I said, going now won't be back.

Thankyou for the suggestions, when the time is right and my research is done, we will welcome a new addition to the family.