Inflammatory Bowel Disease/colitis

[InspectorRex]

we lost our beloved Maggie, Aust Ch Colbeau Go Get Em Legal to inflammatory bowel disease that was diagnosed by endscope.

We tried all the prescription foods, alternative medicine but she just couldn't keep anything in and was rapidly declining so at age 7.5 after an internal bleed and severe diarrhoea with weight loss we gave our first Australian Champion her wings.

I still miss you Miss Maggie Moo.

I suffer from medically diagnosed( by biopsy) Inflammatory Bowel Disease myself and it is a freakin' nightmare to try and work out what will not upset it. I am allergic to Sulphurs so cannot take the Salazypyrin(sp?). I cannot tolerate Pork, Ham, Bacon, Eggs, Full Cream Diary products and many other foods.

There is a group for people called Chron's and Colitis Australia, handy to be a member of

[Erny]

Mandela's on the 6 week Hills Science Z/D trial at the moment, so I won't deviate away from that or this past 2 weeks will prove a waste of time. But I very much will keep in mind the sweet potato tip for afterwards.

[mita]

Mandela's on the 6 week Hills Science Z/D trial at the moment, so I won't deviate away from that or this past 2 weeks will prove a waste of time. But I very much will keep in mind the sweet potato tip for afterwards.

Erny, if Mandela's gone 2 weeks without a reaction, it sounds fine. Annie would've a bad response the night or day after a new kibble. Yep, ZD was one of those.

Wallabokkie, from August to early November I was frantic trying to sort Annie. Then the natural diet was sorted & gradually things changed.

Another thing the vets kept checking over that time, was her weight. Amazingly, her weight stayed pretty much around normal. It seems that in the really bad bowel conditions, the nutrients don't get thro' & there's alarming loss of weight.

IR, I'm sorry for your loss & that you, too, have to battle the condition. Early on the vet mentioned that Sala-whatever medication as a possibility, but Annie never got to that stage.

[westiemum]

Great to hear Annies doing well Mita. I know just how distressing it is to have a dog who usually eats well and then vomits her dinner and turns her nose up at her breaky! My good news is that Sarah is home from the vet and seems to have made a very rapid recovery.

Fascinating that US tibbie breeders are thinking along the same lines about kibble and Annie is doing well on the diet you have devised for her - and I see that its all human grade.

At the risk of being too pointed, I really think these commercial dry foods have a lot to answer for - no hydration in them and completely processed - and I really have no idea whats in them despite whats written on the pack. The other interesting thing that you do that I do too is know exactly what my dogs are eating - and to me that's the huge advantage of a human grade raw diet - I limit process foods in my own diet and eat as much fresh food as possible and I do the same for my beloved four-leggeds - why should they have any less?

And while I'm on a roll... I think tehse processed dog foods (kibble and canned) are for our convenience and not our dogs health - it only takes me 7 minutes at night to get my guys a decent fresh dinner and I think its time well invested - even if it takes a few minutes longer than opening a packet.

Rant over...

Well done Mita - will be very interested to hear how Annie gets on longer term - and yes sweet potato makes marvellous dog food! .

To the point of my post: I'm beginning to wonder about kibble generally being suitable for these dogs with tummies prone to upset - particularly as they get older and seem to get more sensitive tummies - even the so called specialist kibbles. I'm no vet but I'm beginning to think that they are somehow hard for these dogs to digest and somehow are part of the irritation process, quietly 'grinding away' over time (too fibrous?) until it suddenly goes clinical and you have the intestine/bowel symptoms. Then once they've gone clinical - it takes very little to get them to that point again - hence the rapid recurrence.

Westie, you have psychic powers. That's exactly what a couple of the really experienced US tibbie breeders told me. They think there are some tibs that don't do well on kibble, even the specialist kind. (When the vets tried Annie on Science Digestion & also Science Allergy & Royal Canin Allergy, the all triggered off a run of very sloppy poos).

A Canadian tibbie breeder gave me an example of a tib that suddenly got a run of bowel upsets like this. Returned to her breeder, who used a totally natural diet, the tib then did fine.

That's exactly what's happened with Annie. And it fits in with a tip dogmad gave me....sweet potato is good!

After trial & error, this is Annie's diet now. And the explosive stomach poos have stopped. Lovely topic for a Sunday 'arvo, but most days I can't tell Annie's poos from Nina Zena's (who's got no tummy troubles at all):

Basmati rice

Chicken breast fillet, cut a bit small, & v. lightly cooked.

Sweet potato!!!!!!! Cooked. When I'm short for time, I keep some jars of baby food....Heinz Golden Garden Vegetables (consists only of sweet potato & pumpkin).

Plain Farex baby cereal, mixed with a little water. 98% rice. Contains iron, Vit C & antioxidants.

Tuna in springwater & the juice

Egg, scrambled, made with water in the microwave

Dollop plain yoghurt

Good sprinkling of physillium fibre

Not all at once, of course, but these are the food choices across days. Soon I want to add back in some chicken necks for teeth exercise. Also a US tibbie breeder remarked that she didn't think there might be enough fat in the diet as it is now. I have to look into that, with the vet. May be just a case of leaving some fat on the chicken fillet.

Annie's doing brilliantly on this. For weeks, no meds needed. The vet said the pattern was that she reacted to processed foods & that's what kibble is.

Wallabokke, Annie used to have Advance Turkey & Rice. And until last August, she had no bowel upsets at all. Her breeder was able to check the depth & breadth of her lineage, and there was no sign of any rellies with bowel conditions like Inflammatory Bowel Disease (apparently there's some heredity involved).

Annie's problem started after I gave her a 'homemade' dog treat I bought at a pet food shop. It had a strange texture...like a small slab of sandpaper. First time ever, she threw up after eating it. Nina Zena had one, too, but had no problem. I threw the rest out.

From then on, even Annie's regular Advance kibble brought back to her diet, set her off. Likewise, the 3 specialist kibbles tried by the vet.

Blood tests, lab tests, scan, showed nothing.

After all this, the vets are scaling down the diagnosis to MAYBE just a Food Intolerance, that seems to have settled around processed food such as kibble. And maybe kicked off by that weird dog treat.

The other thing I've done, is to make sure Annie never has to 'hold' when she needs to go to the toot. Tibs are really clean little dogs. I make sure that day and night, she can get out easily & quickly if she needs to go to the toot.

[Erny]

At the risk of being too pointed, I really think these commercial dry foods have a lot to answer for - no hydration in them and completely processed - and I really have no idea whats in them despite whats written on the pack. The other interesting thing that you do that I do too is know exactly what my dogs are eating - and to me that's the huge advantage of a human grade raw diet - I limit process foods in my own diet and eat as much fresh food as possible and I do the same for my beloved four-leggeds - why should they have any less?

And while I'm on a roll... I think tehse processed dog foods (kibble and canned) are for our convenience and not our dogs health - it only takes me 7 minutes at night to get my guys a decent fresh dinner and I think its time well invested - even if it takes a few minutes longer than opening a packet.

Rant over...

It wouldn't have been that long ago that I would have been whole heartedly and unequivocally "hear hearing" you Westiemum, three cheers, dead right and all of that. I do definitely agree that a whole raw natural diet is the way to go as much as possible. But I must now say that having tried just about everything and having nothing work, I'm glad there is something I can fall back to. At least for the time being. Even if it is a commercial (albeit a science veterinary prescription) line.

[westiemum]

Hi Erny - I completely understand - I too have used the z/d as an elimination diet - but it was not long term. A bit of Maccas for a while never hurts anyone - its the long-term use (dare I say through laziness ) which distresses me... and some of the bones from the back yard are far from fresh!

At the risk of being too pointed, I really think these commercial dry foods have a lot to answer for - no hydration in them and completely processed - and I really have no idea whats in them despite whats written on the pack. The other interesting thing that you do that I do too is know exactly what my dogs are eating - and to me that's the huge advantage of a human grade raw diet - I limit process foods in my own diet and eat as much fresh food as possible and I do the same for my beloved four-leggeds - why should they have any less?

And while I'm on a roll... I think tehse processed dog foods (kibble and canned) are for our convenience and not our dogs health - it only takes me 7 minutes at night to get my guys a decent fresh dinner and I think its time well invested - even if it takes a few minutes longer than opening a packet.

Rant over...

It wouldn't have been that long ago that I would have been whole heartedly and unequivocally "hear hearing" you Westiemum, three cheers, dead right and all of that. I do definitely agree that a whole raw natural diet is the way to go as much as possible. But I must now say that having tried just about everything and having nothing work, I'm glad there is something I can fall back to. At least for the time being. Even if it is a commercial (albeit a science veterinary prescription) line.

[Staranais]

I think of the hydrolysed diets as less like Maccas, and more like a drug - like antibiotics, or steroids, or any other drug. In an ideal world you might not ideally want to feed your dog antibiotics, but if your dog is really ill and it will can cure him or just stop him being miserable, of course you're going to do it! Same with the z/d. I'm not going to feed z/d to my healthy dog (even if it wasn't so expensive), but if it was the only thing stopping her having nasty and ongoing GIT signs she'd be on it like a shot.

[westiemum]

Couldn't have said it better myself, Staranais. :D

I think of the hydrolysed diets as less like Maccas, and more like a drug - like antibiotics, or steroids, or any other drug. In an ideal world you might not ideally want to feed your dog antibiotics, but if your dog is really ill and it will can cure him or just stop him being miserable, of course you're going to do it! Same with the z/d. I'm not going to feed z/d to my healthy dog (even if it wasn't so expensive), but if it was the only thing stopping her having nasty and ongoing GIT signs she'd be on it like a shot.